D+2: "The wisdom of life consists in the elimination of non-essentials."

1) If we nuke spots, and don't step in afterwards, is the mess our responsibility?

2) Conversly -- if we get nuked is the mess our responsibility?

In other words, does the stigma of pollution link to the "ownership" of the spaces in question, to the 'causer of the skull' or to the human player just because?
 
Originally posted by Kev
Andu:

Great to hear that you've arrived in the lovely Pacific Northwest. Hope you'll be set up soon so you can tune back in with a few turns on this.

That almost sounds like an invitation to play. Now that the great "Seige of Chicago" is over ...

Originally posted by Old n Slow
1) If we nuke spots, and don't step in afterwards, is the mess our responsibility?

2) Conversly -- if we get nuked is the mess our responsibility?

In other words, does the stigma of pollution link to the "ownership" of the spaces in question, to the 'causer of the skull' or to the human player just because?

Couldn't say for sure, but from the programming angle, I'd the answer is yes to both questions; it would require a significant programming subroutine to keep human and AI pollution separate.
 
Originally posted by Old n Slow
1) If we nuke spots, and don't step in afterwards, is the mess our responsibility?

2) Conversly -- if we get nuked is the mess our responsibility?

In other words, does the stigma of pollution link to the "ownership" of the spaces in question, to the 'causer of the skull' or to the human player just because?

In which manner? Score wise or global warming wise?

FWIR, for 2.4.2, Score wise whichever pollution squares are within our city radi, hit our score at -10 points each. Global warming wise, all pollution goes towards that.
 
Hmmm -- this puts a crimp in the 'nuke but don't take' strategy. I guess we'll have to practice the 'clean as you go' set of tactics instead.:rolleyes:
 
Sorry it's taking so long... I have made some progress and played a couple turns. Why don't I post what I've managed to get done by the end of the week so you can play this weekend. By weekend do you want it by a particular time on friday evening? or just by sat?

(Of course this is assuming I still have power and cable after Isabel visits the region tomorrow)
 
Power and internet are finally back...

1871-1874 - I managed to get to three turns (although much of 1874 remains to be played.)

Here are some notes to get you going.

Many, many units sent up to russia on both fronts every turn. Some support sent to Viking front as well.

Most pollution is cleaned up except Denepropetrovsk and 2 skulls at maikop. (A couple skulls in our cities on squares without roads so the engineers couldn't get to them and still clean up in the same turn.)

Transport ships- We can send 2 full transports every turn to both the western and eastern fronts in russia (sending equal numbers of empty transports back for the next turn). -
(1)Genoa->Port Of Spain...Valencia->Greek Overlook (use 4 remaining moves to get transport back to Valencia)...Launch Point->Russian Tee
(2)Greek Shipping ->Still No Barbs...Cymru->Moscow's Nuke->Invade russia.

We also have transports that can go to Viking cities every turn.

Transports from feeder colonies - Kev's Peninsula/Issus can go 4 moves each way every turn.
Paw Paw ->Crete...Malta->Macao can go back and forth every other turn.
The cities on the mongol front have been mostly feeding their own cause, rather than supporting Russia although the Airport in Tim's Whale can get a desired freight (or other unit) up to Moscow

Two Russian cities taken and secured - Minsk and Krasnoyarsk. These may still be vulnerable from the sea and there appear to be a lot of Russian ships in that area still.

The 3 russian cities nearest to Russian Tee were emptied (they rebuild 1 defender each turn) - could take them at any time - probably this turn - just handle partisans, etc. Geographically they should be easy to defend as a unit. A few cities around the moscow side have also been emptied. It's about time to go nuking some of the cities farther out from Moscow.

The Russians just learned Labor union, so their defense will get stronger quickly.

Greek (Rhodes) front is mostly just holding its own against steady stream of greek units. It could use a few reinforcements and additional defense, but not much else unless an actual offensive is planned. More engineers are needed here.

The spanish front is slowly chipping away at resistance while most effort has been in russia. Cordoba (spanish capital) was emptied last turn and could be captured this turn.

The Vikings STOLE SPACE FLIGHT!!! so they have the ability to build Apollo and eventually launch a ship. Since we can not win by space ship we must stop all Apollo and space ship production!!!! Note they will likely trade that tech to someone soon, but haven't yet. Keep at least two vet spies in cities where we can be reached by the enemy spies.

The Viking front is under-manned. They sent something like 7 ATs and 4 Fanatics at the fort near Jarlshof. A mech and engineer were killed and the howitzer wounded. The vikes appear to have tons of units coming. There needs to be a much stronger presence just to hold ground. The tech was stolen from Jarrow, so does that mean they can’t steal from there any more? If so, move more spies to "defend" Foo Bar?

The mongol fronts - Naples is fairly secure and “Mongol Point” (formerly cunaxa) should be ok as well. I was building transports to move a pile of units to the forts closer to the next Mongol cities.

Blenheim palace is trying to hold it’s own, but is a frequent target of Spy raids. Upgrading artillery to howies to get the extra movement turn.

Airlifts are becoming more dangerous as other civs now have flight and could have fighters close enough to 'shoot down' the airlift. I took a chance and got a unit into Russian Tee, but it’s a risk now.

While I’ve played conservatively, dozens of enemy units have been killed each turn on all fronts. I've been using one turn of a howitzer to attack and then pulling back, but the units are slowly wearing down. some may need to be 'rested' soon. You may want to use both turns to attack in some cases but that leaves them unprotected.

We could easily go on a nuke fest in russia. They've been getting 2 techs per turn so it would probably be worth it to hit them hard soon. Captured cities also paid about 1500g in plunder as an added benefit.

There are about 15-20 howies, and half a dozen mechs near badlands (on the old zulu border) ready to be deployed to either the Viking front, Moscow-side or Russian Tee-side at your discretion.

There are lots of freights in Moscow and Russian Tee. The ones in Russian Tee don't match up with demand very well anymore, so Moscow might give better options. As we take more Russian cities, our options are even further reduced, so we may need to look elsewhere. We don't need the beakers anymore, but the cash is awesome - uranium and oil pay over 1000g in most cases - even from fairly small cities. However, to prevent space ships we might be better off to stop freight deliveries so we don't learn space ship techs that can be stolen.

I've been sending a few nuclear missiles out to sink clusters of ships at sea since nukes leave no pollution in the ocean.

SDI's have been built to cover Romanov island (tri-canal covers the two "overlooks"). i started to build them to cover the northern Zulu cities (See new city Nuke Trap 1), and put them in the russian cities. Invade Russia covers Krasnoyarsk and Minsk and eventually St. Petes. I also built them to cover our original core cities in smallvile and Xinjian. Coverage from russia still needed in northern zulu cities, roma, etc. If anyone else approaches Rocketry we should protect there as well.

Many, many units were rehomed to Tsingtao before being sent out. Once it builds its solar plant, it should immediately rush build a Manufacturing plant to support even more units.

Build more solar plants in large factory towns (kaifeng, Mpondo, etc) with pollution.
 
Great work - I now see that it would have been OK for me to nuke a few more cities :D.

Things are looking great in Russia and it seems we will soon be ready to capture about 10 cities in one turn (every city between Moscow and Russian Tee ?), effectively paralyzing the Russians. First we preferably need some units to cover the area around the cities to prevent partisans from appearing (maybe bribe a about 20 barbs ?).

Regarding the Vikings, I was seriously considering nuking them too when I was playing. They now seem to have a huge number of units so it would probably be a good idea to plant a few nuclear devices in the cities around Jarrow.

We should build Apollo ASAP to see exactly what the world looks like (Greece in particular).

We should defend Jarrow and Foo Bar with at least two veteran spies. The Vikings can steal again from Jarrow since they have espionage (IIRC) but it should be more difficult for them.

We should probably start attacking (eventually emptying as in Russia) neighboring cities from Blenheim Palace, this should also reduce the danger from spy raids.

We should get ourselves stealth ASAP and start churning out stealth fighters in Tsingtao (IIRC it needs an airport first and Mfg Plant).

The next several turns should be fun with lots of nuking, stealth fighter attacks and emptying of enemy cities.
 
I'll be away for a long weekend, so don't hurry anything on my account. :)

But I'm also looking forward to catching up on the great adventure upon my return... :D
 
Originally posted by Kev
Is Duke up next? I'm lost as far as order now.

Andu - are you around to take a few turns now?

I am indeed able to play a few turns, though with some embarassment for having disappeared for the last couple of months. ... though, at least my three-week stay in Colorado Springs proved to be most therapeutic after a notorious final two months in Chicago. However, if everyone can find it in their hearts to forgive me ...
 
Okay, I can play this weekend I guess. Shall I play three turns or five turns?

Quick look at the Diplo. Screen says that Vikings are only in contact with Greeks; and the Greeks may not have any techs to trade for Space Flight ...
 
Originally posted by Jayne
1862
<snip>
Vikings give Combustion to Spanish and get Atomic Theory in return.
<snip>
1865
<snip>
Vikings get Corporation from Greeks in exchange for Automobile and a peace treaty.

Here are some recent viking transactions, so don't assume they aren't talking. However I don't think they've had much direct contact with the russians. Not sure about the mongols.

No reason not to play 5 if you can. I only stopped at 3 because it had been 2-3 weeks and that was all I had played, so it was time to move on.
 
Just a quick update (since the S*** hit the fan again this weekend ...)

Finally finished the first turn, which was somewhat slow since I had to bring myself back up to speed. Executed good reconnaissance missions against the Mongols and Vikings; the Vikings have loads and loads of units in the field. Decisions, decisions. ... Sent most of our "reserves" against the Vikings in preparation for (hopefully) preventing them from getting Apollo finished; took out 61 military units on this first turn.

The Russians, however, are the bigger threat. If they can get nukes, we might as well accept that global warming will occur. I'm hoping that the six Russian cities I captured will prevent them from getting the nukes next turn; and with any luck, I should all pollution cleaned up by the following turn, giving us a clean bill of health as far tossing more nukes around.

Re: SDI ... I'm gambling that the best defense is a good offense. By 1876, I plan to have the skies over the Russian and Viking civilizations filled with veteran Stealth Fighters ... but this has meant rush building airports instead of SDI. Here's hoping it works.

Tim did an excellent job at denuding Russian military strength; should be able to take everything between Moscow and Russian Tee as soon as the Stealth Fighters become available.

Will continue to make progress. ...
 
Why do I have the feeling that after Andu and Duke finish that I will be left with a single civ and several smoking craters?
 
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