I wonder why religion are able to thrive and prosper so much in the remaining superpower USA while Europe is pretty much secularised. Is it because Europeans are generally better educated? Are we in our nature more skeptical to religion than Americans? Or because Darwin was from Europe?
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- Thread starter Danielos
- Start date
I wonder why religion are able to thrive and prosper so much in the remaining superpower USA while Europe is pretty much secularised. Is it because Europeans are generally better educated? Are we in our nature more skeptical to religion than Americans? Or because Darwin was from Europe?
Winner
Diverse in Unity
Well, Europe is more urbanized and has been more urbanized for longer than the US, which naturally favored non-religiosity. Also, in Europe religion has pretty much discredited itself throughout the history (which is full of religious conflict and controversy), whereas in America religion has been welcomed as a basis of their new, free country (among the original settlers, there were many people who fled religious persecution in Europe - and they very usually very zealous). European education is generally secular, while the American schools aren't.
There are probably dozens of other reasons, these are the ones I can think of right now. Tradition (either strongly religious or secular) imho plays an important rule. For example, the first Czechoslovak republic was very anti-clerical (Catholic Church was being associated with the hated Austro-Hungarian rule) and there was strong intellectual opposition towards religion. As a result of this (and other factors) Czech Rep. is abnormally irreligious compared to other Central European countries like Poland, Austria or Slovakia.
Is that so?
Also bear in mind that to have a nice debate, you truly only need 1 or 2 good fellows. The forums could have 1000 atheists and 5 theists, but it would still be nice if the theists are competent at debating and do so whenever religious threads pop up.
Not just the theists, either.
classical_hero
In whom I trust
Well most of the Theists here generally keep quiet, except on a few occasions, since most of the talk by the Atheists here would raise a lot of 
in many of the hard hitting Christian forums. Many of us just prefer to talk about the game rather than our beliefs, which is a shame, since we do need to be as vocal as the Atheists on this board. So to speak, get the message out.
You can see that I am the first Theist to speak on here after 25 posts, (at time of writing, just in case it changes during all this typing), which is often what happens when religion gets discussed, plus many people also recognise that it is hard to talk to some of the ardent Atheists, since they often more fanatical about their unbelief than most Theists are about their belief.
in many of the hard hitting Christian forums. Many of us just prefer to talk about the game rather than our beliefs, which is a shame, since we do need to be as vocal as the Atheists on this board. So to speak, get the message out.You can see that I am the first Theist to speak on here after 25 posts, (at time of writing, just in case it changes during all this typing), which is often what happens when religion gets discussed, plus many people also recognise that it is hard to talk to some of the ardent Atheists, since they often more fanatical about their unbelief than most Theists are about their belief.
Well, I think a big factor is also the response from a religious person. Whenever a religious debate thread pops up, there are a few immediate internal responses in theists. I think the majority of them will have this response:
"I am offended!"
"That is wrong, I won't bother with this"
"Once again, atheists trying to prove God is dead (or such)"
And will likely not post anything or bother with the discussion. Some will just shut down and ignore it because it assaults their fundamental beliefs. Few theists will actually think:
"I will debate this."
Not just for psychological reasons. They also have to be interested in such a discussion.
"I am offended!"
"That is wrong, I won't bother with this"
"Once again, atheists trying to prove God is dead (or such)"
And will likely not post anything or bother with the discussion. Some will just shut down and ignore it because it assaults their fundamental beliefs. Few theists will actually think:
"I will debate this."
Not just for psychological reasons. They also have to be interested in such a discussion.
SS-18 ICBM
Oscillator
If it's a problem, there's other forums, you know.
Nylan
Characters Welcome
Hi
There are probably just as many theist provocations and atheist provocations, honestly, but things do tend to get nasty when religion is discussed in general.
You may not even know a theist if you see one, since theists don't all support the same beliefs and as such a number are likely to criticize any particular theological stance as well...and that doesn't make them atheists.
Ziggy Stardust
Absolutely Sane
Do you mean this by provocation Danielos?Well most of the Theists here generally keep quiet, except on a few occasions, since most of the talk by the Atheists here would raise a lot of
You can see that I am the first Theist to speak on here after 25 posts, (at time of writing, just in case it changes during all this typing), which is often what happens when religion gets discussed, plus many people also recognise that it is hard to talk to some of the ardent Atheists, since they often more fanatical about their unbelief than most Theists are about their belief.
What's the problem with it?
Nylan
Characters Welcome
You can think all you want, but if you're not using proper reasoning, nothing will come of it. Hence, your previous argument.
caketastydelish
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2008
- Messages
- 9,718
I always imagined the most athiest country would be China since the government discourages religion.
Yes, if being atheist means you believe there is a very high chance of UFO's attacking in near future.
Religious people don't sit around and think about God. (Well, they do, but not in the causal way you put)
They are indoctrinated from birth, and that's why they believe. When their family, their friends, and their community all believe in this religion, they are very unlikely to have any desire to cease their belief. So when something comes along that challenges their belief, they stand strong, because to acknowledge their belief is wrong does the following:
1) It means that all those people are wrong.
2) It means that all they've believed so far has been wrong.
3) It means that they will now become alienated from those people.
Is it truly any wonder that they are so resistant and shut down in the face of religious debate? There's nothing to be gained from something that can do the above 3 but give nothing in return (perceptually).
***
Now to be fair, I have applied the same criteria for myself and atheism, and while it still holds a bit true, it isn't as strong in my opinion. I would become alienated and somewhat ashamed in my family if I started to believe in "fairy tales" and "delusions". However, most of my friends and communities aren't necessarily based around my atheism.
When I interact with people, I try to not touch the subject of religion at all (and I bet other atheists do this as well), and I generally don't associate with communities that would be simply as a matter of atheism (like churches on the other side). If I change my religious stance, I don't have to think that most of my friends will be thinking or telling me "But what about Jesus? He has loved you all this time, and he has offered you salvation, and now you turn your back to him??".
It's a bit more fickle when you're religious and you're integrated with everything. I've been to church, and I've seen how nice and close they are to each other. That makes it harder to break off, but most importantly, make it harder to even think of breaking off, or contemplate something that would imply that you might end up breaking off.
Interesting, and wow, seriously, France takes the cake for being the most non-spiritual country out there! No wonder Americans hate the French so much
In general, I think the trends we're reflecting are the demographics about the Internet in general - vast numbers of younger people, and on top of that CFC has a large majority of males. I wouldn't particularly say that CFC is more non-religious than other places on the Internet, or at least similar themed places (take your pick of another gaming site, ie. not something like Myspace). However, as I'm sure many of us realize, we do seem to have an amazingly special mix of people that surpasses anything else I've ever seen on the Internet in general intelligence and attitude. Nowhere else is able to come so close to chasing trolls away and leaving them with no incentive to come back, while we really do have input and serious debate from people with all sorts of beliefs. Though I can see how something like the recent discussion over Fifty "infiltrating" a Christian church can push buttons with some theists
Of course, my analysis cannot encompass all religious people. But I do think it sums up quite nicely why it is hard for most to... deconvert (for a lack of a better word).
RedRalph
Deity
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- Jun 12, 2007
- Messages
- 20,708
Agreed.....
