[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

These conversations about the Huns make me kind of sad. I used to have hope that they might show up in civ 6, but the plethora of more popular civilization choices (as well as potential overlap with Scythia) have dampened my hopes. It's a shame too; Attila would have been epic in civ 6's art style.

To me the idea of the Huns in a game about city building is very hard to implement, which is why I think when they tried to implement it in Civ 5 it didn't really work out.
Scythia at least to me was more of a step in the right direction having at least a city list.

The only possible implementation of the Huns I see is if they decided to make them a playable barbarian faction and they wouldn't be able to found any new cities after their capital "Attila's Camp". Instead they would have to conquer them.

Anywho, while we're on the topic of future leaders and their personalities, what base animations do you guys think that theoretical new leaders would use (i.e. Kublai Khan, Le Loi, Trung sisters, Puduhepa, Maria I of Portugal, Dihya, Zenobia, etc.)?

I'd expect Kublai Khan to be based off of Qin considering Basil II already used Genghis animations.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I wonder if the temporary unit bonuses from the Pirates scenario could be applied to any civs.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

To me the idea of the Huns in a game about city building is very hard to implement, which is why I think when they tried to implement it in Civ 5 it didn't really work out.
Scythia at least to me was more of a step in the right direction having at least a city list.

The only possible implementation of the Huns I see is if they decided to make them a playable barbarian faction and they wouldn't be able to found any new cities after their capital "Attila's Camp". Instead they would have to conquer them.


I'd expect Kublai Khan to be based off of Qin considering Basil II already used Genghis animations.

i could imagine kublai using Musa’s animations

 

[Birch617]

Maybe some code from the Pirate Scenario could be reuse to make horde unit that works very similar to the pirate ships for a Hunnic civ

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

i could imagine kublai using Musa’s animations

He becomes the "jolly" Khan with that laugh.

 

[Zaarin]

I find it funny that three civilizations in the game can found different versions of Carthage. Phoenicia, obviously, but Spain can found Cartagena, which was Carthago Nova or "New Carthage" in Roman times. But also Gran Colombia can found Cartagena de Indias, which would be "New Carthage in the Indies": New New Cartage. I just think this is an interesting link between three civilizations in the game

Cartagena, Spain was founded by the Phoenicians, and Qart-ḥadast simply means "new city."

i could imagine kublai using Musa’s animations

No, because he'll inherit the creepy laugh. I don't need two leaders I denounce on meeting. Musa's laugh is easily the thing I hate most about Civ6: it sets my teeth on edge and makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I wonder if the temporary unit bonuses from the Pirates scenario could be applied to any civs.

Not sure but the Swashbuckler faction is what I expect Portugal to become, more or less.

Also I kind of wish the Privateer ability was available to the standard privateer or England's Sea Dog, instead of the random chance of capturing an enemy ship once defeated.

 

[almughavar]

To me the idea of the Huns in a game about city building is very hard to implement, which is why I think when they tried to implement it in Civ 5 it didn't really work out.
Scythia at least to me was more of a step in the right direction having at least a city list.

The only possible implementation of the Huns I see is if they decided to make them a playable barbarian faction and they wouldn't be able to found any new cities after their capital "Attila's Camp". Instead they would have to conquer them.

imo it's mostly about the reason of "giving other civilizations a chance" or something along that line. iirc each game of Civilization series is said to be developed with the principle of 3/3/3, means that the later installment would retain 33% of the core of the series, other 33% would be carried over from the previous installment, and last 33% would be stuffs unique to that installment.

So yeah, I think that also applies to the civilizations in the game. The recurring civs which appear in every installment are the like of Egyptian, Indian, Roman, American... - you got the idea, the 33% carrying over from previous installment (Civ 5) would be the like of Brazilian, Indonesian, Polish... and the last 33% would comprise of brand new civilizations.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Not sure but the Swashbuckler faction is what I expect Portugal to become, more or less.

Also I kind of wish the Privateer ability was available to the standard privateer or England's Sea Dog, instead of the random chance of capturing an enemy ship once defeated.

They don't have to apply to naval units. You could have a mounted unit that gets a movement bonus for X turns after defeating an enemy.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

So yeah, I think that also applies to the civilizations in the game. The recurring civs which appear in every installment are the like of Egyptian, Indian, Roman, American... - you got the idea, the 33% carrying over from previous installment (Civ 5) would be the like of Brazilian, Indonesian, Polish... and the last 33% would comprise of brand new civilizations.

True.
The markets of Brazil, Indonesia and Poland are big that I'm expecting them to become regulars, possibly Sweden as well unless they go for Kalmar Union Denmark.

On the other hand it seems likely that Austria and Hungary, Mali and Songhai, and Siam and Khmer are interchangeable for reasons I can understand, though hope in the future sometimes we can have both. Well maybe I could live without Songhai.

 

[Codeword Iroquois]

These conversations about the Huns make me kind of sad. I used to have hope that they might show up in civ 6, but the plethora of more popular civilization choices (as well as potential overlap with Scythia) have dampened my hopes. It's a shame too; Attila would have been epic in civ 6's art style.

Anywho, while we're on the topic of future leaders and their personalities, what base animations do you guys think that theoretical new leaders would use (i.e. Kublai Khan, Le Loi, Trung sisters, Puduhepa, Maria I of Portugal, Dihya, Zenobia, etc.)?

Zenobia could be based off of Dido, and Dihya on Gorgo.

 

[Xandinho]

On the other hand it seems likely that Austria and Hungary, Mali and Songhai, and Siam and Khmer are interchangeable for reasons I can understand, though hope in the future sometimes we can have both. Well maybe I could live without Songhai.

Of these, only Songhai and Mali cannot live together, but if I were to choose, I'd prefer to always have Mali with Mansa Musa and live without Songhai.
Khmer is another civ that I hope to have in every ediction. Although I like Siam a lot, I don't think Khmer may be replaced, even eventually. I think the two could live together sometimes.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Of these, only Songhai and Mali cannot live together, but if I were to choose, I'd prefer to always have Mali with Mansa Musa and live without Songhai.
Khmer is another civ that I hope to have in every ediction. Although I like Siam a lot, I don't think Khmer may be replaced, even eventually. I think the two could live together sometimes.

That's basically my sentiments as well. I would prefer to have at least Khmer every time though they could easily give us Siam or Burma based off of Early Modern or Industrial Era to not make SE Asia always Medieval.

As for Songhai they theoretically could have different spellings of the names of cities, such as they had Tombuctou instead of Timbuktu, maybe Djenne instead of Jenne, but I don't know if they could do that for all the cities.

 

[Birch617]

Humankind got Italians and Mexicans before civ

 

[8housesofelixir]

Humankind got Italians and Mexicans before civ

That's because civ don't use the category of "modern European culture" or "modern European nation-state" (remember, that's the unified Kingdom of Italy) and we already have Gran Colombia as the Spanish-speaking colonial civ.

 

[notNamed]

Humankind got Italians and Mexicans before civ

Well Civ's deal is taking a civ and making it span the whole length of human history. Which makes these two just so much more unlikely as candidates.
Humankind has a massive advantage in not doing any of that and placing all the cultures in the timelines they existed in. So there are no Romans eclipsing Italy and such. Whether Civ changes that or doubles down on it (remember stone age Lincoln?) is to be seen, but will be Civ 7's problem, I think.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Well Civ's deal is taking a civ and making it span the whole length of human history. Which makes these two just so much more unlikely as candidates.
Humankind has a massive advantage in not doing any of that and placing all the cultures in the timelines they existed in. So there are no Romans eclipsing Italy and such. Whether Civ changes that or doubles down on it (remember stone age Lincoln?) is to be seen, but will be Civ 7's problem, I think.

I wouldn't say it's unlikely, though it seems maybe not at least for Civ 6.

That being said Phoenicia over Carthage and Gaul got in so...

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Well Civ's deal is taking a civ and making it span the whole length of human history. Which makes these two just so much more unlikely as candidates.
Humankind has a massive advantage in not doing any of that and placing all the cultures in the timelines they existed in. So there are no Romans eclipsing Italy and such. Whether Civ changes that or doubles down on it (remember stone age Lincoln?) is to be seen, but will be Civ 7's problem, I think.

I confess one of my main focuses right now is trying to figure out which elements and mechanics of the proposed Humankind game and the current Civ VI game I like best, and then trying to figure out how those 'best elements' could be incorporated into the same game.
In this specific example, I love the tighter Focus of the Humankind Factions, but I really dislike the entire artificial Era concept in both games, and as a historian it's hard for me to get my head around the idea of, say, Mycenean Greeks morphing into Khmer and then Industrial Germans in the same game.
On the other hand, I could foresee a system combining some of the aspects of short-term Factions and game-long Civilizations. Perhaps a requirement to change Leaders at intervals, with a consequent change in Uniques and Bonuses, or a mechanism related to doing extremely well or extremely poorly that makes you change many aspects of your Faction/Civilization (comes the Revolution or After the Golden Age, Everything changes, or at least sort of).

Right now, in fact, the concern for many in these Threads as to which specific snippet of a Civ (one Leader, one set of Uniques) will be included in the Civ VI game pretty much leaves me cold: ALL of Civ's 'Civilizations' represent only a tiny fragment of the totality of the depicted Civs, except possibly Alexander's Macedon, which after all depicts a 'civ' that only existed for one man's lifetime. Any more substantial polity gets rendered down to a single set of aspects in the game, and the rest of the Civ left out. Especially now that Humankind is likely to be around for comparison, I suspect that changing that aspect will be one of, if not the, major New Thing in Civ VII.

 

[AsH2]

I confess one of my main focuses right now is trying to figure out which elements and mechanics of the proposed Humankind game and the current Civ VI game I like best, and then trying to figure out how those 'best elements' could be incorporated into the same game.
In this specific example, I love the tighter Focus of the Humankind Factions, but I really dislike the entire artificial Era concept in both games, and as a historian it's hard for me to get my head around the idea of, say, Mycenean Greeks morphing into Khmer and then Industrial Germans in the same game.
On the other hand, I could foresee a system combining some of the aspects of short-term Factions and game-long Civilizations. Perhaps a requirement to change Leaders at intervals, with a consequent change in Uniques and Bonuses, or a mechanism related to doing extremely well or extremely poorly that makes you change many aspects of your Faction/Civilization (comes the Revolution or After the Golden Age, Everything changes, or at least sort of).

If a (playable) civ would be about different factions relating to each other, it could be culturally dynamic depending on what level of power each faction are given in the government - "doing poorly" could open up for a lowranked faction to revolt for changes.

Right now, in fact, the concern for many in these Threads as to which specific snippet of a Civ (one Leader, one set of Uniques) will be included in the Civ VI game pretty much leaves me cold: ALL of Civ's 'Civilizations' represent only a tiny fragment of the totality of the depicted Civs, except possibly Alexander's Macedon, which after all depicts a 'civ' that only existed for one man's lifetime. Any more substantial polity gets rendered down to a single set of aspects in the game, and the rest of the Civ left out. Especially now that Humankind is likely to be around for comparison, I suspect that changing that aspect will be one of, if not the, major New Thing in Civ VII.

I'd wish, but dare not hope - though I do try to just enjoy Civ6 for the game it is, I still remember the disappointment over how stale the district concept turned out to be.

I share your feelings about the concerns in these threads.
To me, it seems like (the) most (vocal) care about just content and no context - "So what, this is a 4X game!? Just add whatever culture as civ and place buckets underneath to collect yields."
Fact is some cultures won't be included as (playable) civ, pretty much like they ain't merchandised as action figures or any playable form.
I'm not against any culture to be included. I'm actually for, but in right context - that is as relating factions your (culturally dynamic) civ may approach and include.
That said, I'd rather look at (playable) civs as compositions of atoms, while this thread's discussion is from an "earth, wind, water and fire" aspect.
In respect, I'll evolve my thoughts in Ideas for The Perfect 4X Historical Game.

 

[Zaarin]

an "earth, wind, water and fire" aspect.

Ah, so that's why we got a Captain Planet reference in the achievements.