Jon Stewart is to blame for Trump.

[Lexicus]

Only assuming that by average he meant median. If we make that assumption the statement doesn't even have anything to do with intelligence. Half of all Americans are smaller than the median American body height. Half of all Americans are poorer than the median American wealth.

IQ has the additional property that it is (intended to) create a normally distributed value over its sample set (e.g. all Americans), as Tim mentioned. In that case the median is also the mean (i.e. IQ = 100). But Gori never mentioned IQ, so I don't think the (legitimate) criticisms of IQ as a metric of intelligence apply, not to mention that they are beside the point in the first place.

I know all this, my point is that height and wealth are (relatively easily) reducible to single numbers but I don't think intelligence is (said nothing at all about IQ and Gori's comment didn't mention it either). Gori's comment only works if you reduce intelligence to a number and give every American a value.

(and yes, I know it was a joke)

 

[Leoreth]

Okay, I just wanted to avoid potential confusion around it being related to any flaw in measuring intelligence.

Of course you could also argue that it's impossible to say who among two people is more intelligent (and I think I'd agree), but that's an even more different point.

/end of tangent

 

[Gori the Grey]

I was just goofing, ab.

I get stats like this from the Quinapalus Institute, mostly.

 

[warpus]

Great satire there, OP

 

[Cutlass]

Maybe I am misunderstanding you, but the opening post featured an article by a leftie claiming Jon Stewart is to blame for Trump.

Not by or about us smug righties.

Can dish it out, but you can't take it, is that it?


The whole point about Stewart, as someone was pointing out upthread, is that most of what he did was call out hypocrisy. And in the US in recent decades, the hypocrisy has overwhelmingly been on the right. And this is a case in point: Paul Ryan comes up with a plan to literally make poor, mostly colored, American children hungry for the purpose of giving that money to rich white people. Nearly every conservative in America signs on to the plan. And then they all went to church to congratulate themselves on what good Christians they are.

That's smugness = (Stewart*Colbert)^3

But no, the whimpering whiners have to blame Stewart for Trump. As if they didn't do it themselves.

Modern American conservatism fundamentally rejects the concept that people are responsible for their own actions. And this is a prime example of the phenomenon.

 

[Kyriakos]

I do think that the comedians being political factors to this degree is a sign of certain decadence, of course. Goes without saying that said decadence is not triggered by its effect (comedians in this role). It still makes things all the worst.

Don't worry though, political satire popularity tends to end by the time of the Syracusan campaign. Which is almost here already.
After that the only next stage is the Aigos Potamoi battle.

 

[Cheetah]

If political commentaries were handled properly, there wouldn't be much of a market for comedians to have fun with it. Then they'd only touch on more ridiculous parts, or make comedy about other topics.

However, everything is political, and the act of actively avoiding current politics is certainly a political statement as well.

 

[abradley]

Can dish it out, but you can't take it, is that it?


The whole point about Stewart, as someone was pointing out upthread, is that most of what he did was call out hypocrisy. And in the US in recent decades, the hypocrisy has overwhelmingly been on the right. And this is a case in point: Paul Ryan comes up with a plan to literally make poor, mostly colored, American children hungry for the purpose of giving that money to rich white people. Nearly every conservative in America signs on to the plan. And then they all went to church to congratulate themselves on what good Christians they are.

That's smugness = (Stewart*Colbert)^3

But no, the whimpering whiners have to blame Stewart for Trump. As if they didn't do it themselves.

Modern American conservatism fundamentally rejects the concept that people are responsible for their own actions. And this is a prime example of the phenomenon.

No, I can take it ... start a thread about the right wing gentlemen and we'll discuss them.

But this thread is about Stewart and his followers producing the Trump phenomenon.

Satire is great but (IMHO) it stifles discussion as some Stewart wannabes prove on this thread/forum.

As for the'Whimper Whiner' bit, the OP was written by a leftie.

 

[Cutlass]

Well you don't actually know that do you, because you don't even know who it is, or anything about that person.

 

[abradley]

Well you don't actually know that do you, because you don't even know who it is, or anything about that person.

Did you actually read the article?

The flavor of the article sez it all, like:

No single event or trend initiated the takeoff of Space Shuttle Trump. It’s not just white lower- and middle-class resentment; it’s not just nationwide frustration with whatever “The Establishment” means to a particular voter; it’s not just a chance for white supremacists to pour out of the woodwork.

That's in the first paragraph and imo sets the tone.

 

[abradley]

I was just goofing, ab.

I get stats like this from the Quinapalus Institute, mostly.

Ahhhh, so your posting the US has lower intelligence and following that with 'just look it up' was just a joke.

OK.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Ahhhh, so your posting the US has lower intelligence and following that with 'just look it up' was just a joke.

OK.

This would have been a brilliant riposte, except for the fact that he posted nothing of the kind.

Since he posted nothing of the kind it is just a blatant lie on your part.

Nothing unexpected.

 

[Lexicus]

This would have been a brilliant riposte, except for the fact that he posted nothing of the kind.

Since he posted nothing of the kind it is just a blatant lie on your part.

Nothing unexpected.

abradley still doesn't really understand Gori's original post that started this whole thing, methinks.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

abradley still doesn't really understand Gori's original post that started this whole thing, methinks.

Did you hear that going over your head, or were your ears muffled?

Let me explain...slowly.

Spoiler :

Intelligence distributes on a curve called the normal distribution.

The peak is at average, mean, and median, which are all equal in value.

The two sides of the curve are symmetrical.

Following so far?


Okay, good.

So, mathematically, the number of above average is exactly equal to the number of below average.

Still with me?

So, the number of above average is ALWAYS less than the number of below average plus the number who are exactly average.

I did my best to explain it to him, but I think he has me on ignore.

He treats me like a fact.

 

[Gori the Grey]

Deadpanning that it was a fact that could be looked up was part of the joke, ab (the best part, if I may be allowed an opinion).

 

[abradley]

Deadpanning that it was a fact that could be looked up was part of the joke, ab (the best part, if I may be allowed an opinion).

Yes, but I've seen actual discussions about the difference in intelligence between Europeans and Americans.

Usually starts with something like your post, but their post was meant to be factual. So I thought you were aiming in that direction.

Thank you for your reply.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Yes, but I've seen actual discussions about the difference in intelligence between Europeans and Americans.

Usually starts with something like your post, but their post was meant to be factual. So I thought you were aiming in that direction.

Thank you for your reply.

Apparently you still don't get it. His post was a fact. Dead. Straight. Indisputable. Mathematical. Fact.

 

[civvver]

I don't really get it. I don't think anyone leaves the democrat party or votes for trump cus of liberal smugness but cus they're being told hey this policy and that policy is great for you but aren't seeing the results. Middle class wages have stagnated and disposable income has eroded over the past decade due to rising health care and education costs without additional gains in income, loss of blue collar jobs etc. A lot of those blue collar demographic households are disenfranchised with the current system. And since the dems have been in charge for last 8 years they're ready to switch. It was kind of the same thing that happened in 2008 with hope and change for obama, only that movement was led more by disenfranchised young people and minorities who weren't getting anything out of republican policies, not middle class families.

However I do think the media had a lot to do with trump winning the primary. He got so much free coverage and advertising, even if they were saying nasty things, his exposure was so high and that has to help him with people who don't really look at the issues.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I don't really get it. I don't think anyone leaves the democrat party or votes for trump cus of liberal smugness but cus they're being told hey this policy and that policy is great for you but aren't seeing the results. Middle class wages have stagnated and disposable income has eroded over the past decade due to rising health care and education costs without additional gains in income, loss of blue collar jobs etc. A lot of those blue collar demographic households are disenfranchised with the current system. And since the dems have been in charge for last 8 years they're ready to switch. It was kind of the same thing that happened in 2008 with hope and change for obama, only that movement was led more by disenfranchised young people and minorities who weren't getting anything out of republican policies, not middle class families.

However I do think the media had a lot to do with trump winning the primary. He got so much free coverage and advertising, even if they were saying nasty things, his exposure was so high and that has to help him with people who don't really look at the issues.

Thing is that those people who don't really look at the issues are too few to carry the day.

People who do look at the issues are being brought around to disagreement with your statement I bolded. The problem the Republicans can't get around is of their own making...they have elevated Reagan to sainthood. That can make it pretty easy to point out that we have been following Republican policy for the past thirty-five years. Reagan set in motion the wealth consolidation process and there has been no way since then, other than a brief two year window, to reverse or even significantly slow that process.

The current issue driven voter mostly recognizes that the whole "tax cuts made the economy boom" story of the eighties is patently false. Good old Keynsian intervention, Roosevelt style, in the form of massive military spending, is what created the boom. The handing over of the benefits of the boom to the select wasn't really necessary, and is the source of pretty much all the economic and societal ills we currently face.

So, yes, it IS time for a change. But the change it is time for is to see what the Democrats can actually do. We've seen that it only takes one house of congress to keep the bad policy in place. So the path to real change is obvious, and until that path is taken the pressure is only going to build.

 

[Cutlass]

Well....

There actually wasn't a boom at all in the 80s. You don't get a boom when you don't have business investment. And there was no business investment while Reagan was in office. Cutting the personal income tax rate does not result in increased business investment.