"Islam is violent! Just read the Koran to see for yourself!"

[warpus]

You can be the follower of any holy book (including the Bible) and still be wrong.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I believe you are missing the fact that Islam is link to these suicide bombing as Baneblade pointed out.

If this is directed at me, your post is a shining example of missing my point.

You see you can't condemn Osama bin Laden actions with the Koran

Yes you can, you can condemn it using the Koran and you can support them using the Koran. Both have been done for many of years allready.

nor show he is less of a Muslims nor less of a follower of Islam.

I didn't say he was, since I am not going to define what a muslim should be doing to be a follower of Islam. Are you saying he is more of a muslim ot more of a follower of Islam than the people I mentioned?

The Bible even in the OT condemns someone taking matters in his own hand.

And in other places it supports them.

A good example is Moses who murdered that Egyptian guard thinking he was doing God's bidding. The scriptures clearly show Moses wasn't. It was 40 years latter when God called Moses to lead the children out of Egypt and even then he didn't act alone.

Wow. An example. Colour me unimpressed

It's true that most Muslims are peaceful yet it's hard to make the claim these suicide bombers are in the wrong and not followers of the Koran.

These suicide bombers are in the wrong. They are followers of an interpretation of the Koran.

You never contradicted anything I said

 

[fishjie]

well technically, jesus did away with everything in the old testemant. believers are called upon to imitate christ. since jesus never killed anyone, and instead called upon people to "turn the other cheek" and "love your enemies" you can say that christianity is inherently peaceful (note too, that NONE of his followers, the 12 apostles + paul, hurt anyone either, EXCEPT for Peter who cut off the high priest's servants ear, who get REBUKED). judaism on the other hand, IS incredibly violent (and indeed, you see jews kicking ass), as demonstrated by the genocides in judges and joshua and etc. so is islam (and indeed, you see muslims kicking ass).

as for the "sword" quote jesus said, im pretty sure thats referring to doing away with the old testemant. indeed he did wage war on the pharisees, but it was a peaceful war, one where he got killed as a result.

either way, its irrelevant, since 99% of christians have never even read the bible.

 

[Smidlee]

Yes you can, you can condemn it using the Koran and you can support them using the Koran. Both have been done for many of years allready.

I would say Osama bin Laden is closer to the acts of Muhammad than anyone else today especially those you quoted. So I fail to see how you are going to use the Koran to condemn his actions.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I would say Osama bin Laden is closer to the acts of Muhammad than anyone else today especially those you quoted.

Yes, you would say that.

So I fail to see how you are going to use the Koran to condemn his actions.

Indeed, I believe you do.

 

[HannibalBarka]

I would say Osama bin Laden is closer to the acts of Muhammad than anyone else today especially those you quoted. So I fail to see how you are going to use the Koran to condemn his actions.

I would say Jesus and his father are/is closer to the acts of Hitler than any one else. They were happy to commit genocide against innocent people, kill kids newly born, and wipe out almost all humanity under water. How can you worship such a family of murderers and claim you are following a religion of peace?

 

[aronnax]

You're an appeaser, and obviously without knowledge.

There are 150 sentences in the Koran promoting/demanding violence and supression versus unbelievers.

Out of a total of 63175......

Over 80% of the muslims polled IN THE UK are in favour of Shariah law.
SHARIAH LAW! You know, women are dirty, unbelievers are "Untermenschen" and thiefs and woman who have sex with whom they want should be hacked to pieces.

Its more like only 40%. And when they say Sharia Law, i believe they meant a more mordern, more reformed more secular version of it.

From Wiki

Secularists believe the law of the state should be based on secular principles, not on Islamic legal theory.
Traditionalists believe that the law of the state should be based on the traditional legal schools. However, traditional legal views are considered unacceptable by most modern Muslims, especially in areas like women's rights or slavery.[6]
Reformers believe that new Islamic legal theories can produce modernized Islamic law [7] and lead to acceptable opinions in areas such as women's rights.[8]
Salafis believe that the traditional schools were wrong, and therefore failed, and strive to follow the generation of early Muslims.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/02/19/nsharia19.xml
Also in this link

Four out of 10 British Muslims want sharia law introduced into parts of the country, a survey reveals today.

The ICM opinion poll also indicates that a fifth have sympathy with the "feelings and motives" of the suicide bombers who attacked London last July 7, killing 52 people, although 99 per cent thought the bombers were wrong to carry out the atrocity

as for your 100 or so terrorists, http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/,
notice the counter on the left-hand side.

Notice its a very bias website? Insolent .......

And then tell me how many large scale muslim demonstrations against terrorism you have seen since 9/11 ?

Google it stupid.......http://www.google.com.sg/search?svn...inst terrorism &oe=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw

As for stupid and unnecessary crusade comparisons:
a) When did the last happen?
b) The first Crusade began in 1095… 460 years after the first Christian city was overrun by Muslim armies, 457 years after Jerusalem was conquered by Muslim armies, 453 years after Egypt was taken by Muslim armies, 443 after Muslims first plundered Italy, 427 years after Muslim armies first laid siege to the Christian capital of Constantinople, 380 years after Spain was conquered by Muslim armies, 363 years after France was first attacked by Muslim armies, 249 years after Rome itself was sacked by a Muslim army, and only after centuries of church burnings, killings, enslavement and forced conversions of Christians.

Okay this bit i was wrong but i do feel like pointing out this old old old line
The muslim never masscared the citizen both times they took it while the Christians killed every christian, Jew and muslim inside....


Like the 5 or 7 people killed by the crazy abortionist fundies in the last 35 years?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Liberation_Front_of_Tripura
And then tell me how many christians doesn't react with "It's a shame" or "These people are psychotic" and instead start arguing how they are suppressed by imperialists, democrats, americans and the jewish world conspiracy?

Ten Characters

 

[BaneBlade]

Ten Characters

Religionofpeace is a biased webside with an agenda. Like all people and organisations. Luckily for them they don't have to lie to further their agenda, as long as there are multiple muslim terrorist attacks a day.
And only 40% of british muslims want shariah. geeh, now i'm happy. We only have some 3-5% Nazi supporter in some small parts of the country. let's sit back and relax.
As for the blabla of reformation, just look at islamic countries. Not one which comes even near to our perception of human rights and democracy. Or look how people who want reformation are treated by the majority.

As for your your ridiculous number-screwing, the koran is the word of god for most muslims, that's the reason why they constantly . .. .. .. .. . one against the other.
The only thing they are sure of is that the small alevitian minority(which are largely peacefull and tolerant) are no muslims.
IIRC the prophet mentioned on 3 or 4 occassions that dogs are filthy creatures that should largely be put down, that was enough to give them a stigma/bad name in the arab world until today.

 

[BaneBlade]

I would say Jesus and his father are/is closer to the acts of Hitler than any one else. They were happy to commit genocide against innocent people, kill kids newly born, and wipe out almost all humanity under water. How can you worship such a family of murderers and claim you are following a religion of peace?

Stupid and unnecessary.
For one, there's the new and old testament, and alll mainstream christians agree that the the new is our guide=Jesus rolemodel.
As for your god comparison, yeah well, as soon as we get godhood i would expect a lot of floodbased christian terrror. Ever seen a christian claim god as a rolemodel?

Muslim's claim Mohammed as a rolemodell= warfare, massacres, lying, suppression of women, suppression of unbelievers and . .. .. .. .ing 9 year old girls.

 

[HannibalBarka]

Religionofpeace is a biased webside with an agenda. Like all people and organisations. Luckily for them they don't have to lie to further their agenda, as long as there are multiple muslim terrorist attacks a day.
And only 40% of british muslims want shariah. geeh, now i'm happy. We only have some 3-5% Nazi supporter in some small parts of the country. let's sit back and relax.

Well about the same percent of american are for torture, so yeah nothing to be paniking about, just relax buddy

As for the blabla of reformation, just look at islamic countries. Not one which comes even near to our perception of human rights and democracy. Or look how people who want reformation are treated by the majority.

Are you talking about Islamic countries like Rwanda? Liberia? Haiti? Cuba or Belaruss?

 

[HannibalBarka]

Stupid and unnecessary.
For one, there's the new and old testament, and alll mainstream christians agree that the the new is our guide=Jesus rolemodel.
As for your god comparison, yeah well, as soon as we get godhood i would expect a lot of floodbased christian terrror. Ever seen a christian claim god as a rolemodel?

God the Son is your model? isn't he? And His Father is your Lord, isn't he?

Muslim's claim Mohammed as a rolemodell= Warfare, massacres, lying, suppression of women, suppression of unbelievers and . .. .. .. .ing 9 year old girls.

That is maybe true, . .. .. .. .ing one 9 year old girl is wrong, killing entire cities, including all 9 years old girls, is sick, and that's what The Lord you worship did, many times

 

[aronnax]

Religionofpeace is a biased webside with an agenda. Like all people and organisations. Luckily for them they don't have to lie to further their agenda, as long as there are multiple muslim terrorist attacks a day.
And only 40% of british muslims want shariah. geeh, now i'm happy. We only have some 3-5% Nazi supporter in some small parts of the country. let's sit back and relax.
As for the blabla of reformation, just look at islamic countries. Not one which comes even near to our perception of human rights and democracy. Or look how people who want reformation are treated by the majority.

I have to agree with you on this point, but we have to give them time to develope, just like the other Countries of Europe during the industrial and modern era. I believe the best form of adopted sharia law used in the goverment is in Malaysia where it only applies to Muslims are more reasonable. But it still has quite a long way to go before it is up to Uk or France. But until then stop thinking Islam is some violent religion. Those bombers? sure they are plenty of them but every religion at some point has their extremists. We have to wait till the next generation is all educated properly so as to stop this .

 

[aronnax]

Stupid and unnecessary.
For one, there's the new and old testament, and alll mainstream christians agree that the the new is our guide=Jesus rolemodel.
As for your god comparison, yeah well, as soon as we get godhood i would expect a lot of floodbased christian terrror. Ever seen a christian claim god as a rolemodel?

Muslim's claim Mohammed as a rolemodell= warfare, massacres, lying, suppression of women, suppression of unbelievers and . .. .. .. .ing 9 year old girls.

Now your being unreasonable

Do you know Islam had actually elevated Woman's rights. See for yourself
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_Islam

Mohammed never massacred outside battle what a lie

There were Jews in Medina, none of them were forced to convert
And he never did it with a 9 year old girl.

Man your such a bias piece of bodily waste, talking before thinking. You have constanly flame Islam. Did you see me taking much of a swing at Christianity?

 

[Pannonius]

Muslims also believe in Old Testament God! They believe Muhammad is the last of his prophets. So it looks that they also believe in this "genocidal monster", don't they?

 

[aronnax]

Tell me Pannonius. Tell me what actions of Genocide has the Prophet done?

 

[BaneBlade]

Now your being unreasonable

Do you know Islam had actually elevated Woman's rights. See for yourself
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_Islam

Mohammed never massacred outside battle what a lie

There were Jews in Medina, none of them were forced to convert
And he never did it with a 9 year old girl.

Man your such a bias piece of bodily waste, talking before thinking. You have constanly flame Islam. Did you see me taking much of a swing at Christianity?

You can have a swing at christianity as much as you like, what do you think how often i laughed about good caricature about my countrymen or fellow christians?
What i don't don't like are stupid, biased, PC lies with the intent to hide that there is a real problem with Islam, here, now, in our countrys.
As for pederastie, when did Mohammed marry Aisha and when did they "execute" the marriage?

Elevated woman's right status? Compared to what? Anarchy and mass-raping?

Tell me Pannonius. Tell me what actions of Genocide has the Prophet done?

He was referencing to the old testament, which is arguably part of islamic heritage, too.

And Aronnax, i don't want to say you are xenophobic, imperialistic ect.
I have good friends who are alevitian muslims, but don't you see that we have a lot of problems with this extremists, and they are refering their actions at the Koran?

I'm talking from a european POV, and we have a lot of problems here.

 

[HannibalBarka]

Muslims also believe in Old Testament God! They believe Muhammad is the last of his prophets. So it looks that they also believe in this "genocidal monster", don't they?

Oh sure, that is why all this argument is "hypocrite" seen from an atheist point of view Seeing a Christian yelling at Muslims or a Muslim yelling at Christians "Your God is a bastard and a murderer, and your religion is no religion of peace while my God is all nice and peacefull " is hilarious since they share the same God

 

[Pannonius]

Tell me Pannonius. Tell me what actions of Genocide has the Prophet done?

I was saying that Moslems, Christians and Jews believe in the same God, so no one can say "but christians believe in a genocidal maniac". Yes they do, as all abrahamic monotheistic religions.
Moslems aded Koran, and christians added New Testament to this. But they all believe in that earlier stuff too.

 

[El_Machinae]

Now your being unreasonable

Do you know Islam had actually elevated Woman's rights. See for yourself
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_Islam

I can accept that. Unfortunately, after elevating women's rights, it then brought the process to screeching halt by adding unnecessary and harmful restrictions on womens' rights.

 

[Squonk]

Now your being unreasonable

Mohammed never massacred outside battle what a lie

What did he do with Banu Qurayza?
Also, I recall a female poet killed with his blessing, and another reknown poet that was chased for writing bad about him and had to be write a praise of him to save his life. The poem's title is "burkah"

And he never did it with a 9 year old girl.

what was A'isha's age when they did it?