Fanatical Fans

[Arwon]

Because football is a hooligan sport. It is meant to satisfy the frustrated bloodlust of the public, and hence sometimes it is naturally followed by bloodletting.

So why are rugby and Australian Rules Football, far more violent sports, not prone to such fan violence?

 

[downtown]

I full intend on fighting the next person I see wearing an Orlando Magic jersey.

Unless that person is Dwight Howard.

 

[sourboy]

Go to a soccer game in Europe, and you'll see a "supporters" section, where nobody is sitting, everyone is chanting, waving giant flags, jumping up and down, etc., in some places even flares are lit. This sort of atmosphere just does not happen in North America - although it can possibly get close in College football. I mean, take a look at this.

Yes, we have a "supporters" section -- aka "student" section in college sports -- where people sing and chant all game long. Unfortunately the only video I could find on short notice is a short clip on the entire arena (hockey in this case, not even a major sport to some).

In pro sports, many will agree -- people are there because their company owns tickets and they think it'd be "fun". This basically means they have no idea whats happening, and talk on their cell phones all game. The real fans are in the "nosebleed" seats way up top, and split up a bit, thus no chats.

The example of this you used was an African fan. Would have been far more appropriate to include a story about actual European fans instead.

My bad if he was an African, but it doesn't change the fact that it happens all the time in Europe and that these were European teams.

I suppose I could link to the Football war:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Football_war

It's this sort of thing that makes Americans laugh at the rest of the world (and we don't get many opportunities). It's a game!

Maybe North American sports are too slow for that sort of tension to grip someone. There are set pieces of action, endless breaks and it all can take three hours.

You may have a point if the incidents occurred at the game... this was after. Celebration times are not paused in America for commercial breaks.

And trying to blame this on European football is silly. These are clubs with international renown.

Yeah, and I'm sure the rest of the world has never heard of the New York Yankees, Los Angeles Lakers, or Montreal Canadians. They all have their heated rivalries, but fans don't go killing each other on a pretty regular basis. (btw, your analogies are off)

 

[Dachs]

I full intend on fighting the next person I see wearing an Orlando Magic jersey.

Unless that person is Dwight Howard.

At least the Cavs pulled it out last night!

...and by the Cavs I mean LeBron.

 

[Brighteye]

You may have a point if the incidents occurred at the game... this was after. Celebration times are not paused in America for commercial breaks.

Yeah, and I'm sure the rest of the world has never heard of the New York Yankees, Los Angeles Lakers, or Montreal Canadians. They all have their heated rivalries, but fans don't go killing each other on a pretty regular basis. (btw, your analogies are off)

Celebrations might just vary in intensity depending on the intensity of emotion caused by the match, during the match.

I have heard of the Yankees and seen them play, but not the others. But how is my analogy off? I can just as easily say 'you're wrong', but that's not really a helpful contribution to the discussion.

 

[Zelig]

The general violence is mostly just Hooliganism, but that isn't confined to just Europe. You have tensions between football fans all over the world, domestic and internationally.

It may just be that some people are overly passionate about football since it's such a widely played sport in most parts of the world. So there's a lot of pride going into winning certain big cups such as the Champions League and especially the Euro Cup/World Cup.

About how Hooliganism occurs less in America... maybe being in a foreign country where you can't understand what the opposing team's fans are chanting at you creates more tension between those seeking for trouble, or when you suffer a heavy/humiliating defeat when you travelled abroad in hopes of seeing your team win.

Then there are simply just individuals that aren't really Hooligans but just a bit too overly passionate about the sport and happen to just snap and do something stupid. A good dose of mental instability is probably needed too. These guys can surely be found in any country.

I don't think "hooligan" has the same connotations in North America as in English speaking Europe.

I don't get anything other than the dictionary definition of it when someone uses the word:

–noun 1. a ruffian or hoodlum

 

[aelf]

So why are rugby and Australian Rules Football, far more violent sports, not prone to such fan violence?

I call suppressed desire. Harks back to when football was banned so that the English could practice archery.

 

[Arwon]

Did that really happen? I always assumed it was a myth.

 

[warpus]

Rofl! Nigerians, the new Europeans.

I remember reading that a Nigerian (or somewhere else in that western/north-western part of Africa) man hang himself after Chelsea got kicked out of the CL earlier this year.

That was an Arsenal fan.

So why are rugby and Australian Rules Football, far more violent sports, not prone to such fan violence?

1. they don't have such a global reach.. not by a long shot
2. rugby fans appear to approach fandom in the north American "let's sit back and enjoy the game" type of way - instead of in the European "we're gonna stand the entire game, dance, chant, and sing" fashion.

I'm not sure if I'm right or not about 2., so correct me if I'm wrong

Celebrations might just vary in intensity depending on the intensity of emotion caused by the match, during the match.

Yeah, that's what I've been trying to get across in my posts - The American "sit back and enjoy the game" mentality doesn't really create an emotional atmosphere comparable to what happens at European football matches. (or south american, or african, or whatever).

 

[Leonel]

We must ban sports as it holds humanity back from becoming rational and scientific!

 

[holy king]

It's this sort of thing that makes Americans laugh at the rest of the world (and we don't get many opportunities). It's a game!

Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, I am very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that.

 

[aelf]

It's this sort of thing that makes Americans laugh at the rest of the world (and we don't get many opportunities). It's a game!

Yeah, after they are done laughing at you.

 

[REDY]

Fanatical fans are only small part of fans. There are many movies which depict reasons, it should be some analogy of sects or gangs, feeling that you belong to somewhere (gang, family) and football si becoming religion for you. I have never heard that some fan here would kill himself or somebody because football, maybe its more common in South America. More common is mass psychology during match and gang psychology during alcoholic violence and fights.

 

[philippe]

Yeah, and I'm sure the rest of the world has never heard of the New York Yankees, Los Angeles Lakers, or Montreal Canadians. They all have their heated rivalries, but fans don't go killing each other on a pretty regular basis. (btw, your analogies are off)

who, who and who?

there aren't a lot of poeple here who care about the crappy sports the yankees play it's safe to say that teams like man u, chelsea, real madrid and barcelona are WAY more known.

and i think Aelf is just pissed, cause all asian countries get their asses kicked in a world cup. (except when a zerg horde is lled by a dutch guy)

 

[classical_hero]

Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, I am very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that.

Amen .

 

[holy king]

Amen .

and that from a manc fan.

 

[aelf]

and i think Aelf is just pissed, cause all asian countries get their asses kicked in a world cup. (except when a zerg horde is lled by a dutch guy)

OMG, you saw right through me!

 

[sourboy]

I can see the bottom line here is that Europeans have accepted that it's okay for their soccer/football fans to be fanatical and that killing is part of "the intensity of emotion caused by the match" -- even when they agree that in other sports, fans are supporters of a team/club in which they are cheering on to victory -- no different than how Americans view their sports.

I guess a "football match" is as close to a "battlefield" as it can get in some parts of the world, including Europe.

 

[sourboy]

Yeah, and I'm sure the rest of the world has never heard of the New York Yankees, Los Angeles Lakers, or Montreal Canadians.

who, who and who?

there aren't a lot of poeple here who care about the crappy sports the yankees play it's safe to say that teams like man u, chelsea, real madrid and barcelona are WAY more known.

On a purely voted site (who knows the true accuracy), the top voted teams are

1) New York Yankees - Baseball
2) Manchester United - Football
3) Dallas Cowboys - American Football
4) Los Angeles Lakers - Basketball
5) Montreal Canadiens - Hockey
6) New England Patriots - American Football
7) Green Bay Packers - American Football
8) Boston Red Sox - Baseball
9) Boston Celtics - Basketball
10) Real Madrid - Football

I would have guessed 9/10 of these teams... New England wouldn't be in my 10, Chelsea would.

 

[warpus]

That's a great top 10 list - too bad it's unscientific and meaningless.

Sure, the Yaknees might have world-wide recognition, you'd be hard pressed to find people who know who the packers, lakers, or patriots are, if you travelled through africa and asia, maybe even south america and europe.

Either way, it is starting to appear like you started this thread for a purely "omg look at the crazy soccer fans" and "american sports are better" reasons.