Feds vs Farmer

[Narz]

To me this is such low hanging fruit for the Democratic Party and instead makes enemies where there should be allies. Losing hippies to the Republicans is an unforced error.

Democrats be doing this erraday.

Weed in its natural state is not imo a Risk. This farmer was producing something that I feel is dangerous, yet can be made not so.

Doesn't matter how you feel. Weed has risks (not much) as does raw milk (also not much). If the consumer is informed it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

You never bought anything off a black market?

I have plenty of times. I accepted the potential risk/harm in doing so. I still think the government's job is to try and manage it, to protect the vulnerable.

Doesn't matter how you feel. Weed has risks (not much) as does raw milk (also not much). If the consumer is informed it shouldn't be a problem.

Isn't this thread for stating how we feel?

The law is pretty clear, what else is there to discuss?

 

[Hygro]

What issue am I dodging?

But you didn't answer the next question which clarified it all, in the post to which your question responds.

Yeah but if weed were legal I would be fine with the government enforcing weed safety regulations. Moldy/laced weed ain't it

Don't we then need some way to prove that people want legal weed and have enough illegal supply to enact the will to act, to change the law, for whose war against it we oppose? It would be the same for food products. An organization, similar to the DEA, somewhat ruled by bureaucratic fiat, where promotion comes from being a successful regulator (aka being against a subset you are regulating). I have done my homework on raw milk and it runs the gamut. This farmer is sketchy, (there was an outbreak, he has too many products, sells very far) but many times it is not sketchy and the regulators are straight tyrannical. For illegal food products, I don't see much categorical difference between that and the drug war.

A private club exists within society. It can't exist without society.

Also, disagree on this point semantically. A society with a regulated economy and property laws turns a free assocation into a private club, but that's an imposed branding on a thing that can exist without a conforming society at large. You do not need the society for private clubs to form, society only names them private clubs once society has arrived.

 

[Narz]

I have plenty of times. I accepted the potential risk/harm in doing so. I still think the government's job is to try and manage it, to protect the vulnerable.

So your actions are not in line w your values.

The law is pretty clear, what else is there to discuss?

Laws can change. Whether consumers should be able to make choices about what they buy that don't mesh perfectly w what authorities deem best practices.

I mean it's legal to give a 6 year old speed if he doesn't sit still but not raw milk?

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

I mean it's legal to give a 6 year old speed if he doesn't sit still but not raw milk?

Eh waht? Are you trying to equate medicine distributed by a doctor as selling unpasteurised milk?

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

So your actions are not in line w your values.

Let he cast the first stone who is free from this sin.

I'm not against ingesting substances potentially harmful to myself. Yet I don't think I, or anyone else, should be distributing them without government oversight

 

[Farm Boy]

Well, it is speed, even if we've decided that society has made the appropriate considerations and accreditations. The milk, probably, will add calcium to their bones. The speed, probably, will make them focus more normatively in school.

 

[Narz]

Eh waht? Are you trying to equate medicine distributed by a doctor as selling unpasteurised milk?

Not equate. Obviously amphetamines cause much more harm than raw milk ever will.

Just because something is distributed by doctors doesn't mean its healthy or good that's just appeal to authority.

Many opiates that have contributed to tens of thousands of deaths are legal as is alcohol where weed is still federally illegal.

Let's not pretend most of these public health laws exist for reasons other than inertia and to save on workload for regulators.

 

[Narz]

I'm not against ingesting substances potentially harmful to myself. Yet I don't think I, or anyone else, should be distributing them without government oversight

You don't think people should do that but you reward them financially for doing that...

So if you're doing it why cast judgement on people who want raw milk?

I don't want raw milk but in terms of getting ones fix of weird, potentially harmful stuff I'd say raw milk isn't high on the list

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

I am not casting judgement on those who want. I am casting it on those who distribute.

 

[Narz]

I am not casting judgement on those who want. I am casting it on those who distribute.

That doesn't make much sense. At least assuming said product is non-addictive

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

That doesn't make much sense. At least assuming said product is non-addictive

It is dangerous though.

 

[Farm Boy]

It’s only a hunch, but I think you want it large enough that it can be a fully rewarded total business obsession of the owners. I imagine that to be the optimal position.

Thought about this more. I don't. I want this to be a sideline. The scale of selling of raw milk, even at a premium mark-up, that would be necessary to produce a profit margin that can support a family and farm operation is bigger than I want the scale. I think it needs more than the 50 I mentioned earlier.

 

[Narz]

Raw milk? Can be potentially dangerous I suppose. Like raw eggs, yet I still eat raw cookie dough & not gonna blame the government for not protecting me if I do get sick.

I'd bet people who buy these 'weird' speciality foods live longer than more typical food consumers.

If we're gonna ban unhealthy things how about getting fast food out of schools & hospitals?

 

[Hygro]

Yeah but then I can’t get it at the store and I am sad

x-post

 

[Farm Boy]

Yeah, and milk deliveries or personal pickup increase the price per unit bought by a lot.

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

Raw milk? Can be potentially dangerous I suppose. Like raw eggs, yet I still eat raw cookie dough & not gonna blame the government for not protecting me if I do get sick.

I'd bet people who buy these 'weird' speciality foods live longer than more typical food consumers.

If we're gonna ban unhealthy things how about getting fast food out of schools & hospitals?

Unhealthy is not the same as dangerous.

I would support restricting unhealthy foods in schools and hospitals, but this is not the issue here.

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

Yeah but then I can’t get it at the store and I am sad

x-post

If its sold in a store it should be held to a expected standard.

 

[Aiken_Drumn]

I guess this is a very Brit vs American debate.


Mu Freedom vs. The Joy's of Queuing

 

[Narz]

Unhealthy is not the same as dangerous.

Right. Unhealthy is like kids not going to the playground or playing outside. Risk of fatal injury drops from 3 per 100,000 to 1 per 100,00 and risk of childhood obesity and early death goes from 10000 per 100k to 30000 per 100k.

If its sold in a store it should be held to a expected standard.

What is the 'expected standard'?