Great News for Russia: the Artic now Russian

[bhsup]

It is most definitely time for freedom of navigation exercises in the arctic. Show the flag a bit and stick it to the Ruskies.

 

[Thorvald of Lym]

Ok, imagine this, a modern day Russia using a feudal system, or better yet, imagine what it woulda done during WWII...

Different uniforms?

No, the fear of them being killed helped motivate them to do their part

...'Til they died of exhaustion. And with the workforce diverted from the farms, Soviet agricultural produce harvested itself?

In probably 1 way, yes

OK, I'll bite... what way?

 

[Winner]

you think everyone deserves everything else more then Russia.

You make ignorant and dumb statements simply because you hate Russians...

If that was a case, all Russians would hate everybody else. Which isn't far from the truth, given the amount of xenophobia in Russia.

You act as though we are fools and idiots and you feel you are better then me and my people.

But you act like fools and idiots. You had a nice opportunity to change your country into something better after the Communist terror finally ended, but you wasted it. Now, you're once again rallying behind some authoritarian leader who's telling you what's right and wrong and what you should do. If you also need someone to tell you what to think, then you're a hopeless case.

 

[sysyphus]

In Russia, Arctic claims you!

 

[RedRalph]

didnt Bush claim space for America this year? told the rest of the world he wouldnt tolerate anyone else gaining a fotthold in it?

 

[Virote_Considon]

Ok, imagine this, a modern day Russia using a feudal system, or better yet, imagine what it woulda done during WWII...

My guess is all on attacking the Germans before they became too powerful before WWII.

No, the fear of them being killed helped motivate them to do their part

I bet it did. And I guess if you had the Secret Services on your arse, you'd be working hard, too, as opposed to trying to find a way to get them away from you.

In probably 1 way, yes

What way? The way that he butchered 1/4 of his population, for "crimes" as petty as having an education, knowing someone foreign, or having to wear glasses?

 

[Perfection]

AND BY WORKING UR ASS OFF U MEAN POSTING AT CFC???

I HAVE A JOB AND GO TO SCHOOL!

 

[trader/warrior]

If these arctic territories are on the Russian continental shelf, then it is rightfully theirs, no?

 

[silver 2039]

If these arctic territories are on the Russian continental shelf, then it is rightfully theirs, no?

I believe so, I think its international law or something.

 

[Che Guava]

"At the present time we are preparing rock samples and materials to document and present to the United Nations commission on ownership of the continental shelf," the statement said.

The rocks are going to tell us who owns the artic? Do they put a rock in the middle of the room with a Canadian, a russian and a Dane in each corner and see how the rock goes to...?

 

[Slaughter]

Russia can pwn Canada and Norway at the same time, so the Artic is theirs.
End of story.

 

[Hitti-Litti]

Does that make Santa Russian?

Well, if I remember right Finland isn't in the Arctic, so no, that doesn't make Santa Russian.

 

[sourboy]

http://uk.reuters.com/article/scienceNews/idUKL2082113920070920?pageNumber=2

Spoiler :

It first made the claim to the United Nations in 2001, but now intends to show it new evidence.

"At the present time we are preparing rock samples and materials to document and present to the United Nations commission on ownership of the continental shelf," the statement said.

Last month's expedition, when a mini-submarine dived from a command ship 4,200 m (13,000 feet) below the sea and planted the Russian flag with a mechanical arm, triggered international allegations of a Kremlin stunt.

Any Comments?

Spoiler :

Sorry if this news is 5 days old, but u cant find it anywhere on KKKapitali$t AmeriKKKan controlled News (except CNN probably)

Nonsense. A countries borders fall within so many miles of it's shoreline. Underwater oceanic areas do not qualify.

 

[sourboy]

The rocks are going to tell us who owns the artic? Do they put a rock in the middle of the room with a Canadian, a russian and a Dane in each corner and see who the rock goes to...?

Quote of the week!

 

[Fugitive Sisyphus]

Moscow should send a settler over to the Arctic if they want to claim it. It's funny how Civ mirrors life.

 

[Alpha Killer II]

Different uniforms?

Actually, Stalin helped Industrialize Russia faster than other country, or leader, but not to forget the great cost of life, but remember: No other leader in history would have industrialize Russia faster than Stalin, and in such good time too, even if the N.A.P. signed with Russia and Germany wasnt even signed, Hitler would have still invaded Russia, I doubt Trotsky or some Tsar would be right for the job

...'Til they died of exhaustion. And with the workforce diverted from the farms, Soviet agricultural produce harvested itself?

Millions may have died, but about 80 years of Soviet controlled Russia the farmers still lasted alive, maybe of more farm-able land from Eastern Europe? (Im not saying Russia DID farm in Eastern Europe, Im just saying it s a possibility)

OK, I'll bite... what way?

Ugh, I think I answered this already

My guess is all on attacking the Germans before they became too powerful before WWII.

Russia was still industrializing itself by that time, it was planning to attack the Germans after their armies were exhausted and after Russia was industrialized, if that did happen though, then Soviet control over Europe would have been have been extended to France, imagine the Cold War in that Parallel world

I bet it did. And I guess if you had the Secret Services on your arse, you'd be working hard, too, as opposed to trying to find a way to get them away from you.

Ugh, if I was a industrial worker in a Russian city I wouldnt have to worry about hunger, but sure, I'll work hard for Soviet Russia
If I was a farmer, then I'll try any way to overcome the hardships of collectivization and try raising more animals than possible

What way? The way that he butchered 1/4 of his population, for "crimes" as petty as having an education, knowing someone foreign, or having to wear glasses?

Its 1/3 of the population, Pol Pot was mostly a idiot, yes, but yes, Maoism is xenophobic in its early years

I HAVE A JOB AND GO TO SCHOOL!

WHAT ABOUT CHRISTMAS BREAK?!

PS: I think we are going off topic here, I jus hope the mods wont notice >.>

 

[Elgalad]

Russia can have the North Pole if they like.

We'll just take Luna. Oh, and Mars.


-E

 

[Ethics]

Actually, Stalin helped Industrialize Russia faster than other country, or leader, but not to forget the great cost of life, but remember: No other leader in history would have industrialize Russia faster than Stalin, and in such good time too, even if the N.A.P. signed with Russia and Germany wasnt even signed, Hitler would have still invaded Russia, I doubt Trotsky or some Tsar would be right for the job

Stalin didn't do a damn thing to improve the Soviet Union. If anything, his entire reign was a detriment to the economic progress of the nation. Starving the peasants who are working on collectivized farms in lands stolen from them (that were far more prosperous than the collective farms ever were) to buy heavy machinery and equipment that was often left to rust due to ineffective management of resources did not improve the economic situation of the Soviet Union. If anything, the statistics from the NEP (New Economic Plan or capitalism light) years in the 1920s to the stranglehold of that mad man's reign show a drecrease in economic progress.

I recommend the dissident piece Bitter Waters: Life and Work in Stalinist Russia to give you a better idea of how industry (in this case lumber and logging) fared under the 1930s Stalinist controlled government. It is written by a political prisoner who was released from the gulag in the early 30s due in part because of the increasing lack of workers from the purges and general asshattery of the Bolshevik regime at that time.

Regardless, Stalin's bungling of the military buildup/improvements that were made in the 1930s nearly cost the Soviets the war with Germany. Stalin shut himself into seclusion as the Germans rolled through; the Russian winter saved Stalin's regime. The Russian people saved themselves despite Stalin, and many would not have minded the Nazis finishing their objective either.

The post war period of Stalin's regime has often been coined "A Return to Normalcy" in that the horrible conditions of the 30s were returned to. You were starving, near homeless, and you probably had family members whisked away by the government to rot for some trumped up charges. At least during the war period the government was too busy saving itself to focus on you. Well, they returned to the horrible existence after the war... "normalcy."

Millions may have died, but about 80 years of Soviet controlled Russia the farmers still lasted alive, maybe of more farm-able land from Eastern Europe? (Im not saying Russia DID farm in Eastern Europe, Im just saying it s a possibility)

Any farming reforms are better to be credited to Khrushchev and his virgin lands campaign in the later 50s. Stalin's era of control sure as hell didn't have farming or feeding his people as its objective.

Russia was still industrializing itself by that time, it was planning to attack the Germans after their armies were exhausted and after Russia was industrialized, if that did happen though, then Soviet control over Europe would have been have been extended to France, imagine the Cold War in that Parallel world

They did a really bad job at industrializing themselves. The Soviets would have been rolled by the Germans in Western Europe. They were nearly obliterated save the Russian winter in the first place.

Ugh, if I was a industrial worker in a Russian city I wouldnt have to worry about hunger, but sure, I'll work hard for Soviet Russia
If I was a farmer, then I'll try any way to overcome the hardships of collectivization and try raising more animals than possible

There were severe food shortages in the cities, as Stalin was selling the nation's grain supply to buy industrial equipment and weapons that were often wasted and rusting within five years.

On the collective farms, you did not get to eat what you produced. As far as animals, it was illegal for you to own your own. This is why the khulaks revolted in the 20s and harvested/slaughtered what little they had acquired during their short stint of freedom between their release from peasantry in the late 1800s to the Bolshevik take over. When they were done revolting and starving the government came in to round them up and work them to death. There was an eventual allowance of peasants to have small gardens to grow spare vegetables for themselves, but it was never enough to save or feed themselves in any entirety.

Incidentally, one of the problems that the Soviet Union had following World War II was its inability to get people to go back to the collective farms. Those who could got the hell out of dodge during the war period.

Stalin sucked. He deserves no credit for any positive.

 

[Alpha Killer II]

Stalin didn't do a damn thing to improve the Soviet Union. If anything, his entire reign was a detriment to the economic progress of the nation. Starving the peasants who are working on collectivized farms in lands stolen from them (that were far more prosperous than the collective farms ever were) to buy heavy machinery and equipment that was often left to rust due to ineffective management of resources did not improve the economic situation of the Soviet Union. If anything, the statistics from the NEP (New Economic Plan or capitalism light) years in the 1920s to the stranglehold of that mad man's reign show a drecrease in economic progress.

Economics wasnt Stalin's plans, Industrial Strength was probably one of the biggest parts in Stalin's Plans...

I recommend the dissident piece Bitter Waters: Life and Work in Stalinist Russia to give you a better idea of how industry (in this case lumber and logging) fared under the 1930s Stalinist controlled government. It is written by a political prisoner who was released from the gulag in the early 30s due in part because of the increasing lack of workers from the purges and general asshattery of the Bolshevik regime at that time.

I will try to read that book soon

Regardless, Stalin's bungling of the military buildup/improvements that were made in the 1930s nearly cost the Soviets the war with Germany. Stalin shut himself into seclusion as the Germans rolled through; the Russian winter saved Stalin's regime. The Russian people saved themselves despite Stalin, and many would not have minded the Nazis finishing their objective either.

Stalin's plan during that time was not war, but industrialization, if it was war, Stalin would have prepared more adequately, but instead Hitler backstabbed Stalin and invaded Russia
The Russian People who had join the Nazis were idiots, Hitler would have killed them off anyways whenever Stalin was done

Any farming reforms are better to be credited to Khrushchev and his virgin lands campaign in the later 50s. Stalin's era of control sure as hell didn't have farming or feeding his people as its objective.

It was industrialization -__________- NOT agriculture, and Russia was the 3rd Largest producer of electricity in 1939
Industrial progress more than tripled than in during the Tsar rule, and Agriculture almost doubled

They did a really bad job at industrializing themselves.

But yet they did industrialized themselves

There were severe food shortages in the cities, as Stalin was selling the nation's grain supply to buy industrial equipment and weapons that were often wasted and rusting within five years.

I have read many places that cities were well fed, it was mostly the farmers that suffered, and yes Stalin did sold alot of grains for industrial equipment and weapons, but it was all part of the 5 year plan

On the collective farms, you did not get to eat what you produced. As far as animals, it was illegal for you to own your own.

I have heard people finding animals and eating them, I have also heard of cannibalism and people eating their own dogs/cats

Stalin sucked. He deserves no credit for any positive.

Here is a video of Stalin from a unbiased point of view, both good and bad

Spoiler :

http://youtube.com/watch?v=MIjdHVB8P6c

Now please, stop carrying this thread about Stalin, This is about the Artic becoming Russian, if you wish to debate even more just PM me

 

[Lotus49]

So this is kinda like in Civ when all the half-decent spots are taken, and the AI does the 'settler diarrhea' thing? Typical expansionist civ.