Feds Go After the Amish

[Arakhor]

'Raw milk' in this instance is not the same as breast milk, VRWC. The allegedly healthy effect of humans drinking cow antibodies has yet to be established.

 

[Bill3000]

I'm pretty disappointed that the FDA is now (... "“It is the FDA’s position that raw milk should never be consumed,”"...) opposed to the breastfeeding of newborns.

Hey FDA, get out of their business. kthxbai.

Hey, if they poison their babies, they're liable.

 

[Atlas14]

Complete waste of resources. There's a pretty specific and particular market for unpasteurized milk, and the consumers continue to consume it because, you know, they want it. Worst case scenario? A few people get diarrhea and have to miss their pastor's message about Corinthians 13: 4-7 that he's delivered for the 15th time in the past 2 years, a few people have to miss a day of work. I mean really, the Amish aren't out to intentionally deceive millions into consuming products that are unsafe.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Its similar to serving raw unfrozen fish (good kind of sushi) imo. Which iirc is illegal in us.

No it's not! Never been in a Japanese restaurant before? Even my local supermarket sells sushi.

Just break the law at your discretion. It doesn't sound like anyone is doing some serious time withthis stuff. It may be hypocritical for me to side with feds but its not without good reasoning imo.

Yeah. I'm usually the last to be for keeping adults from doing what they want to do.

But it seems pretty clear in this particular case that the CDC has very good reason to be opposed to it, and I completely trust their medical and scientific integrity in such matters.

The FDA not so much for just the opposite reason. They aren't nearly strict enough, although that is typically for political reasons and Republicans slashing their budget.

 

[emzie]

I've bought unpasteurized milk from Amish farmers in Pennsylvania!

 

[Zelig]

She first did what’s called cow sharing, which is when a group of people buy shares in owning a cow, and pay a farmer to board and milk the cow. But Maryland outlawed that practice

Hahah, what?

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

I mean really, the Amish aren't out to intentionally deceive millions into consuming products that are unsafe.

This is an important difference. However, I think there is also a difference between banning sawdust in bread by cheapskates (which did happen once upon a time!), banning the serving of uncooked pork, and banning the sale of unpasteurized milk. In the first case, you are restricting the use of an ingredient added in production which has been deemed hazardous or unwanted by the authorities, and which no one could know was there vs. not there before consumption. The second restricts the marketing of a product known to be harmful, but whose harmful properties are widely known to the general public (everyone knows to fully cook pork), but which is still dangerous enough to have been judged not worth the risk of someone accidentally ingesting it. The third is just like the second, except that the general public is not aware enough of its harmful properties to make an informed purchase in the market (thus making it "purely their own fault for its use).

 

[GoodGame]

i guess the amish do not have a strong lobby in DC?

LOL.



I actually agree with Formaldehyde on this one.

I'd only add that food that is publicly sold should be labeled, so you know what it is.

But according to Wikipedia, raw milk is generally legal
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raw_milk

 

[LucyDuke]

I always notice on restaurant menus, where they serve eggs or steaks or whatever, that they say "consuming raw or undercooked foods.. blah blah blah.. can be hazardous to your health". You want runny eggs, that's your business. The restaurant isn't liable. Slap the same tag on the milk jugs, maybe add something about how nobody's proven any actual health benefits but folks do get sick, and let 'em at it. People legally do crap way dumber than drinking raw cow milk.

 

[Masada]

The third is just like the second, except that the general public is not aware enough of its harmful properties to make an informed purchase in the market (thus making it "purely their own fault for its use).

Do you think signs would be sufficient notice?

 

[SerriaFox]

Guys I think your missing the point, why do we have these laws in the first place? Becuase milk was found to be unsafe. Now I agree that with small producers selling purely locally, no distribution we should "look the other way."

It's like vaccinations, most of us has never had the measles, so the one in thousand side effect looks bad, however since none of us have seen the actually disease we have forgotten as a society that the "side effect" are 1 in 100 if you get the disease naturally.

 

[BuckeyeJim]

I always notice on restaurant menus, where they serve eggs or steaks or whatever, that they say "consuming raw or undercooked foods.. blah blah blah.. can be hazardous to your health". You want runny eggs, that's your business. The restaurant isn't liable. Slap the same tag on the milk jugs, maybe add something about how nobody's proven any actual health benefits but folks do get sick, and let 'em at it. People legally do crap way dumber than drinking raw cow milk.

Great post!

 

[Arakhor]

Raw milk may not be particularly safe, but it beats makes sausages with rotten meat with Borax and red paint dye to disguise the texture and smell!

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Do you think signs would be sufficient notice?

Probably. But then the nature changes only slightly, from being the barring of the goods in question to restricting the conditions under which it can be sold, again, to protect others from their ignorance.

 

[innonimatu]

Guys I think your missing the point, why do we have these laws in the first place? Becuase milk was found to be unsafe. Now I agree that with small producers selling purely locally, no distribution we should "look the other way."

It's like vaccinations, most of us has never had the measles, so the one in thousand side effect looks bad, however since none of us have seen the actually disease we have forgotten as a society that the "side effect" are 1 in 100 if you get the disease naturally.

In the case of vaccination it could be shown that widespread immunization had a social benefit, as it reduced disease vectors for these very deadly diseases. Part of the goal of vaccination programs was to eradicate some diseases altogether, a great social benefit if achieved - and then weapons labs in the USA (with the CDC serving as a cover) and Russia were allowed to keep the viruses . Even so no country mandates vaccination for common flu or other generally non-lethal diseases - people are left to exercise their own judgment.

In the case of raw milk the danger is to each person individually, and I doubt that the overall risk is greater that the ones from flu. Even the bureaucracy-happy European Union didn't try to ban it yet!

 

[jtb1127]

People should be aware of the potential dangers of non-pasteurized milk, yet they should be allowed to drink it if they want.

 

[Ajidica]

People should be aware of the potential dangers of non-pasteurized milk, yet they should be allowed to drink it if they want.

Would your response be the same if the courts found the farmer selling the non-pasteurized milk was guilty of negligence with regards to sanitary conditions?

 

[NetGear]

No it's not! Never been in a Japanese restaurant before? Even my local supermarket sells sushi.

Sushi itself ofc is not illegal. IIRC though, its illegal to sell raw fish that hasnt been frozen before in the US (or maybe its just ny i am not quite sure). freezing the meat really degrades the quality of sushi, but AFAIK its the law and most restuarants comply with the law, unless you know some chefs well and he is hooking you up with some not so legal stuff.

its for the same reason. kill parasite, sanitation etc etc.

 

[Rashiminos]

Milk can be problematic even after it has been pasteurized, and I'm not sure why people would feel particularly comfortable eating something that has not been treated for pathogens/toxins/etc.

 

[Lillefix]

Milk can be problematic even after it has been pasteurized, and I'm not sure why people would feel particularly comfortable eating something that has not been treated for pathogens/toxins/etc.

Because it's more natural i.e. better for you.