Is Elon Musk a fraud?

[Samson]

Report: ‘massive’ Tesla leak reveals data breaches, thousands of safety complaints

Tesla has failed to adequately protect data from customers, employees and business partners and has received thousands of customer complaints regarding the carmaker’s driver assistance system, Germany’s Handelsblatt has reported, citing 100 gigabytes of confidential data leaked by a whistleblower.

The Handelsblatt report said customer data could be found “in abundance” in a data set labelled “Tesla Files”.

The files include tables containing more than 100,000 names of former and current employees, including the social security number of the Tesla CEO, Elon Musk, along with private email addresses, phone numbers, salaries of employees, bank details of customers and secret details from production, according to Handelsblatt.

The breach would violate the GDPR, the newspaper said.

If such a violation was proved, Tesla could be fined up to 4% of its annual sales, which could be €3.26bn ($3.5bn).

Citing the leaked files, the newspaper also reported about large numbers of customer complaints regarding the Tesla’s driver assistance programs, with about 4,000 complaints on sudden acceleration or phantom braking.

Last month, a Reuters report showed that groups of Tesla employees privately shared via an internal messaging system sometimes highly invasive videos and images recorded by customers’ car cameras between 2019 and 2022.

 

[Kyriakos]

This is where we are now.

 

[Joij21]

View attachment 671450

This is where we are now.

From which woman?

 

[Kyriakos]

From which woman?

I don't know; I was looking for twitter news and saw the title which is self-explanatory and damning already. Wouldn't watch the video ^^

 

[raystuttgart]

Elon Musk may be arrogant, narcistic, eccentric and generally strange but so are many other rich and successful people as well.
Whatever one may think about his character there is no denying that still he worked hard and was able to learn from his failures.

There is also no denying his success. If the way he achieved it was always "morally" ok is a different question.
And sure, he was also lucky but that man is also one of the smartest and hardest business people of our time.

Tesla changed the automotive business considering eMobility and autonomous driving more than any other company.
So if you feel like calling that "fraud" ... ok. But there is simply no denying of the impact this man has had on our world.

Also there is no doubt that he risked again and again to start ventures that others would never have dared to even try.
His perseverance to stand up again and again after repeated failures is almost legendary and pretty rare these days.

Would I like to work for him ... definitely not. Would I like to be like him ... no I would not. Do I envy his success ... yeah I do.
But I really also do not think it matters to him at all what normal people like you and me think about him.

Summary:
I think he earned his success by hard work and perseverance and also a bit of luck.
- And that is not the definition of a "fraud".

Comment:
Personally I think all the moral bashing of successful people just serves to make people feel better or to justify their own lack of success.
As it makes it easier for people to overlook that they themselves were less smart, less diligent, less perseverant or just less lucky.

 

[Gorbles]

there is no denying that still he worked hard and was able to learn from his failures.

Haha, no. Not even slightly.

Personally I think all the moral bashing of successful people just serves to make people feel better.

Also nope. I use Twitter, yeah?

As a user of the platform, it's in my interest to not have it run into the ground. Alas, my "moral bashing" has apparently manifested this reality, and not Musk's alleged ability to learn from his mistakes

 

[Kaitzilla]

View attachment 671450

This is where we are now.

Elon Musk says progressive LA school has turned daughter into 'communist' who thinks 'anyone rich is evil'

Tesla CEO Elon Musk says that his daughter's progressive school has turned her into a communist that hates him for being rich, according to an upcoming biography.

www.foxbusiness.com

Musk tried to stay positive when he found out, but his child then became a "fervent Marxist and broke off all relations with him," the biography states.

"She went beyond socialism to being a full communist and thinking that anyone rich is evil," Musk said...
.
.
...Musk said that he felt his chid had become infected by a mindset that suppressed both "right-wing and anti-establishment voices," Isaacson wrote, similar to that of Twitter.

....

Did Musk buy Twitter because his kid broke off all relations with him?

**Edit**

I hope he didn't impulse buy Twitter for $40 billion and then spend all night playing video games because he was stressed out over it.

 

[Kyriakos]

I'd suppose that most of the people who are angry at Musk, are those who (for various reasons) relied on Twitter for some business, and suffer from the exposure. Twitter is - no two ways about it - vastly diminished since Musk bought it, and it hurts its users.

Imagine what would have happened if someone bought Youtube (won't be the case, since that's owned by Google, but you get the point) and then ruined it.

 

[raystuttgart]

I'd suppose that most of the people who are angry at Musk, ...

People being angry at him and his ways still does not make him a "fraud".
(Those are two totally different pairs of shoes that seem to get mixed now.)

 

[Gorbles]

If someone presents themselves as a successful businessperson, and immediately runs a company they bought into the ground, they are not a successful businessperson.

This is compounded when things come to light like there being entire teams (at the companies the individual hasn't run into the ground) responsible for keeping said person away from any developmental or product-related teams.

But sure. It's their success. Right.

 

[aelf]

Elon Musk may be arrogant, narcistic, eccentric and generally strange but so are many other rich and successful people as well.
Whatever one may think about his character there is no denying that still he worked hard and was able to learn from his failures.

There is also no denying his success. If the way he achieved it was always "morally" ok is a different question.
And sure, he was also lucky but that man is also one of the smartest and hardest business people of our time.

Tesla changed the automotive business considering eMobility and autonomous driving more than any other company.
So if you feel like calling that "fraud" ... ok. But there is simply no denying of the impact this man has had on our world.

Also there is no doubt that he risked again and again to start ventures that others would never have dared to even try.
His perseverance to stand up again and again after repeated failures is almost legendary and pretty rare these days.

Would I like to work for him ... definitely not. Would I like to be like him ... no I would not. Do I envy his success ... yeah I do.
But I really also do not think it matters to him at all what normal people like you and me think about him.

Summary:
I think he earned his success by hard work and perseverance and also a bit of luck.
- And that is not the definition of a "fraud".

Comment:
Personally I think all the moral bashing of successful people just serves to make people feel better or to justify their own lack of success.
As it makes it easier for people to overlook that they themselves were less smart, less diligent, less perseverant or just less lucky.

The cult of billionaires is funny.

 

[AdamCrock]

How did Elon got rich in the first place ?

 

[raystuttgart]

Never said he was successful with everything he did and tried in his life.
He e.g. failed several times really hard with Space X before still succeeding in the end.

Failure is part of business and usually comes before every success.
Only people that never take a risk never fail ...

And maybe he will run Twitter into the ground ... who knows.
`Maybe he will fail ... or succeed once more ... who knows.

But that still does not make him a fraud ...
It may only make him appear a bit more human.

presents themselves as a successful businessperson

So having founded several giant companies and being one of the richest men of the world ist just "presenting" to be successful ?
Well, I wonder how "real success" in the business world then looks like ... maybe it is how many followers and likes you have on Twitter?

The cult of billionaires is funny.

Trying to discredit somebody as a "cult boy" is also a way of argumenting.
It is definitely a lot easier than talking about the actual content of my post.

But all I said is that I admit his success ... not that I like him or admire him as a person.
So there is no "cult" involved ... I just do not get blinded by jealousy and anger.

 

[Gorbles]

So having founded several giant companies and being one of the richest men of the world ist just "presenting" to be successful ?

Yes?

If you determine all wealth as earned and fair, well, that's your assumption, not mine. But more than that, you completely ignored him already running Twitter into the ground.

If you don't know what he's done to Twitter, would you like to know? Would it change your opinion at all?

I just do not get blinded by jealousy and anger.

Trying to discredit somebody as being "blinded by jealousy and anger" is also a (poor) way of arguing

 

[aelf]

Trying to discredit somebody as a "cult boy" is also a way of argumenting.
It is definitely a lot easier than talking about the actual content of my post.

But all I said is that I admit his success ... not that I like him or admire him as a person.
So there is no "cult" involved ... I just do not get blinded by jealousy and anger.

Insisting that people must be jealous if they dislike someone is playground-level argument lol.

 

[EvaDK]

View attachment 671450

This is where we are now.

If this is who I think it is (the daughter), she broke all contact with her father because Elon couldn't accept that she is a transgender person.

'Communism' had nothing to do with it. It's all about a father that couldn't accept his own child, according to the child.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Elon Musk may be arrogant, narcistic, eccentric and generally strange but so are many other rich and successful people as well.
Whatever one may think about his character there is no denying that still he worked hard and was able to learn from his failures.

There is also no denying his success. If the way he achieved it was always "morally" ok is a different question.
And sure, he was also lucky but that man is also one of the smartest and hardest business people of our time.

Tesla changed the automotive business considering eMobility and autonomous driving more than any other company.
So if you feel like calling that "fraud" ... ok. But there is simply no denying of the impact this man has had on our world.

Also there is no doubt that he risked again and again to start ventures that others would never have dared to even try.
His perseverance to stand up again and again after repeated failures is almost legendary and pretty rare these days.

Would I like to work for him ... definitely not. Would I like to be like him ... no I would not. Do I envy his success ... yeah I do.
But I really also do not think it matters to him at all what normal people like you and me think about him.

Summary:
I think he earned his success by hard work and perseverance and also a bit of luck.
- And that is not the definition of a "fraud".

Comment:
Personally I think all the moral bashing of successful people just serves to make people feel better or to justify their own lack of success.
As it makes it easier for people to overlook that they themselves were less smart, less diligent, less perseverant or just less lucky.

He was born into wealth lmao

 

[Broken_Erika]

I've said it before and i'll say it again. Elon Musk is a money man, he's the guy who provides money to firms with ideas he finds cool, and then takes all credit for their success. And he got his initial money via inheritence from his daddy's South African Emerald Mine.

 

[r16]

hmm , indeed the two sides of the same coin . Guess attacking Musk but ignoring people with less "success" is a conspiracy , too . Anyhow anyone with a whole planet is bound to be richer than Musk , and this is how this argument will end .

 

[raystuttgart]

He was born into wealth lmao

And that makes him a fraud or less successful?

But more than that, you completely ignored him already running Twitter into the ground.

Because that still would not make him a "fraud" - it is also not the topic of this thread.

Elon Musk is a money man,

Yes, he was born lucky. Still does not make him less successful or evil.

--------

So I get it, people are angry at him for Twitter.
That still is no argument for calling him a "fraud".

All I read here is about bashing a succesful business man by trying to frame him.
All posts I read were trying to frame his character in some personal or politcal way.

The complete thread seems to be about bashing another one of these "evil elites" for personal reasons.
But ok if framing Elon Musk as a "fraud" or whatever somehow makes you feel better ... go on with it.

--------

In the old days we were burning women on stakes as scapegoates for the problems of society ... a simple method to distract the simple minded.
Today society does just the same with those "evil elites" ... because it is so much easier to blame others for ones own problems than to actual work to solve them.