[RD] Butlerian Jihad.

[Mouthwash]

It is becoming clear to me that having a productive or healthy life is not compatible with the use of technologies like computers, smartphones, cars, and the general overdesign of modern habitation.

I'm not just going to up and disappear one day. It'll probably be periodic visits and a slow transition towards, hopefully, zero use or close to it.

Here are my four main goals:

1. No phone. Since so much of the world now runs on the ability to instantly contact anyone at any time, this may restrict me from holding certain jobs or dating certain people. As a replacement, I would like some form of Whatsapp-style means of contact that (A) cannot be transported easily and therefore stays at home, and (B) cannot do anything beyond that single function. A virtual mailbox, essentially. Is there a way I could have this custom designed?

2. No computers. I have to give up gaming and the internet entirely. Fortunately, I could never stand ebooks, so I already have a stock of physical books on hand. I'll probably kick out movies as well, except on social occasions.

3. Local transportation. I want to have to walk places. Fortunately, there are plenty of religious communities that were built with Shabbat in mind - for those of you in the West, I don't know of any options beyond the Amish and some frozen polar towns. Maaaybe Barcelona, but I'm skeptical about any major city.

4. Being forced to exert myself. I don't want to have to deliberately exercise to stay in shape; sustainable exercise is best done through a daily routine that is structured around other goals (e.g. head-carrying in traditional cultures). I have no idea how to make this happen, but I do know that I'm not capable of running aimlessly for an hour every day, for years. Also think sports are incredibly boring.

Here are some other things I want to have:

5. Variable temperature. I think that maintaining a constant, comfortable temperature at all times weakens modern people and removes their ability to endure anything else. No real plan for how I'm going to overcome this. I live in the desert, so that may be an advantage.

6. Having a personal connection to my own food. My dietary beliefs have been the subject of controversy on here, so I'm not going to mention them - but I think the way I get food has a major effect on how I eat. I want to start a garden, buy food from traditional butcher shops and local farms, and eliminate restaurants entirely. There's no real game hunting or fishing where I am, unfortunately.

7. Figure out how I'll keep writing. I'm trying to create a web serial like Worm. I don't have any illusions about duplicating wildbow's success, but it would give me immediate feedback about my writing from an actual audience, give me writing experience without risk (of the sort involved in, say, sinking copious amounts of time into a novel), and finally give me a ready-made portfolio for any future publication attempt.

Even though I'll have to put it up on the internet, there's no excuse for writing the story on a computer. I need to redevelop my atrophied handwriting and learn how to do research offline, like, in libraries. There are significant drawbacks to handwriting, though: I have to type out everything once I'm done, have less of an ability to edit and tinker with the story (often I remove whole sections just the see how the story feels without them), and can't back it up as easily.

How wonderful it would be if I had access to a computer writing program, and only that program. Disable the computer from being able to use anything else...

Okay, done rambling. Please post advice, personal anecdotes, your own similar goals, whatever.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

It might have been helpful to mention what the Butlerian Jihad refers to. I'd guess that while some folks in OT have read Dune, not everyone has!

It sounds like your list of requirements would best be met by becoming a sandworm. You'd have access to your past ancestral memories for millennia, you wouldn't need to eat, you'd have servants to take messages to wherever you wanted them taken, and you could record your thoughts on ridulian crystals for your distant many-generations grand-niece to find (although she might have been taught that you were a Tyrant ).

Practically speaking, you could probably still find manual typewriters and rotary phones around. Some people collect and repair them.

 

[Mouthwash]

Mentioning that not everybody has read it in one breath and producing spoilers the next?

Practically speaking, you could probably still find manual typewriters

That doesn't really work for me. None of my reasons for rejecting handwriting are satisfied by typewriters.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Mentioning that not everybody has read it in one breath and producing spoilers the next?

I assume you'd like people to participate in this thread now, not months from now when they've had time to read Frank Herbert's books (and hopefully not getting sidetracked into the nuDune stuff)?

God Emperor of Dune is a tough slog, particularly if you haven't read the three books that come before it (some people actually try this, though I didn't). I figured I'd just save the non-Dune readers here some time.

That doesn't really work for me. None of my reasons for rejecting handwriting are satisfied by typewriters.

That's why I suggested becoming a sandworm. All Leto had to do was think, and his thoughts were recorded on ridulian crystals. After all, by that time he just had puny little flippers and wasn't able to type or write.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

Hey MW, for once I actually see you going directions and I think this idea is not bad at all. I can assure you that this'll probably increase your attention span and help with motivation and time management.

On 1.) and 2.) due to modding I have pretty much entirely stopped playing videogames and it has freed up an incredibly amount of time. One of the most positive lifestyle changes I've made recently.

On your point 3.) Local transporation is actually just a simple lifestyle change. I've gone almost 26 years without ever owning a car. I walk literally everywhere, for distances that are too long I use bus and train. that's it. imho, living a localized lifestyle makes one decidedly happier, whatever that entails! it has also allowed me to connect with my neighborhood in a meaningful way!

On your point 4.) that is actualyl what I was describing in my iron will thread, to the t. It's a change in mentality that is somewhat difficult to achieve. I hate exercising in order to stay fit, it makes me miserable. as I already stated in other threads I used to be fat, close to obese, and losing weight was a real struggle. but now, years later, something has clicked and nowadays I only exercise for the sake of it, and I love it. for this to work, you have to throw goal-oriented thinking out of the window, though, and I really mean it.

On 5.) I think that is some paleo pseudoscience bunk. But you know what is true? Staying inside, where the temperature often does not vary at all, will probably have those effects on you. So you are not that far off.

On 6.) This is really close to my approach to food. I can trace almost every vegetable, fruit, and piece of meat I eat back to its origins. I know all the people that sell them to me, most by name. I know some of the farmers that produce them, even. I talk to them on a daily basis. You've really figured something out and that makes me glad.

On 7.) That's really neat and a good idea to maintain your creative life imho.

All in all while I know we've had our difficulties I really have to put it down and say that I respect you for this. I would be the first person to tell you that making radical changes to your life is the only way to escape the hamster wheel, that strongest force in our life which is called habit. I think you have many of the right ideas and I sincerely hope putting them in practice will make things better for you. It's also really nice to see your enthusiasm. You're like a philosophical bloodhound, in the best way possible. You keep refining your ideas, and then (hopefully) putting them into practice with vigor. Too many people have become sedated, sedentary, silent. Even if I disagree with most of everything you say, I find it neat to have a vocal opposition. Best of luck to you, brother!

 

[Yeekim]

1) Decides to give up Internet.
2) Starts a thread about it on a gaming forum.

 

[sophie]

Really thought this was going to be about something totally different.

 

[El_Machinae]

Just use a library computer and use it for email only. Rent close to the library.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Really thought this was going to be about something totally different.

I've been planning a Dune thread in A&E, but before that I want to track down some of the previous discussions (they're all over the place, including the DuneFanatics social group that got zapped in the migration to XenForo).

 

[Timsup2nothin]

1) Decides to give up Internet.
2) Starts a thread about it on a gaming forum.

2) should probably be "pleads for affirmation in the form of being talked out of it by his forum peers," which makes

3) Gets upset when they instead tell him to go ahead and beat it, preferably sooner.

 

[sophie]

I've been planning a Dune thread in A&E, but before that I want to track down some of the previous discussions (they're all over the place, including the DuneFanatics social group that got zapped in the migration to XenForo).

As in: I thought this thread was going to be about Judith Butler

 

[Valka D'Ur]

As in: I thought this thread was going to be about Judith Butler

Who?

 

[onejayhawk]

I understand the principle of a retreat. However, I do not see the need to abandon technology. The myth of the noble savage is well debunked. Another cautionary note is Ted Kaczynski.

I think a better approach is to intentionally integrate times of separation into your routine. One example would be meditation, contemplation, or fishing. Another would be a physical workout such as running or cycling. Still another is a repetitive task such as sweeping, polishing, dusting, punching holes, sanding wood, etc. None of these involve a need for any form of hi-tech or difficult decision making. They give your mind time for processing other things.

J

 

[Arakhor]

Who?

She's a gay, Jewish, American scientist and philosopher, most notable for her work on gender studies.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

She's a gay, Jewish, American scientist and philosopher, most notable for her work on gender studies.

Where does the 'jihad' part come in, that would make someone think of her rather than the obvious reference to Jehanne Butler in Dune?

 

[Bugfatty300]

My bet is two months.

 

[Arakhor]

Where does the 'jihad' part come in, that would make someone think of her rather than the obvious reference to Jehanne Butler in Dune?

Search me. I just recognised who she is.

 

[Traitorfish]

3. Local transportation. I want to have to walk places. Fortunately, there are plenty of religious communities that were built with Shabbat in mind - for those of you in the West, I don't know of any options beyond the Amish and some frozen polar towns. Maaaybe Barcelona, but I'm skeptical about any major city.

The core of most European cities is pretty walkable, and even in the suburbs it's a question of distance more than actual possibility. I could walk pretty much anyway I'd ever need to be, and Glasgow isn't exactly a marvel of urban design. (I don't, because I'm lazy. But I could.) I think most older American cities are similar.

 

[Mouthwash]

On your point 3.) Local transporation is actually just a simple lifestyle change. I've gone almost 26 years without ever owning a car. I walk literally everywhere, for distances that are too long I use bus and train. that's it. imho, living a localized lifestyle makes one decidedly happier, whatever that entails! it has also allowed me to connect with my neighborhood in a meaningful way!

Where do you live, though?

On your point 4.) that is actualyl what I was describing in my iron will thread, to the t. It's a change in mentality that is somewhat difficult to achieve. I hate exercising in order to stay fit, it makes me miserable. as I already stated in other threads I used to be fat, close to obese, and losing weight was a real struggle. but now, years later, something has clicked and nowadays I only exercise for the sake of it, and I love it. for this to work, you have to throw goal-oriented thinking out of the window, though, and I really mean it.

I will check out that thread.

On 5.) I think that is some paleo pseudoscience bunk.

You mean the link?

The core of most European cities is pretty walkable, and even in the suburbs it's a question of distance more than actual possibility. I could walk pretty much anyway I'd ever need to be, and Glasgow isn't exactly a marvel of urban design. (I don't, because I'm lazy. But I could.) I think most older American cities are similar.

I never lived in a large city, but from what I saw of them they're basically just highway and parking lot.

 

[Traitorfish]

I never lived in a large city, but from what I saw of them they're basically just highway and parking lot.

If you live in Texas or Southern California, I guess, but most Western cities achieved their basic geography before private automobile ownership was widespread. They just packed a bunch of suburbs around the outside.