[FfH II Art Team Blog]

[Fenboy]

A couple of random thoughts:

Firstly, I've been thinking about the Mercurians, and how the Seraph and Valkyrie are female units. This implies their melee line (the Axeman & Champion, as the mercs can't train warriors) would be female units. Perhaps war widows, or warrior nuns, kind of like Mordheim's Sisters of Sigmar.

The second thought is that the Balseraph Beastmaster just has to be a lion tamer The one that comes to mind is Cassandra, from the Urban Rivals game.

Though the Balseraph Beastmaster should be male, the first picture is the sort of costume I'm thinking of.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Technically (according to the lore, but obviously not the in game mechanics) Seraphim and Valkyries are both True Angels; they were created in their current form, not processed from the souls of mortals. Their gender thus has no bearing on the gender of the mortals serving with the Mercurians nor on the lesser angels that these mortals may become. I cannot recall a single mention of any woman serving under Basium, and I certainly don't think their melee line would be predominantly female or should use female graphics.

(The Seraphim are the minority of Bhall's angels who, like Brigit, refused to fall with her.Those that did fall then are now Balors. Unlike Brigit, they lacked the courage to stay and fight their goddess, abandoning her in her time of greatest need. Most good gods do not trust the Seraphim and so shun them; many who originally stood against their goddess later changed their mind and joined Agares, becoming very powerful demons. Junil accepted a few individual Seraphim into his service (perhaps those with whom he or his angels were already familiar from the time when Bhall was his closest ally; in the Age of Magic Junil did not have a major religion of his own but was revered by many of Bhall's followers, and even had shrines within her many of her temples), but only Lugus accepted them en masse. Those who joined Basium were likely those whom no god would accept.

The Valkyries are perhaps the youngest race of True Angels. I don't think they existed back during the Godswar. They were created as psychopomps when Junil realized that the evil gods were abusing portions of the compact and taking souls to whom they should not have had a valid claim. Valkyries are sent to guard the souls of good men so that they make it into their god's heaven rather than being drawn into Mulcarn's vault where they would languish until ready to be corrupted by the great machine of hell. IIrc, Junil sends these to protect souls claimed by other good gods too, but does not have the authority to save those not loyal to either him or his allies so those destined for Arawn's underworld or the vault of a neutral god remain easy pickings for the gods of evil. Basium may ave convinced a few Valkyries to lead souls to him rather than to a heaven, thus supplementing an army that would otherwise be made of only those he could smuggle out of Arawn's Netherworld through the passages he was created to guard.)

 

[WarKirby]

I'm pretty sure the plain old "Angel" unit is a mercurian Champion UU. If it's not, they do at least fulfill an identical role and may as well be.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Mercurians have no UU for Champions, just the default unit. All Angels have their own unitclass. They used to be UUs, but Kael did not like letting the Mercurians upgrade living units directly to angels.

 

[Fenboy]

I know that in lore Seraphs and Valkyries aren't descended from mortals, but in the actual game they are (that Gameplay and Story Segregation again). Plus I just thought that battle nuns would just look cool and distinctive.

/I love linking to TVTropes, secure in the knowledge that at least a dozen of you who click on the link won't escape for hours...

 

[Annex]

While we're talking about the Mercurians, Basium's unit artwork now looks quite bland and unremarkable when standing next to the Angel of Death, Herald, and Repentant Angel units. Does anyone want to spruce him up a little. I know it isnt high on the team's list of things to do so I thought I'd ask the enterprising fans of FfH. I might do some work myself, but Im not great with gimp or blender yet.

The current art for the Vicar and Luridus are a little bland, but I like that they wear robes (although I don't care for the current the colors). I pictured Empyrean as a more introspective/meditative faith, not the sort of militaristic religion that would have its priests wearing armor. Of course I could be completely mistaken about that; after all, the icons for those units both have armor. If they are going to have armor, then I'd prefer it to be similar to the armor worn by the Radiant Guard. (Either a shield and staff or a sword and staff, but no cloak so that Chalid still looks different.)

I agree completely. if anything the Order's priests should perhaps be lightly armored while the Empy's units wear radiant robes of some kind.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

A new Basium would be nice, especially if it better fit his discription from the civilopedia. He should have angelic runes carved into his flesh, have a ceremonial dagger at his side, and carry a war hammer instead of a club.

Spoiler Basium's civlopedia entry :

There is a word in the Angelic tongue for "love". Three, in fact. There are words for "mercy", for "compassion", for "tender kindness". The closest word to be used on this particular medium is carved upon his left forearm: "prudence." Like the word he just finished upon his chest, "justice", this is prayer in his native tongue written in blood and pain upon his now mortal flesh. "Holiness", across his cheeks. "Wrath", along his right forearm. "Judgment", his brow. "Courage", down his torso. Each a prayer to gods he turned his back on. Attributes of divine judgment he seeks to cultivate within his soul.

He was just finishing carving into the fingers of his right hand when two young men approached the lord, dwarfed by his stone-faced sergeants that led them. "What... what is he doing?"

It is a prayer... with every pain, I beg for the strength to finish my task." He rose. He towered over even his own mammoth soldiers.The other man gulped. "But aren't you... aren't you a god? To whom do you pray, m'lord?"

Basium turned to face his men. "Why do you disturb me?"

"I am Lars Lort, lord Basium. We wish to join your cause, me an' Kobe here. A horde of Infernal beasts destroyed our hometown, we were the only two survivors."

"Then take you a sword-we march on the morn."

"Well, sir, if we may," said Kobe, "we two are more than mere sell-swords. See, we've a bit of magic between us, that's how we survived the assault, by hiding invisible like. But we were watching and we learned something. Wait an' we'll show you." Without waiting for prompting, the two young mages began their spells. Basium took a long, slow breath, the rune on his left arm throbbing.

It was the Sulfuric smell that first alerted Basium. All his muscles tensed at its arrival before he was able to recognize the presence of his enemy. Curiously, the Balor stood motionless in the middle of camp. "Isn't it great?" Lars exclaimed gleefully. "We watched how the Infernals gated in reinforcements, but we figured out how to put the ward of command around it ourselves. With us around, you can fight fire with fire!"

Basium leapt upon the Hell-beast, wrapping his bare fingers around its neck. Smoke began immediately to hiss from the demon's skin, and in moments flames began to lick at Basium's fingers. On each of the fallen angel's fingers was carved one of the five angelic names for the Most Holy One. The Balor writhed in pain, breaking free of Lort's simple command warding in the process. He whipped at Basium with his tail, raked his back with his claws, bellowed with an unearthly roar, all to no avail-the Mercurian was unshakeable. Eventually the demon was reduced to an almost pitiful writhing and moaning until all that was left was a hellish smell and hissing puddles of black blood.

Basium rose, and stalked towards the two mages. "You call forth a Balor in my own camp? Let me show you what I do with fire-I extinguish it!" Basium roared. Lars felt his brother's warm blood splatter on his face before he even noticed that Basium had drawn his war hammer. He never noticed the second swing.

Basium walked back to his mat by the fire-pit. He picked up his ceremonial dagger, and began to trace the W on his arm.

I don't see order priests as wearing armor either, but I definitely don't see Empyrean priests as armored. They are philosophers and diplomats who tend to be a bit too reticent to go to war (although not nearly as opposed to fighting like those who serve Sirona).

Kael stated that the name Luridus (which I've never liked) comes from the yellow robes of the Empyrean high priests, so they should definitely have such robes.

 

[esvath]

But in the scenarios, wouldn't it the Empyrean that wage active wars against Council of Esus and the Ashen Veil? Resulting in Tempus Mor, summoning Basium etc? The Order played more minor role there.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Empyrean priests received visions warning of Hyborem's assault on Creation, and so decided to form the Overcouncil to discuss the proper course of action for the good nations to take to stop it. They did not rush in to a crusade like the Order would have, but once the threat was known and the situation analyzed they stood firm to fight to defend Erebus. The Empyrean did not start any wars, but they did not shy away when attacked either. The Council of Esus was inlisted to fight them because Flauros feared that faith in Lugus was a threat to all vampires.


Summoning Basium was Ethne's decision (as her royal family had been guarding the secret of the Mercurian Gate likely since Basium fell). She may or may not have discussed it at the Overcouncil first. Although certainly on the Empyrean-sanctioned council, I don't think Ethne was a follower of Lugus, although her views did diverge from the traditional teachings of Sirona that she had been raised to follow.

The Order was of course centered in the Bannor Empire, which was far accross the sea from the area around tempus Mor. They would likely have been crucial parts of the Overcouncil's battles had they been close enough to help. Also, at this time, the High Priests of the Order had become heretics, most likely worshiping Mammon or possibly Esus instead of Junil. Junil had many worshipers, but they took orders from those who ignored their god's will. They had been quite militant against the Cult of the Overlords, but had neither the strength nor the ability to project their power in those Overcouncil wars. First of all, the Bannor Emire is really far away from Tempus Mor. Secondly, their capital had just been ransacked by Auric Ulvin.


The most active assault against evil was the attack on the Fane of the Lessers, where the Bannor fought there most valiantly and with the most religious fervor. Varn of course came too and fought with determination to rescue his late wife's soul from the clutches of hell, but I don't think he did so as a emissary of Lugus. Basium was pleasantly shocked that a Priest of Lugus (a god he considers a coward) would be so bold.


We should probably get back to art and away from lore (except as directly related to art) in this thread soon.

 

[Tasunke]

A couple of random thoughts:

Firstly, I've been thinking about the Mercurians, and how the Seraph and Valkyrie are female units. This implies their melee line (the Axeman & Champion, as the mercs can't train warriors) would be female units. Perhaps war widows, or warrior nuns, kind of like Mordheim's Sisters of Sigmar.

The second thought is that the Balseraph Beastmaster just has to be a lion tamer The one that comes to mind is Cassandra, from the Urban Rivals game.

Though the Balseraph Beastmaster should be male, the first picture is the sort of costume I'm thinking of.

I actually think the far-right picture, Cassandra at her Wildest, would be a more fitting Balseraph Beastmaster xD

although I suppose if your looking for gender homogenization, just assume that jesters or Harlequins are more androgenous than male. (although I guess u could have a male beastmaster if u really wanted to)

 

[WarKirby]

While we're talking about the Mercurians, Basium's unit artwork now looks quite bland and unremarkable when standing next to the Angel of Death, Herald, and Repentant Angel units. Does anyone want to spruce him up a little. I know it isnt high on the team's list of things to do so I thought I'd ask the enterprising fans of FfH. I might do some work myself, but Im not great with gimp or blender yet.

If you compare him to the leaderhead art, basium's unitmodel is pretty accurate.

I guess it wouldn't be too hard to work on improving the quality a bit, perhaps with some photosourcing from the image, although it doesn't seem like any fundamental changes are needed. Tbh, I'm not really fond of how basium looks at all. A wingless angel feels odd,

 

[Annex]

If you compare him to the leaderhead art, basium's unitmodel is pretty accurate.

I guess it wouldn't be too hard to work on improving the quality a bit, perhaps with some photosourcing from the image, although it doesn't seem like any fundamental changes are needed. Tbh, I'm not really fond of how basium looks at all. A wingless angel feels odd,

True, but if you read Magister's post there are a few things left out.

Anyway my problem isnt with accuracy, but with quality. Next to the Angel of Death he just doesnt look cool. He's not only the civ's hero, but the leader as well. He should look at least as awesome as the other Mercurian units and his arch enemy Hyborem

And Im totaly with you on the wingless bit. It would be cool if he had them, though I dont know if that would be inconsistent with the lore or not.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I'm pretty sure he does not have wings in the lore, although there would be nothing wrong with the archangel of a sphere symbolized by the phoenix having wings. It probably makes as much sense for Basium to be winged as Hyborem. (Cernunnos/Hyborem were originally supposed to be wingless, but I think wings were retconned in to match the model.)

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

I actually think the far-right picture, Cassandra at her Wildest, would be a more fitting Balseraph Beastmaster xD

although I suppose if your looking for gender homogenization, just assume that jesters or Harlequins are more androgenous than male. (although I guess u could have a male beastmaster if u really wanted to)

the one on the far right actually looks like a Balseraph Breastmaster to me.

sorry, I just HAD to say it, you served it on a silver plate. you can go on with the discussion now

 

[Lone Wolf]

Minor Graphical Suggestion: for most civs, the European Settler/Worker are a better fit then the default Mediterranean Settler/Worker.

Oromo Warrior can be a Malakim Ethnic Arquebus, since Teutorix is an Oromo reskin anyway.

 

[Rystic]

I haven't posted here in a bit, but I do want to bring up the suggestion again that the Shadow should be replaced with the Ancient Spy model. It's a perfect match.

 

[Emptiness]

The Ancient Spy model would be vastly superior to the current one, so in the short term I agree.

Neomega did a very nice Shadow skin, which is perfect for the Amurite Shadow. Eventually I'd like to see similar Assassin reskins adopted as unique art for the other civs' Shadows.

 

[Valkrionn]

As I'd love to see this make it into the base mod...

Here's a unit created by Mr.Underhill, used as a Shadow UU for the Malakim (doesn't require CoE, used defensively):

Dervish Courtesy of MrUnderhill.

Spoiler :

 

[Lone Wolf]

Neomega did a very nice Shadow skin, which is perfect for the Amurite Shadow.

It fits pretty much everyone - the only thing tying it to the Amurites is that it's a Chanter reskin.

 

[Emptiness]

It fits pretty much everyone - the only thing tying it to the Amurites is that it's a Chanter reskin.

Each civ has a distinctive style. I see the fur vest and immediately see Amurite. There aren't any Hippus or Malakim units running around with those vests, and even civs with similar furs (Doviello, Illians) have clear differences in style. Neomega's Shadow skin is great, but it is also very Amurite.