Capto Iugulum
- Thread starter EQandcivfanatic
- Start date
OOC: That's the problem, Mr. Wallace isn't "the United States." Staying independent is definitely IC for him 
I don't blame GamezRule for hanging onto the logic of the military clique, this deal did kinda pull the rug out from under him when the ATA looked like a tantalizing NPC.
I don't blame GamezRule for hanging onto the logic of the military clique, this deal did kinda pull the rug out from under him when the ATA looked like a tantalizing NPC.
ChiefDesigner
Sunset Emperor
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2007
- Messages
- 761
Azale said:
So long as the Negro is denied the franchise and the free exercise of his basic rights, the "democracy" that the Republic plans is no such thing.
When will the Republic live up to its founding fathers--those who believed, and wrote, that all men are created equal?
-----
To: all American republics
From: Proletarist republics
We are, as we have always been, willing to talk peace.
Technically I said that Wallace could theoretically choose either course, one of self-agggrandizement or on to bring the USA totally back together.
Sicne I forgot it earlier: This is the 36 hour warning to get those orders in.
Shh.
To: Negro Proletarists
From: United States of America
We will continue to uphold and enforce the previous decision of the United States to abolish slavery in the nation once peace is returned. We also announce that the new constitution that will strengthen the democratic institutions in the United States, but in the form of a civil law system different from the 1787 constitution, which we continue to hold as a failure.
To: United American Republic
From: United States of America
We are awaiting your response to our offer of a three year ceasefire to allow for increased resources to be dedicated to our mutual struggle against Proletarism.
Shh.
To: Negro Proletarists
From: United States of America
We will continue to uphold and enforce the previous decision of the United States to abolish slavery in the nation once peace is returned. We also announce that the new constitution that will strengthen the democratic institutions in the United States, but in the form of a civil law system different from the 1787 constitution, which we continue to hold as a failure.
To: United American Republic
From: United States of America
We are awaiting your response to our offer of a three year ceasefire to allow for increased resources to be dedicated to our mutual struggle against Proletarism.
The diplomacy of the Wallaceites is apparently as addled as their leader's brains. The Negrotariat has committed acts of genocide against the Whites of this country and the ATA promises them concessions. In the next sentence they then promise their destruction.
The Second Union will accept the ceasefire and it will be enforced, so for whatever honor the Wallaceites retain they should see that this truce is not broken. Whatever quarrel we have with you, if our armies fight each other the Negrotariat grows stronger.
OOC: The fact that EQ doesn't see fit to block something doesn't mean that it's a reasonable or likely way to act. And moreover I severely doubt that you are acting out of IC motives here, or really considering your IC motives at all, and I don't think you did when you started playing (opportunistically) as Languedoc either. You are merely acting in the fashion you are acting out of almost completely pure OOC cupidity, irrespective of what EQ thinks, and irrespective of whether you can justify it in IC terms ex post facto.
OOC: Well, there are a number of reasons I stated that Wallace could choose either route. Since the option under attack is the decision to stay independent, here are the reason, ICly, I feel this is a justified course:
1. Wallace has viewed himself since the beginning, as the defender of a just and moral course for the American people. He views the liberal ideals of the old constitution as (ironically) unAmerican and firmly and unfalteringly believes in the justness of the military to remain the primary authority in American political systems. That is who he is as a person, and therefore, it is mroe than reasonable upon that alone to challenge the unification.
2. Wallace's base of support throughout the ATA is other likeminded warlords and generals. Note it is the "allied" territories. The majority of those behind him are leaders of former military districts throughout the West who would stand to lose substantially if the political system were changed as the UAR/Fed unification would require. They would risk losing all power, wealth, and influence they once had with their positions. It is more than reasonable to assume they would encourage Wallace to remain independent in order to preserve their own positions. The former states of the GLR are a significant exception and there's a reason they're the battleground for the UAR and ATA beyond mere geography.
3. Wallace has power. He could very well be the most powerful single individual in North America. Whether this is the case or not, power is a hard thing for many to give up.
1. Wallace has viewed himself since the beginning, as the defender of a just and moral course for the American people. He views the liberal ideals of the old constitution as (ironically) unAmerican and firmly and unfalteringly believes in the justness of the military to remain the primary authority in American political systems. That is who he is as a person, and therefore, it is mroe than reasonable upon that alone to challenge the unification.
2. Wallace's base of support throughout the ATA is other likeminded warlords and generals. Note it is the "allied" territories. The majority of those behind him are leaders of former military districts throughout the West who would stand to lose substantially if the political system were changed as the UAR/Fed unification would require. They would risk losing all power, wealth, and influence they once had with their positions. It is more than reasonable to assume they would encourage Wallace to remain independent in order to preserve their own positions. The former states of the GLR are a significant exception and there's a reason they're the battleground for the UAR and ATA beyond mere geography.
3. Wallace has power. He could very well be the most powerful single individual in North America. Whether this is the case or not, power is a hard thing for many to give up.
J.K. Stockholme
Right Opposition
OOC: Now occupying Occitania after approval from EQ
From Occitania
To Spain
CC the Confederation
We agree to disciplining our patrols and reducing general military activity directly along the border. Tensions can ease.
From Occitania
To Spain
CC the Confederation
We agree to disciplining our patrols and reducing general military activity directly along the border. Tensions can ease.
Blue Bacon 3
Prince
- Joined
- Jun 10, 2012
- Messages
- 401
To: Mississippi
From: Peru
As the Concord has not been requested to intervene in the bayou affairs it remains at the moment an outside concern whether the Florida government liberates its territory of New Barcelona. However... your recent offensive could be easily interpreted to invoke Statute #1 of the Pacific Concord, requiring the defense of all sworn members against internal seperatism. This is a warning and nothing else.
From: Peru
As the Concord has not been requested to intervene in the bayou affairs it remains at the moment an outside concern whether the Florida government liberates its territory of New Barcelona. However... your recent offensive could be easily interpreted to invoke Statute #1 of the Pacific Concord, requiring the defense of all sworn members against internal seperatism. This is a warning and nothing else.
IC:
To Occitania and Spain
From the Confederation
We are very glad to see that the problem seems to be capable of rectification.
OOC: J. K. Stockholme: you are closely allied to me, and we have an economic agreement gradually reducing tariffs with the eventual end of a customs union planned.
EQ, I don't dispute that; I do not, however, particularly believe that Gamez is considering the question along those lines in good, IC, faith, and I rather think he did the same thing with Languedoc.
To Occitania and Spain
From the Confederation
We are very glad to see that the problem seems to be capable of rectification.
OOC: J. K. Stockholme: you are closely allied to me, and we have an economic agreement gradually reducing tariffs with the eventual end of a customs union planned.
EQ, I don't dispute that; I do not, however, particularly believe that Gamez is considering the question along those lines in good, IC, faith, and I rather think he did the same thing with Languedoc.
Circuit
Writing Letters
OOC: Looks at the Treaty of Washington. Silently dies inside. Will be considering what course of action to take.
J.K. Stockholme
Right Opposition
I'll compose some simple orders this turn, but for any stories or politicking I'd like to ask what Occitania's history is. This is mostly directed at EQ, though I don't mind who answers.
When was Occitania first declared independent? by what means and from who? is there anything in particular I should note about the current monarchy? what is the internal political structure? (bicameral? unicameral? are there lower noble titles or just the royal family?)
Finally, what is the ethno-linguistic and religious makeup of Occitania, North Spain, and South/South East Franco-Burgundy?
AND how much of that can I fib around with, that is, how much 'isn't in recorded history' as it were?
When was Occitania first declared independent? by what means and from who? is there anything in particular I should note about the current monarchy? what is the internal political structure? (bicameral? unicameral? are there lower noble titles or just the royal family?)
Finally, what is the ethno-linguistic and religious makeup of Occitania, North Spain, and South/South East Franco-Burgundy?
AND how much of that can I fib around with, that is, how much 'isn't in recorded history' as it were?
Luckymoose
The World is Mine
TO: Peru
FROM: Brazil
Peruvian military vessels and men will not be allowed access into the Caribbean or Aztec Gulf.
@J.K. Stockholme: The following thread has pre-NES histories for Occitania and all other nations:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=456857
EDIT: This is also the 24 hour warning to get those orders in.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=456857
EDIT: This is also the 24 hour warning to get those orders in.
J.K. Stockholme
Right Opposition
Wonderful. Thank you.
Quisani
Gaming Person
Aggression towards a participating member of the Pacific Concord is grounds for the invocation of the defensive terms of the signing agreement. If Florida decides to invoke the terms of the Pacific Concord, Peru is more than capable of rendering assistance without tarnishing the waters of the Caribbean.
Circuit
Writing Letters
To: Pacific Concord
From: Florida
We request admission into the Pacific Concord (OOC: it was in my orders last turn, I believe), and we do request assistance liberating our territory from the Proletarist scum. They are an ever present threat to us.
From: Florida
We request admission into the Pacific Concord (OOC: it was in my orders last turn, I believe), and we do request assistance liberating our territory from the Proletarist scum. They are an ever present threat to us.
Similar threads
