Have you ever cheated *with* somebody?

[attackfighter]

Because it isn't 1200 anymore and I don't care if I have 30 kids?

Are you saying it's not basic instinct to reproduce?

 

[Heretic_Cata]

I once cheated in a computer game.

Spoiler :

 

[Winner]

OK, people, let's ignore that attackfighter guy and get back to the discussion topic, all right? I don't want this to be derailed by trolls.
Moderator Action: Calling someone a troll is seen as trolling itself, so please don't do it.

 

[downtown]

But then again, the ultimate responsibility lies with the person A. It's his/her choice. C may be in love with A, or just desire A sexually, it doesn't matter that much - A is the one who says either yes or no to the offer. I understand that B may be angry, but there is no commitment on the part of C to care about B's emotional well-being.

I guess I'm old fashioned, but I try to avoid messing up a stranger's emotional well being without a reeeaally good reason. "I want some tail" usually doesn't fall into that camp for me. I suppose there are some morally ambiguous situations (what if B is a wife beater?), but not many.

In this situation, A is somebody who doesn't take relationship commitments very seriously...but is still unwilling to leave B. Unless there are some physical abuse variables there, 9 times out of 10, that sounds like a bad situation to me.

Are you saying it's not basic instinct to reproduce?

Not when you become old enough to realize the repercussions of having 30 kids.

 

[Winner]

I guess I'm old fashioned, but I try to avoid messing up a stranger's emotional well being without a reeeaally good reason. "I want some tail" usually doesn't fall into that camp for me.

So, what would you personally do if you fell in love (and by that I imply a lot more that "I want to have some fun") with a person who wasn't single at the time, you didn't have any idea who the B guy is, never met him, and this person was clearly interested? Walk away?

In this situation, A is somebody who doesn't take relationship commitments very seriously...but is still unwilling to leave B. Unless there are some physical abuse variables there, 9 times out of 10, that sounds like a bad situation to me.

It is a strange situation. But from what I gather, A claims to love B and is unwilling to leave him/her because she/he feels committed to the relationship. I suspect A is actually afraid of leaving an existing relationship with B who is incredibly tolerant (I'd call it stupid, but I shouldn't judge) and decent (the kind of person you can rely on), and risk pursing a relationship with C.

Still, this only makes it possible to judge the person A, not C.

 

[Disgustipated]

not that this happened to me (let's just say it was a friend), what about if B took A away from C, but C was still in love with A and A still loved C (but only went with B because of family obligations). It's not like C did anything to B that B didn't already do to C. Yes I realize two wrongs don't make a right.

In my opinion love is the most important factor here. But sometimes when kids are involved there are other obligations a person cannot get out of. I know, it's shameful to try to justify bad behavior, but sometimes life isn't perfect, and neither are relationships. I'll tell my friend he's a bad person.

 

[Winner]

I find it interesting how black&white views on morality tend to disintegrate when you or people you care a lot about are involved. Which is partially a reason why I made the thread title a bit personal.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Whatever.

As the Butthole Surfers said, it's better to regret something you HAVE done, than to regret something you HAVEN'T done. And if you see your mother next weekend, make sure to tell her "SATAN SATAN SATAN SATAN!!"


Link to video.

 

[Shaihulud]

For those who say no, does it mean not even accidentally? For myself, I have caused others to have cheated, either because of personal ignorance and because I do not care. i will not willingly pursue a person romantically whom I know was attached to a friend or an acquaintance, but sometimes things just escalates.

 

[emzie]

No, nor would I knowingly. I have enough esteem in myself to reject the idea of being second in my partner's eyes.

 

[Mr. Dictator]

Yes, and given the opportunity, I'll do it again.
If she's not married, doesn't have kids and her boyfriend isn't a friend of mine she's fair game.
The guy would also be well within his rights to punch me in the face, but hat's a different matter.


No, these things happen.


I'd say the one who cheats on his partner is usually to blame, but it also depends on who initiates it.


It means C doesn't love B and just wants sex, which is perfectly acceptable.

Your avatar added another layer to your post.

But I disagree.

 

[Virote_Considon]

>implying that anyone on CivFanatics Off Topic has ever had sex

 

[kochman]

I find it interesting how black&white views on morality tend to disintegrate when you or people you care a lot about are involved. Which is partially a reason why I made the thread title a bit personal.

Yes... it's the stuff wisdom is made of, those black and white views disintegrating.

 

[wolfigor]

if the existing relationship between A and B is strong, nothing should ever happen and A should clearly rebuff C's advances.

However C may be exploiting a temporary weakness in the relation between A and B.
Imagine B is emotionally very weak (e.g. A and B just had a big fight or somebody dear left and A is far away, or any other scenario, potentially involving alcohol)... The cheating would never occurred without active participation of C.
Anyway, in my mind the A has to bear the full responsibility of what happened.

If A is willing to cheat on B, why should C be held responsible for the crappy nature of their relationship?

Yes, this is the main point: there will be no cheating if everything is going well in the relation between A and B.

Even though C is essentially innocent, he/she will still be viewed in a negative light by other people? Why is that? Is it because he/she is seen as a 'disruptive agent' of some sort?

In those cases where C is considered "guilty" it is mostly due to be the 'disruptive agent'.
Often B would rather search for an external cause to the breakdown of the relation with A instead of looking into the relation itself: it's easier to blame somebody else.
At the same time A may be willing to justify his/her actions by blaming C (especially in case A want to go back with B).

Again it's human nature to always blame somebody else.

what if the cheated person is someone you don't know - perhaps C was only barely aware of B's existence when he/she started pursuing A.

Depends on what we mean with "barely aware"
Anyway lets see this case:
A is very feels herself neglected by B, who prefer to spend time at work or friends (allegedly) instead of performing his regular "duties" with A.
A becomes friend with C, a very nice, sexy, and cool guy... C is aware that A is married with B, but doesn't know all the details.
Now C is obviously attracted by A (only for lust no love): should C remain good friend of B or F@@K her brain out as she so much desire?

Personally I would vote for the fun option: if I were C I would give B her best time ever.

Now lets add a new layer of complexity: how the situation change if A is in love with C (and C knows it)?
she will ruin her own relation with B, and will remain alone because C is only interested in sex.
In this case I see C being a bit more of a felon.
This is where I would have some moral problems if I was C.


What if there is also AB, a child of A+B?

 

[Kennigit]

[*]do you consider it morally reprehensible to desire someone who is not single *and* act on these feelings?

no, not really, and it depends on the situation. It particularly depends on how much you (person C) is trying to be the cheating-initiator. If it is mostly/ entirely B or A initiating the affair, I don't really blame C for the cheating nor do I consider it morally reprehensible.

it's tied to part 3 of your question, thoughts below

[*]who do you think is primarily to blame, if there *is* anyone to blame? The one who is cheating, or the other person who is a willing participant in such an affair?

The one who is cheating, almost entirely (assuming no case of physical/relationship abuse). Many times C may not know the other person is actually not-single.

Not that they pursue feelings, but that they can't break up with the other person and go around having an affair. In general, I'd say if you are considering cheating in the first place, just end the relationship first.

[*]what if this person (C) is fine with his/her "partner"(A) being unwilling to terminate his/her existing relationship (with B)? What does it say about those who are involved?*

I think C is in the wrong with this extension; I don't really find pursuing someone who is not single completely wrong per se but C should always be encouraging A or B to end the other relationship (unless some cases like physical or other abuse).

I would not really pursue someone not-single personally, as it's kind of wrong, but it's not really inherently wrong.

With regards to ending the relation (the cheater A or B): I have no personal experience with it, but I know people do talk about A or B (the cheater) worried that their partner would be emotionally unstable and could not handle the break up. In those cases, my initial thought is that it's not your job (the cheater) to be the other person's (the non cheater) emotional crutch; if they are emotionally unstable, they need to seek professional help and you should support them on good terms. Running around cheating seems to be the worst situation, imo.

If you're having a long term affair and can't break up with the person you are cheating on, you're being selfish and morally reprehensible. The extenuating circumstances may be (1) family obligations (2) physical abuse (3) "emotional unstability," and I think for (2) and (3) it's not your place to try to fix the problem; professional expertise is needed. I.e. it'd be better to try to end on better terms and get other sources of help than try to bottle up some cheating. Physical abuse cases would get really tricky though.

(1) family obligations gets tricky and I don't have a solid answer; my answer would be that cheating in the first place is much worse than the stuff about breaking up/not breaking up, assuming a healthy relationship without physical/emotional abuse. If you have a family, it shouldn't be broken apart on bad terms through cheating; if you are considering cheating, you may just want to consider ending the relationship first.

I understand "one time" cheating deals where it may just be physical/short term. But to start a relationship with someone else while being in one is quite morally reprehensible if you are not trying to take steps to terminate the first relationship (the one you cheat in).

 

[Ramius75]

Its a Free Market....

everyone can choose who to like and be with.

p/s: of coz, only do that IF you are serious about a relationship and not just for Ego...

 

[Brighteye]

It's clearly B's fault for imposing such arbitrary and limiting conditions on the relationship with A.
Anyone emotionally needy enough to try to force a partner into an exclusive relationship falls into Wolfigor's category (3). It's neither A's nor C's job to pander to unreasonable demands of other people.

I have slept with a married woman. She was separated and in the process of getting a divorce.

 

[warpus]

[*]do you consider it morally reprehensible to desire someone who is not single *and* act on these feelings?

Depends! If they're in an open relationship then anything goes.

 

[Boundless]

[*]do you consider it morally reprehensible to desire someone who is not single *and* act on these feelings?

Nope.

[*]who do you think is primarily to blame, if there *is* anyone to blame? The one who is cheating, or the other person who is a willing participant in such an affair?

IMO the relationship is dead as soon as the person within the relationship considers cheating. Its 6ft down when the cheating occurs.

[*]what if this person (C) is fine with his/her "partner"(A) being unwilling to terminate his/her existing relationship (with B)? What does it say about those who are involved?*

Meh, C's got it easy. They get to bang without the hassel of a relationship. A is being pretty weak, and should just end the relationship. It works for C as long as they have no emotional feelings to A or B.

From personal experience, as long as B never finds out, it is very possible for the original relationship to outlast the illicit relationship and continue into strength. C was a "blip".

 

[schlaufuchs]

1. I don't think it's morally reprehensible to desire a taken woman. I don't think there's a straight man alive who can claim to not having done it. I'm sure it's the same among women. That being said, I think actually acting on such feelings is one of the most low, dirtiest, scummiest things any person could do to another person. There are few things I think of that are more hurtful, more degrading, and more depressing than being cheated on. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.
2. It's a bit of both person B and person C's. C for being scummy enough to make a move on another person's SO, and person B for consenting to C's scumminess.
3. I think my opinions on 1 and 2 adequately give you a sense for my response to this question.