GR12 - AWM vs 30 civs, Pangea

I'll have my dual core 2.6GHz up and running for my next set. Whew.

Great job vmxa, sounds quite involved. I'll eventually go over it all ;) but the lines I read were most wise.
 
well, mine is only a 1.9GHz rig...nevertheless, this is still playable and instead of Calvin and Hobbes, I watch soccer in between the turns

anyway, got it
 
I had moved most of the workers towards the rear to clear as I could not defend them at the front, but we are starting to get up some decent attackers.

There is a tile of swamp that is a possible town site out on the point. I could not clear it in timely fashsion. I was scared to death when the first IBT started with pikes being killed in town by weak units, but it was not repeated.

ThERat, I can feel some of the pain that will be coming as I once played a PTW archi map on 250x250 and the system was 1.7gh. It only had 256MB and some turns took a full hour. I played the same turn on this machine and it took 25 mins.

That game was probably worse than this one will be though. It only had 24 civs, but I wanted to see how bad it could get so I refused to expand off my island.

At least we will kill off civs eventually and will have less harbors. So I hope it will not play that slowly. As said before, settler animations took 2 minutes.
 
save

Pre-Turn
we have met Carthago, but not declared, do so now
we want to get rid of Zaragoza near the horses, shift pikes around and send army out
beat one spear and 1 bowman [2-0]

generally we should expand west to Sun Tzu, so that's where we should raze towns
chnage worker pump to build settler, we can never have enough of them

we pay a staggering 118gpt for unit support
now here is my plan
for each cat we capture, I am going to disband one of our own (41 of them, too many)
for 3 slaves I will join 1 native to our towns (36 of them)

if we stick to that, this should help us

1. 1255AD
we beat 1 unit on defense [3-0]

found Kadesh, now we can build another army
beat 2 units in Zaragoza, still its not razed (we have 2 armies there now)
well, this was fast, my first elite victory gives us another MGL, this will turn into a market in Spite

send another army west towards Nimrud
pillage German horses

beat 13 units [16-0]

IT lose MDI to a wounded sword attack [16-1]

2. 1260AD
beat 3 more spears in Zaragoza and city is finally gone for a cat
bring it back to Tarsus and disband a cat there

defeat 2 spears in Nimrud, LB left

overall 10 kills [26-1]

IT haiz, go 1:1 on defense losing a pike behind walls to a sword??? [27-2]

3. 1265AD
defeat 2 units and Nimrud is gone leaving 4 spears next to it standing in the rain :lol:
send our MDI army with settler to expand west
move knight army towards Eulbar and defeat 1 spear inside
get another MGL, this one will be preserved for the next knight army

tally 15-1, thus [42-3]

IT no attacks

4. 1270AD
found Adana with a combat settler
defeat 3 units and raze Eulbar to make proper space for our new city
raze New Berlin in the south

18 kills, thus [60-3]

IT no attacks

5. 1275AD
devise a plan to secure that choke in the west

16 kills [76-3]

IT go 1:1 [77-4]

6. 1280AD
move knight army to Shuruppak and also move in a combat settler

14-1 this time [91-5]

7. 1285AD
kill 4 units in Shuruppak, not enough
found Alaca at the western lake
found Northern star at the northern tip of our empire

one more city and we have another knight army
finally totally detach berlin from the rest of the empire

tally 11-0 [102-5]

IT 2:0 on defense near Shuruppka as a bunch of knights gets attacked [104-5]

8. 1290AD
Shuruppak is drained of units, after beating 2 spears, we take the town temporary
this allows for founding of Canal town, rush wall with the support of 1 cat
we have a new knight army of course with 32 towns

in the southeast raze Leira for 2 slaves

15-0 this time, thus [119-5]

IT I almost crack up when the Babs LB attacks the Arab mace that are both next to Canal town
good job !!!

9. 1295AD
defeat 21 units
get yet another MGL, we need 4 more cities which we could get soonish, so I leave that MGL alone

[140-5]

IT lose exposed knight versus a horse :crazyeye: [140-6]
Evora changes ownership from Portugese to Babylon

10. 1300AD
found Katna in the west
defeat 3 units in Samara, lose a knight but raze town
gain another 4 slaves and 1 cat, thus disband one of our own

defeat 2 units in Dortmund and raze town for 16gold, 2 slaves and a treb
defeat 2 units in Kufah and raze city as well for 2 slaves

10-1, thus final tally [150-7]

situation:
what holds us back currently are settlers though I tired my best. Do never stop producing them. Worker pump is the perfect settler pump, but we need more of those

once we have 3 more cities, we can form another knight army and lay waste.
I feel babs are for the taking, as long as they fight Arabs. We MUST get their Sun Tzu, it will mean gpt for us
Once we need to go back to self research the unit support will kill us currently. We have a lot of cash that will help us for deficit research until things are better.
It is understood that we go for MT all the way.And keep on disbanding our cats which we replenish with foreign ones. Also, the more slaves we get, the more natives we should merge to our cities.

There is a settler on the way to claim ivory. This should help us to reduce lux, there are more luxes south (wine/incense)

the western choke town with a settler near ivory
somewhere west must be Ashur with ST
gr121300a.jpg


the south
gr121300b.jpg
 
Greebley said:
This game will be no better and possibly worse speedwise because the human player builds as many roads and often more rails than the AI (as some AI don't have the resources or are slow to build rails).

Yeah you could be right. The two reasons I figured it may be better is the 1) I think they improved things a bit in C3C over PTW, but that may not be the case. 2) I let they play by themslefs to see how bad it could get, so they each had large armies as island civs are want to do and fought back and forth with little accomplished.

I did finally get tired very late and killed two civs and as I recall it ended with 17 still left.

So it will be fun to see how it plays out. I had always thought the harbor trade route checking was worse than roads, but that seems to not be a sure thing. When roads were cut by the army it took a second or two. When the AI cuts our roads, though it made no delay.

Either way it will get worse. Will not knowing all the civs matter for trade route checking routines?

The processor speed is all that matters though as it is purely CPU bound. I never see it use all my memory and I can run music/webs/CAII and other stuff with no impact. At least on the 1GB systm.
 
ThERat, that was a fast set. Good plan to merge in some natives and disband cats as the opportunity for free ones arises.

You are correct settlers will be needed in a steady flow from now on. I wanted to get the Aqua in worker pump under the GA as we could not expand much at that time. Once the knights started to get into it, that allowed the armies to attack, rather than defend and police.

One thing that crossed my mind, but I did not mention was are we at the point that we can think about disbanning a Mace army to get the Knight army online sooner? If we have the knights to fill one and a leader, that may be a way to go.

They can be used to make an aqua someplace and get to city size.
 
I agree about merging native workers, and I have a more radical plan in mind. We have seventeen of them (out of our total of 35) in the north, where after they burn one more jungle they'll have nothing to do. It would take them at least six turns of movement after that to reach any unimproved tile. So I'm inclined to merge all seventeen, which would give our underpopulated core a tremendous boost and help a little with our unit costs, while establishing Malice as a two-turn worker pump (Worker Pump Only is effectively Settler Pump Only now ;)) to start producing new workers closer to where they're needed.

Would anyone object to this?
 
Seems good to me. By the time rails come lots of slaves should be available. It will be hard to do a lot of work for a time as most of the tiles needing improvements are at the front.
 
OK, I'll proceed with that idea (which should not be taken as meaning that this turnaround will be nearly as fast as Rat's :D). Thanks for the quick response.
 
I would expect that when steam comes in we will wish we a lot more workers, but the price for keeping them that long is high.
 
vmxa said:
I would expect that when steam comes in we will wish we a lot more workers, but the price for keeping them that long is high.

We may be well on our way to winning by the time rails come. On the other hand we may have a large number of foreign workers by then. I have seen close to 500 in one of these large games IIRC (though that may have been the 361x361 game).
 
Personally I wouldn't even bother to build any more workers. We will get lots of slaves now if we keep on razing those bigger cities (NP, I know you like to capture and sell improvements).
I would merge all those natives in the north and assess the situation. If we really need more workers once rails are in (That is still many turns away), we can build them in time.

Soon, the outlying cities will be our science farms and produce workers and settlers. That will be sufficient. Currently settlers are the bottleneck for quick expansion.
We do have to watch out for the initial stacks of Iro and Carthagian units though. That's why I would try and get rid of Babs and maybe Spain/Portugal. They have few cities left and the Spanish UU is really a pain in the ...

Oh, I mentioned in the picture, Ashur is the city with Sun Tzu.
 
My book for this round was N. A. M. Rodger's The Command of the Ocean--highly recommended. I got through about fifty pages. :D


1300 (0): Only an eight-minute interturn--better than I expected.

Hubishna harbour --> marketplace, Ivriz library --> marketplace.


1305 (1): On the Babylonian front we slay three spearmen (3-0). We capture a settler and two workers--not an unmixed blessing, as the relevant animations take about ninety seconds each. :lol:

We locate Babylon, and so the Great Wall, which I may try to keep.

Elsewhere we smite eleven units--seven German, three Japanese, and one Sumerian--losing an MDI (14-1).


1310 (2): We ride down two Bab LB landed next to Ugarit (16-1).

Elsewhere we defeat one Port, two Bab, three German, and three Japanese units, losing a knight (25-2).

We found Ivory Coast, gaining access to the eponymous luxury.

We found Merlot in the south, as we begin settling our way towards the wines.

We spot Ashur, and Sun Tzu.

A Carth unit appears--the first?

Our GA ends.

Ugarit harbour --> aqueduct.


1315 (3): We found Grenache, closer to the wines.

Mutawallis forms our ninth army.

We raze Najran, now Sumerian and held by two Enks (27-2). We gain a slave.

We destroy a Port MDI and a Bab LB, both landed near Ugarit (29-2).

We move three armies and supporting units next to Babylon.

Elsewhere we strike down six Sumerian and four Japanese units, gaining the GL Hattusilis (39-2).

We gain Invention from the GLib.

Wonder City marketplace --> library, Karhuyuk aqueduct --> pikeman.


1320 (4): We storm Babylon, held by six spearmen and a longbowman, and keep it for the sake of the Great Wall (46-2). Metallurgy may be a long way away; and since the Babs lack fast units, managing the starve-down shouldn't be difficult.

On entering Babylon we meet the Aztecs--the beige civ just beyond Babylonia, clearly--and declare war.

Elsewhere we kill eight enemy units, mostly German (54-2).

We see the Spanish fighting the Arabs, and the Babs fighting the Ports.


1325 (5): We found Pinot Noir, claiming wines--our third luxury.

In the Pinot Noir area we raze Spanish Valencia, held by four spearmen and an archer, for the loss of a knight (59-3). We gain a slave and capture a cat.

The Aztecs hold Akkad, so they're at war with the Babs too.

We expunge seventeen assorted enemy units (76-3).

We're able to cut the lux rate to 20%, bringing us to 102 gpt. 10% lux might be possible, with a lot of three-unit garrisons, but we should probably wait for our fourth luxury.

Tyrana library --> knight, Alacacuk marketplace --> pikeman.


1330 (6): We found Shiraz and Cabernet in the wine country, also settling towards Germany's incense. We're seven tiles, or two enemy cities, away from it now.

We form and fill our tenth army.

The Iroquois appear--in the SE, approaching Malatya--and we crush an MDI (77-3).

Elsewhere we trample nine enemy units (86-3).

Washington library --> pikeman, Harran marketplace --> knight, Yalburt courthouse --> marketplace.


1335 (7): We finish merging the seventeen northern workers.

It looks as though the Babs are on an isthmus, and taking their core won't enlarge our front too much. Better still, they have silks--our potential fifth luxury.

We move two knight armies and some supporting knights next to Ashur, overrunning a Bab LB on the way (87-3).

We raze Spanish Murcia, held by three spearmen and an archer (91-3). Between capture and razing we gain five slaves.

Hmm, it turns out that we founded Pinot Noir in the suburbs of Mecca. :eek:

Elsewhere we exterminate just an Iroquois knight, an Ir. MDI, and two Japanese MDI (95-3). It's not all bad when the AI sends fewer, more expensive units.


1340 (8): We take Ashur, held by four spearmen, and capture Sun Tzu (99-3).

We raze Mecca, held by just three pikemen (102-3)--obviously a consequence of the Arabs' other wars. We capture a treb and four slaves (razing plus settler).

We found Alalah, pushing our southeastern border forward.

Elsewhere we liquidate fourteen assorted enemy units and capture a settler, losing a knight (116-4).

Babylon flips--no great surprise. We lose only two pikemen.

More seriously, only one citizen of Ashur comes out of resistance during the safe interturn, through the city was crammed with our units, so we can't begin the starve-down there. :mad:

Hattusha library --> pikeman, Wonder City library --> knight.


1345 (9): We re-take Babylon, held only by a spearman (117-4).

We found Chianti to round off our position in the wine country; Bushire to push our borders out in the southeast; and Alaca Huyuk to start filling in the Babylonian lands.

We smash nine assorted enemy units (126-4).

Sixteen elite victories this round produced one Great Leader.
 
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