Feminism

[Traitorfish]

If you're expecting tenured academics to provide any sort of meaningful leadership, no wonder you're pessimistic!

 

[Farm Boy]

Ok, I just snorted my beer through my nose. I think I declare TF winner for the night.

 

[Narz]

Feminists hate Kristin Dunst

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-gr...e-praising-valuable-role-women-nurturers-home

 

[caketastydelish]

Based on her apparent comment, sounds like she wants to take women back 100 years.

 

[Tahuti]

Based on her apparent comment, sounds like she wants to take women back 100 years.

If women choose for it, I don't see why it should be a problem. Same as when women would choose careers.

 

[caketastydelish]

Bingo. I hate sweeping overgenerealizations like "all men should do this, all women should do that". Each individual person to their own.

 

[Shaihulud]

I applaud the idea in spirit, I am all for equality of pay for both sexes. I have been in societies that demeans women and are discriminatory towards them. I personally am prejudicial towards women because of my experience. Women seems to perform poorly under stress and makes poor managers.

 

[ParkCungHee]

I notice how Quackers assumes in the OP here that we have no society except that which is dictated to us by the state. I find that unreasonable and unpleasant for many reasons, and I'm surprised more people haven't complained about, but it's especially odd coming from Quackers.

Given his previous stance on the importance of culture, his pessimism of state power to dictate terms of social agreement, and his often cataclysmic view of social conflict, it's very odd to suddenly hear that these forces, being outside the purview of the state, simply do not exist. You'd think that Quackers would want to take this new optimism and apply it elsewhere. Poverty? Outlawed. Religious conflict? No longer recognized. Problems with integration with the EU? Not recognized by London, therefor, they don't exist.

So many problems, no longer problems. Why isn't Quackers happy about this?

 

[Ironsided]

Feminists hate Kristin Dunst

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-gr...e-praising-valuable-role-women-nurturers-home

You are supposed to be the one reading all the books and you link us this crap? Disappointing to say the least. And yes there are extreme and even as the story suggests nasty feminists but they really are the exception.

 

[Rashiminos]

What if a man is groped against his will? What about someone who is transgender? Exactly what level of touching is enough to be "groping"? How would anyone ever "maker a move," as the youths say, if there's a chance they could be executed for it? Are you saying two (or more) parties should sign a legal contract before doing anything remotely sexual, as in that Chappelle Show skit? To clear any confusion?

That sounds like a passable idea in the current environment.

So why do we need it?
The equality of sexes is a value held across the Western world. It is enshrined in law. Women now have the choice to do whatever they wish. What else can we possibly do?

Unisex clothing, everywhere.

At least here I've got more freedom. Additionally, there are plenty of male feminists here (i expect).

or perhaps feminist allies.*

 

[Manfred Belheim]

But this shouldn't be the case. There needn't be a binary opposition.

I agree wholeheartedly. But look at how this thread has developed (in some cases at least). It just always happens and I think the term "feminism" itself is partly to blame for this. You can't have a movement or an ideology that is all about equality for all, but have it named after only one gender, have it overwhelmingly concerned with the issues affecting only that gender, and insist that you can't even talk about it without a member of that gender present. Merely framing the whole debate in those terms generates antagonism and opposition, whether it's deserved or not.

 

[Zack]

Bingo. I hate sweeping overgenerealizations like "all men should do this, all women should do that". Each individual person to their own.

What if a woman likes to be groped?

 

[metatron]

That isn't actually true.

http://www.cdc.gov/ViolencePrevention/pdf/NISVS_Report2010-a.pdf

Two more things: one, some in the thread have pointed out that "well men and women are different, men are bigger, men don't have babies," etc. etc. In justification, I am assuming, for some of the perceived inequities of the sexes in society. One of the biggest problems with domestic violence against men, however, is the shame and stigma attached to a man being the "victim" of physical assault by a woman, since it is generally accepted that men should be able to defend themselves and be "manly" about it. So to me if you want to recognize one of the biggest problems in dealing with violence against men in domestic situations you have to implicitly recognize that assumptions about traditional male and female roles, or a sort of "biological determinism", may impede the social policies needed to ameliorate these problems.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3175099/table/T3/
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3175099/table/T4/

 

[Gary Childress]

EDIT: deleted. Sorry, stupid comment.

 

[classical_hero]

Classical Hero's a Calvinist, you see, so he prefers the formula "white men bad, everyone else also bad".

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned; and come short of the glory of God." That is correct that everyone is bad.

Those who don't learn from history are destined to repeat it. The thing you can see in modern Western society is that we have learnt from history and under the eyes of the law women have the same protections afford to men. Does that mean that al men treat women rightfully? No, but it means that when a man does mistreat a woman when he is caught he is liable to be punished or breaking those protections. But the thing is that you are viewing the whole issue as if things are still bad for women in the West, but thing are very good for women and now modern feminists are just basically man haters.

 

[Zack]

But the thing is that you are viewing the whole issue as if things are still bad for women in the West, but thing are very good for women and now modern feminists are just basically man haters.

The thing is that you pretend everything is equal, but it's not. And anyone who points out that inequality is a "man hater," especially of Caucasian men for some weird, unexplained reason (persecution complex?).

 

[useless]

"But thing are very good for women and now modern feminists are just basically man haters" - A man

Look at the amount of female politicians in Britain, America etc. Look at the war waged against reproductive rights for females. Look at the pay-gap for women doing the same job as men.

Not even getting in to the victim blaming that seems institutional when it comes to females being the victims of rape, molestation etc.

 

[classical_hero]

Look at the amount of female politicians in Britain, America etc.

What if most women don't want to be in politics? You have to prove that there is a system that actively goes against women. If there was a case, then female voters must be pretty stupid since they vote in so many men as politicians, since in most societies women have a slight population advantage over men, yet they continue to vote more men in than women, so it looks like it has nothing to do with women being unelectable but that politics is a brutal game that most people don't wan to be part of.

Look at the war waged against reproductive rights for females.

What about the right to life? Obviously you seem to think that "reproduction rights" can violation the universal declaration of Human rights

Look at the pay-gap for women doing the same job as men.

Teh overall figure might show that overall women get paid less, but that is because women do different jobs, work less hours. If a comparison of men and women doing the same job and same education and seniority, you will find that they are getting the same pay Even the White house has a pay gap overall. Doh! Even the White House has a gender-pay gap Do you watch male sports? If so, do you also watch female sports?

Just read this to see how it is really a political game being played by the Democrats. How the White House and Democrats stepped on their own equal pay message

Not even getting in to the victim blaming that seems institutional when it comes to females being the victims of rape, molestation etc.[/QUOTE]If that were the case then there would be no cases of the rapist ever going to jail. There might be some blaming of the victim, but it is not society and most certainly we have laws against rape, that I believe are not strict enough regarding punishment.

But here is what we are seeing from feminists nowadays.
http://femmenistthought.tumblr.com/post/62524711771/i-have-99-problems-and-the-white-supremacist-cis

 

[caketastydelish]

What if a woman likes to be groped?

Then she can ask for it (as in, actually ask for it).

 

[Hygro]

But here is what we are seeing from feminists nowadays.
http://femmenistthought.tumblr.com/post/62524711771/i-have-99-problems-and-the-white-supremacist-cis

What's the problem with her shirt?