LK130 - Ottomans, Monarchy, Balanced Map

[lukep]

About civics, Emancipation & US are no brainer.
However, Nationhood or Free speech ? we dont need the gold, but the 100% culture would help for the indian cities
Free religion would be great for hapiness but would probably cost us Brennus being friendly.

And can we hit domination without attacking Brennus and Ghandi ?
If no, the more we wait, the bloodier it would be.

 

[GreyFox]

About civics, Emancipation & US are no brainer.
However, Nationhood or Free speech ? we dont need the gold, but the 100% culture would help for the indian cities

Why would we want to move away from bureaucracy to either? Just build/buy the Hermitage at Bombay or something like that. A You don't respond to a local problem with a global solution.

Free religion and UniSuff would make more sense to consider.

And can we hit domination without attacking Brennus and Ghandi ?
If no, the more we wait, the bloodier it would be.

Now, that will be 2 schools of thought: attack the stronger first vs attack the weaker first. It depends on situation, me thinks. Personally, with us in tech lead, delaying the war against Brennus would probably be to our advantage since we would undoubtedly tech faster than he does. I would go for Isabella first ... distance cost is no issue since Freddie has kindly provided us with another palace.

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[Admiral Kutzov]

If no, the more we wait, the bloodier it would be.

beeline to bombers. IIRC, that gets us tanks on the way.

I'd like to see Brenny and Ragnar at war with each other. Maybe bribe Gandhi into something?

Bella seems like the natural target since our forces will be there anyway.

US, nationhood, emancipation, free market and free religion? If we're going domination, I'd like to be able to draft. sidetrack for facism?

Free religion should be okay. IIRC we've got at least one hindu monestary.

gandhi is a problem because of his borders. ragnar cause of his teching. Brenny cause he keeps building military. tanks should solve all of the above especially since we've got a monopoly on infantry for the moment.

It will be interesting to see how LK weighs in on this.

 

[GreyFox]

I probably would revolt to UniSuff and Free Religion (after some more hindu miss prod), and a little build up and setting up for Lee to declare on Freddie again.

Anything else to add before I play?

 

[LKendter]

I may be able to take a five minute look late tonight, but I can't comment right now. Heading out the door in 2 minutes...

 

[GreyFox]

I would play tomorrow morning ... your "tonight".

 

[LKendter]

New Updates
My civics votes:
1) Government -
I marginally vote for Universal Suffrage. That is mostly for the hammer from towns. I would prefer extra cash be used to upgrade troops.

2) Legal -
Delay any decision until after the Statue of Liberty is complete. I don't want to lose that wonder.
Long term I want nationhood, or Globe Theater is useless. If the team doesn't want nationhood, then cancel building the GT.

3) Labor -
Emancipation is automatic. We don't need a source of misery.

4) Economy -
State property once we research communism. Leave it alone for now.

5) Religion -
I vote against free religion. This is great for a space race, but we don't need it for domination. In addition, I want to stay friendly with Brennus until we declare war. Keeping the shared religion bonus is huge.


On the war target - I vote for finish of Germany next. However, I don't see this until at least my round. With our number 1 and 2 military cities on factories, we need time to get back on troop duty.


For the tech path I vote scientific method, combustion and industrialism. That should give us the needed edge to wrap this up. Our tech lead is so strong I think that will be enough to win. Since I see up keeping OR the rest of the game, I am not to worried about more monasteries.


Team Question -
Are we giving up on a GP farm? I notice zero GP hired at our NE city of Ulundi.

For our next GP I vote to hold toward a GA.



Roster
LKendter (on deck)
Lukep
Admiral Kutzov
GreyFox (currently playing) - and already got it.

Remember 15 peace / 10 war turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: domination.

Planned wars - round 2 in Germany.


Small wonders
Heroic Epic - Edirne
Globe Theater - Berlin
Wall Street - Unum
Oxford - Konya
Forbidden Palace - Nobamba.
National Epic - Ulundi
Iron Works - Bula.

 

[GreyFox]

I would like to give free religion some thought. First off, it's free (if we revolt together with UniSuff and Emanic). Secondly it is not entirely abt research, it is also abt culture and happiness. Bombay will instantly gain +10 culture for the double shrines.

I do agree we do not have enough ground troops to restart the war with Germans.

I personally think going nationhood for this game is moot. Yes, it is great strat to draft with GT in some situations. But we have at least two production cities and is #1 in prod and power. Giving up bureaucracy for that up for the ability to draft 1 unit every 5 turns (the food surplus in Berlin isn't all that great) where the two production cities can in combination produce 1 unit every turn is ... pfffbt. Even vassalage is a better choice than nationhood.

Playing now. I would forgo the free of anarchy revolt to free religion for now, since we are in disagreement.

 

[LKendter]

I think we need some more thoughts on Nationhood. I didn't think it was that strong, and GF dislikes it. Between the two that is going away from it. That would change my play this round, as I would kill GT. I see three uses for GT:
1) Whipping mania
2) Draft mania
3) Artist factory along with NE.
Only #2 is even possible this game. Can we get more team opionion on nationhood?

 

[GreyFox]

Quiet set of turns, nothing significant to report.

On trading front, gained us 5 more gold, and denied Brennus a happy resource.

On economy, got us Erickson. Instead of allowing him to go explore and found Canada, he settled in Wall Street instead.

On civics, waiting until a city come out of revolt for me to apply the whip for one last time before changing us to UniSuff and Emancipation. Cost me 3 turns of anarchy.

On military, nothing much. I keep adding infantries and some cannons to 4 places, one of them in Brennus land one tile north-west of hanover.

Tried to get the GG from Fascism, but I think Brennus beat us to it. He will pay for this some day.

As a result we are one turn away from SciMeth. Lee can review if we have enough monasteries and decide if to delay it. I have a confused and a jewish missuses down south waiting for the war to be declared to immediately convert some of the newly added cities.

In my opinion, we could declare middle of (or even early) next turnset.

After Germany, I suggest an invasion of Spain.

>>> The Save at 1670AD <<<

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Planned Wars: Germany (Round 2), then Spain. After German War II, we should probably get some combat settlers ready for the spanish.

GF has persuaded me on Nationhood. pfffbt.

 

[lukep]

Round 2 should be short as the WW with Fred will kick in fast.
And we have a problem, as last german city wont be accessible without declaring on Isabella, and we have no idea on how many forces are in Cordoba. She is rather low on power though, and likely got most of her forces near Ragnar.

We have no navy unfortunately

Research wise, i would go to biology after sci met, to let our cities growth again, especially useful for Ulundi and Bula

We have facsism, we should build Mount Rushmore too

 

[GreyFox]

Spain is willing to open border though ....

 

[LKendter]

See it, though I may simple look at the game tonight for more feedback questions.

I already caught a lost commuincations as we setteled the GM. With our empire size I would have prefferred holding him as half a GA.


In addition, I saw no feedback about Ulundi and our GP factory. I would really like two more GP for a golden age.

 

[LKendter]

New Updates
2) Legal -
Delay any decision until after the Statue of Liberty is complete. I don't want to lose that wonder.
Long term I want nationhood, or Globe Theater is useless. If the team doesn't want nationhood, then cancel building the GT.

GF = against nationhood
AK = against nationhood
Lukep = ?
If Lukep is marginal, then I will make sure Globe Theater has been cancelled.


Roster
LKendter (currently playing)
Lukep (on deck)
Admiral Kutzov
GreyFox

Remember 15 peace / 10 war turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: domination.

Planned wars - round 2 in Germany.


Small wonders
Heroic Epic - Edirne
Globe Theater - Berlin
Wall Street - Unum
Oxford - Konya
Forbidden Palace - Nobamba
National Epic - Ulundi
Iron Works - Bula

 

[lukep]

I'm neutral on nationhood. I always use it and build GT, but it is true that with our production, it is less mandatory than usual.

For the GP farm, research biology next imho and indeed hire scientist.
Another GA is very good for us.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

Delay any decision until after the Statue of Liberty is complete. I don't want to lose that wonder.

agree no revolting for 4 turns or so til the deed is done.

As for cancelling GT, how many turns is left? If minimal, finish the puppy. Who knows when we may need it?

 

[LKendter]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/1898/LK130_AD-1715.CivWarlordsSave


1670 AD
I am not sure if GF missed my comments, or I wrote them wrong. I really didn't want to revolt until after we secured SoL.

I swap research over to military tradition. I want enough time to get a Taoist monastery into a city we decent production.

I swap Bula to Mt. Rushmore. 5 turns to lower WW is a good thing. With us heading into later game warfare we really need WW reducing items.


1673 AD
I open up borders with Frederick so that we can take advantage of our state religion showing what is in his cities.


1679 AD
(IT) We complete the statue. Time to review all our cities for their free specialist.


1688 AD
(IT) Ragnar declares war on Isabella.


1691 AD
(IT) We were already beat to the free scientist for physics.
I start on biology.


1706 AD
We have a sleeping scientist.


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New Updates
I concentrated on adding happiness and fighting WW. We now have a lot more jails, Mt. Rushmore, along with any possible temples, theaters, and coliseums.

Since it only needs 16 turns, I am trying our luck for the Pentagon.

The good news is some cities are running out of buildings, and we will soon be in heavy military mode.

I set the tech path to head toward radio. We could pick up two more happy helping wonders, and if we snag Eiffel Tower the happy help would be even stronger.


Roster
LKendter (vacation 5/25 to 5/28)
Lukep (currently playing)
Admiral Kutzov (on deck)
GreyFox

Remember 15 peace / 10 war turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: domination.

Planned wars - round 2 in Germany.


Small wonders
Heroic Epic - Edirne
Globe Theater - Berlin
Wall Street - Unum
Oxford - Konya
Forbidden Palace - Nobamba
National Epic - Ulundi
Iron Works - Bula

 

[GreyFox]

@lee: Sorry, I thought you meant not changing the legal civics (as bureaucracy gives 50&#37; hammer to SoL in Capital) since you wrote that comment in your paragraph under legal civics. Luckily for me, the SoL completes in time, so I escaped crucification

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[LKendter]

@lee: Sorry, I thought you meant not changing the legal civics (as bureaucracy gives 50% hammer to SoL in Capital) since you wrote that comment in your paragraph under legal civics. Luckily for me, the SoL completes in time, so I escaped crucification

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Well if you see how many engineers SoL let us hire you will really appreciate it. We really added production to our empire.

I still don't want to leave the big B as it may be the key to snag the Pentagon.