C2C - Civics Discussion Thread

[Vokarya]

Back in the Cyberpunk thread, I had an idea about a Corporate Warfare military civic, to represent when megacorporations got so powerful that their security forces became equivalent to government armies. I took that idea and decided to come up with a couple of military civics based around using mercenary troops instead of your own people (therefore, increased cost, but increased stability and decreased war weariness). These civics attempt trying to run your entire military on a mercenary/contract basis. Mercenary Army is medieval-era and reflects the condottieri. Contract Warfare is modern-era and is an attempt to model something like Blackwater on a nationwide basis. Good idea? Bad idea?

Mercenary Army (Military Civic)
Requires Guilds
Medium Upkeep
+1 gold per military unit cost
+1 gold from military buildings (like Barracks, Garrison, Archery Range, Siege Weapons Workshop, Gunsmith -- charge the mercenaries rent and supplies!)
+2 XP to new units
+10% espionage in all cities
-25% war weariness
+2 local and +2 national stability bonus per turn
Allows construction of Recruitment Center

Contract Warfare (Military Civic)
Requires Conglomerates
High Upkeep
+1 gold per military unit cost
+2 gold from military buildings
+25% income from corporations
+2 local and +2 national stability bonus per turn
-50% War Weariness
Allows construction of Recruitment Center

 

[Azurian]

Polygamist (society)
+15% Growth Rate
-4 Diplomatic Relations against civs with Christianity, Judaism, [add religions that preach monogamy) " Your culture of multiple wifes is against our morals"
+1 Happy to Brothels, [islam buildings, other religion that have multiple wifes religion]
+40% war weariness

Choose this civic to increase the growth of your cities at the expense of diplomatic relations with monogamous religions and increased war weariness.

 

[CIVPlayer8]

Hmm, although I think society does need new options, I'm not sure Polygamist would be the best option, as your options would be Marxist, Liberal, and Polygamy. Also, many people in the Old Testament had more than one wife, so maybe not Judaism?

 

[Azurian]

Hmm, although I think society does need new options, I'm not sure Polygamist would be the best option, as your options would be Marxist, Liberal, and Polygamy. Also, many people in the Old Testament had more than one wife, so maybe not Judaism?

I have no understanding in Religions, so somebody with more knowledge than me will come up with a better answer lol, but polygamy should be a society civic somehow. Polygamy should be in Classical or Medieval (not sure)

 

[Hydromancerx]

@MrAzure

I think things like Polygamy or other such cultural things should not be civics. For instance Cannibalism or Polygamy could be some sort of cultural building or something. I am not sure yet.

 

[Thunderbrd]

It's like the various laws... it'd be nice to have a selection tool to determine what you adopt and what you don't along those lines but it would equate to tons of various simple civic options. Perhaps that's the best way to go about it but perhaps we're reaching a point of consideration where we need a whole new game mechanic for these things... something similar to civics but is a simple yes/no option on a list of 'legality' decisions. This kind of setup is beyond me right now but I could see it being useful.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Thunderbrd

Yeah it would be nice to turn all my Ordinances into their own menu to check on or off and then it would give effects and then cost some tax.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

It's like the various laws... it'd be nice to have a selection tool to determine what you adopt and what you don't along those lines but it would equate to tons of various simple civic options. Perhaps that's the best way to go about it but perhaps we're reaching a point of consideration where we need a whole new game mechanic for these things... something similar to civics but is a simple yes/no option on a list of 'legality' decisions. This kind of setup is beyond me right now but I could see it being useful.

It would be very useful for "rules of warfare" also.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Now with the new civics being added I had a few questions ...

1. Whats the difference between Economy and Currency?

2. Whats the difference between Power, Government and Politics?

3. Are their combos you cannot have such as Barter + Gold Standard? or No Currency + Regulated?

I also wanted to bring up some old suggestions for new civics ...

- Meritocracy (Government)
- Plutocracy (Government)
- Oligarchy (?)

 

[bill2505]

Now with the new civics being added I had a few questions ...

1. Whats the difference between Economy and Currency?

2. Whats the difference between Power, Government and Politics?

3. Are their combos you cannot have such as Barter + Gold Standard? or No Currency + Regulated?

I also wanted to bring up some old suggestions for new civics ...

- Meritocracy (Government)
- Plutocracy (Government)
- Oligarchy (?)

1 economy is the economic system you use(free economy,planned economy). currency is with what currency your economy works

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

- Oligarchy (?)

Oligarchy turns out to be a combination of two civics in this system. I will check on the others and give details later.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Dancing Hoskuld

This is one complaint that SO gave when I added my civics, which was "Please have the civics listed in the order they appear on the tech tree." I agreed with him and changed it at the time. Could you do the same? For instance Clergy (Papacy) comes before Magistrates (Code of Laws). However Code of Laws comes a long time before Papacy. Thus Magistrates should come before Clergy. Please change.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@Dancing Hoskuld

This is one complaint that SO gave when I added my civics, which was "Please have the civics listed in the order they appear on the tech tree." I agreed with him and changed it at the time. Could you do the same? For instance Clergy (Papacy) comes before Magistrates (Code of Laws). However Code of Laws comes a long time before Papacy. Thus Magistrates should come before Clergy. Please change.

Thanks in advance!

Won't be me you will have to wait for CivPlayer8 to get back from holiday.

Also Prophets civic is on wrong tech.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Ah ok. As long as someone gets to it.

EDIT: also could Integrated Network Command civic get re-named to Digital Warfare? Not only is the tech being renamed but it would keep the text from falling off the civic menu. It currently is too wide to fit on the menu. Shortening the name to "Digital Warfare" would help solve this.

 

[GiuseppeIII]

When I opens my save game today I went from having a surplus at 100% science to losing 600+ gold per turn ( while at 100% science) I was wondering if this was from the new civics

 

[JosEPh_II]

When I opens my save game today I went from having a surplus at 100% science to losing 600+ gold per turn ( while at 100% science) I was wondering if this was from the new civics

You bettcha it is! You can recalc all you want to and it won't get better. I'd estimate from the amount of gold you're losing at 100% that you'll end up at about 10-25% to maybe break even.

Also depending upon how far along your game is, your Civic choices available maybe quite limited. And if you have not reached the tech Code of Laws yet, and therefore no Courthouses, it's gonna be tough to keep a positive gold/turn. And putting your best and biggest developed cities on producing Wealth (80% of hammers to gold) may only net you 60 - 90 gold out of a 25 pop city! That suxs!

And there is some strange AI stuff going on with the way the game switches your Specialists and worked tiles around constantly. I can have a -250gold/turn at 20% research but can actually gain 100 gold on the turn for the treasury. Some is from overflow. But then I have turns with the -250Gold/turn and Lose 350 on the turn. The AI is shifting worked tiles and Specialist way way too much. And I have not figured out a way to Lock them down. There is no AI "Lock" to stop the AI from switching these 2 areas willy nilly. I'd Love to have a button that would Lock the city screen AI from switching my worked tiles and from switching my Specialist. It gets very very tedious to have to constantly go in and reset what I want to only see the AI switch them all around as soon as I select my next build item.

The New Civics are Great at reducing your net income. Every Civic has a -%Gold maint. attached to it. And then it throws in on Civics that historically never had it. So expect much much more of a struggle with than ever before.

So are the New Civics better? Only time will tell. But I can say that so far they are tougher to balance. And old combos that gave a boost to your empire are now long gone.

JosEPh

 

[GiuseppeIII]

You bettcha it is! You can recalc all you want to and it won't get better. I'd estimate from the amount of gold you're losing at 100% that you'll end up at about 10-25% to maybe break even.

Also depending upon how far along your game is, your Civic choices available maybe quite limited. And if you have not reached the tech Code of Laws yet, and therefore no Courthouses, it's gonna be tough to keep a positive gold/turn. And putting your best and biggest developed cities on producing Wealth (80% of hammers to gold) may only net you 60 - 90 gold out of a 25 pop city! That suxs!

And there is some strange AI stuff going on with the way the game switches your Specialists and worked tiles around constantly. I can have a -250gold/turn at 20% research but can actually gain 100 gold on the turn for the treasury. Some is from overflow. But then I have turns with the -250Gold/turn and Lose 350 on the turn. The AI is shifting worked tiles and Specialist way way too much. And I have not figured out a way to Lock them down. There is no AI "Lock" to stop the AI from switching these 2 areas willy nilly. I'd Love to have a button that would Lock the city screen AI from switching my worked tiles and from switching my Specialist. It gets very very tedious to have to constantly go in and reset what I want to only see the AI switch them all around as soon as I select my next build item.

The New Civics are Great at reducing your net income. Every Civic has a -%Gold maint. attached to it. And then it throws in on Civics that historically never had it. So expect much much more of a struggle with than ever before.

So are the New Civics better? Only time will tell. But I can say that so far they are tougher to balance. And old combos that gave a boost to your empire are now long gone.

JosEPh

Now the question is should I start a new game or try to fix this one

 

[JosEPh_II]

Question back at you: How much Challenge do you want?

JosEPh

 

[Koshling]

And there is some strange AI stuff going on with the way the game switches your Specialists and worked tiles around constantly. I can have a -250gold/turn at 20% research but can actually gain 100 gold on the turn for the treasury. Some is from overflow. But then I have turns with the -250Gold/turn and Lose 350 on the turn. The AI is shifting worked tiles and Specialist way way too much. And I have not figured out a way to Lock them down. There is no AI "Lock" to stop the AI from switching these 2 areas willy nilly. I'd Love to have a button that would Lock the city screen AI from switching my worked tiles and from switching my Specialist. It gets very very tedious to have to constantly go in and reset what I want to only see the AI switch them all around as soon as I select my next build item.

I'm thinking maybe a BUG option to tell the game to never make automatic switches in worked tiles/specialists for the human player, except for their initial assignment as you get new ones (population to work a new tile that is, or a new specialist). That shopuld be pretty easy to do (a per city function and associated UI would be a fair bit harder). Would that go some way towards resolving the issue?

 

[GiuseppeIII]

Question back at you: How much Challenge do you want?

JosEPh

Well I think I'll take the challenge as big as it is and try to win the game

Got to play my games to the end ( unless I get bored with them)