Nazis in Ukraine

[Kupe Navigator]

Kiev declared war on eastern Ukraine and Nazis led the charge with our approval and help

You do know Donbas region is still Ukrainian land right? declearing war within your land? WTH?

 

[Remorseless1]

Kiev declared war on eastern Ukraine and Nazis led the charge with our approval and help



It's all the same concern, Nato with a Nazi vanguard and it works for people in the region

One battalion out of an army of more than 200,000, and zero representatives in the Ukrainian legislature. That's the iron grip if the fascists, isn't it?

Ukraine committed a far worse sin than Nazism - they aspired to be a democratic country with ties to Western Europe right next door to Putin's Russia. The contrast would be strikingly stark, which would be awkward for the Putinists.

 

[Berzerker]

How Kiev declared war on eastern Ukraine? Who was in charge of eastern Ukraine?

eastern Ukrainians were in charge, Kiev disagreed, sent an army to make sure they understood who was in charge

a right wing coup overthrew their govt, they had no moral or legal obligation to accept that.

Shame on the USA for using Ukraine in a proxy war against Russia. But its kinda what we do on a regular basis, while we armed Nazis there we armed Islamic fanatics in Syria and a genocide in Yemen. Ideology is just a weapon in a war for resources, this shows we have no moral objections to the worst ideologies on the planet if they serve our purpose.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

eastern Ukrainians were in charge, Kiev disagreed, sent an army to make sure they understood who was in charge

a right wing coup overthrew their govt, they had no moral or legal obligation to accept that.

Shame on the USA for using Ukraine in a proxy war against Russia. But its kinda what we do on a regular basis, while we armed Nazis there we armed Islamic fanatics in Syria and a genocide in Yemen. Ideology is just a weapon in a war for resources, this shows we have no moral objections to the worst ideologies on the planet if they serve our purpose.

Again Donbas is NOT independent nation. Ukraine have right to do whatever hell it wants inside their borders.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Again Donbas is NOT independent nation. Ukraine have right to do whatever hell it wants inside their borders.

Now Donbass is a independent nation and recognized by Russian governement

 

[Berzerker]

You do know Donbas region is still Ukrainian land right? declearing war within your land? WTH?

The people of the Donbas watched their govt overthrown by a right wing coup and the forces behind the coup came for them.

One battalion out of an army of more than 200,000, and zero representatives in the Ukrainian legislature. That's the iron grip if the fascists, isn't it?

Ukraine committed a far worse sin than Nazism - they aspired to be a democratic country with ties to Western Europe right next door to Putin's Russia. The contrast would be strikingly stark, which would be awkward for the Putinists.

It aint just 1 battalion, they grew into a regiment of 3k or more along with a variety of offshoots and allied or sympathetic organisations and they've been doing a lot of the fighting in the east. They are committed, fanatical, badass dudes and they were largely based in Mariupol. They were threatening Zelensky when he tried to make peace in the east, thats why he backed off. He won in a landslide with 3/4ths of the vote and still couldn't end the war his armies were waging in eastern Ukraine.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

The people of the Donbas watched their govt overthrown by a right wing coup and the forces behind the coup came for them.

Ok when did they became independent? Where is its capital city?

Now Donbass is a independent nation and recognized by Russian governement

Lolz and Northern Cyprus is a nation right?

 

[Berzerker]

2014 I suppose, dont know the capital or geography... Instead of getting on with their lives Kiev sent a bunch of Nazis to attack them so maybe they haven't had the luxury of choosing a capital. They will get that opportunity soon enough.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

2014 I suppose, dont know the capital or geography... Instead of getting on with their lives Kiev sent a bunch of Nazis to attack them so maybe they haven't had the luxury of choosing a capital. They will get that opportunity soon enough.

A nation without a capital. Lolz.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbas

 

[IgrOK[SU]]

A nation without a capital. Lolz.

@Berzerker is directly lying. I pointed it so much, that it will be nonsense to repeat myself. He is lying not in 1 or 2 facts, but are just completely ignoring one part of a story. Anyone reading Wikipedia or doing basic research will find it out.

But that's how propaganda work: you just keep repeating until no one wants to answer you. Then, you win.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

@Berzerker is directly lying. I pointed it so much time, that it will be nonsense to repeat myself. He is lying not in 1 or 2 facts, but are just completely ignoring one part of a story. Anyone reading Wikipedia or doing basic research will find it out.

But that's how propaganda work: you just keep repeating until no one wants to answer you. Then, you win.

I know kinda funny how he calls area without even set capital independent. Heck even unrecognized nations like Northern Cyprus have defacto capital.

 

[Ferocitus]

But that's how propaganda work: you just keep repeating until no one wants to answer you. Then, you win.

It's the same if you are the US/EU/NATO.
Then, Ukraine loses.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

It's the same if you are the US/EU/NATO.
Then, Ukraine loses.

What is this fool rambling about?

 

[Ferocitus]

Zelensky has spoken virtually with numerous national legislatures. Heads if state have gone to Lviv to shoa solidarity with a fellow democratic leader. The Western powers are pouring arms and supplies into Ukraine. And the Ukrainian army has given the Putinist army more than one bloody nose. Sure, Zelensky may look tired, but at least he will get within 10 meters of another human being and hasn't been called a war criminal by much of the world.

Even if Putin conquers Ukraine, he loses. His country will become a pariah, and will be forced to rely on China. President Xi will run Russia, not Putin.

China FTW.

Ukraine have right to do whatever hell it wants inside their borders.

That's the main problem, they did.
And now they can do whatever they like in a slightly smaller country within their borders, you know, the
part that still has a capital.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

That's the main problem, they did.
And now they can do whatever they like in a slightly smaller country within their borders, you know, the
part that still has a capital.

And Russia can do whatever hell they want once they let go of Chechnya. What? Don't remember Chechnya war?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Chechen_War
Why is it Russia can do it but Ukraine can't?

 

[Snowygerry]

Can't become a EU member if you wage open war against your own citizens.

 

[Ferocitus]

And Russia can do whatever hell they want once they let go of Chechnya. What? Don't remember Chechnya war?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Chechen_War
Why is it Russia can do it but Ukraine can't?

Because whataboutism.

 

[Gorbles]

Because whataboutism.

Because raising the US and EU isn't?

What exactly does this have to do with Nazis in Ukraine, again?

 

[Ferocitus]

Because raising the US and EU isn't?

What exactly does this have to do with Nazis in Ukraine, again?

Kupe's comment that Ukraine can do what they like within their own borders.

I agreed: Ukrainians and their neo-Nazis and ultra-Nationalists did what they liked in Donbas.
Goaded and armed by the US, they poked at Russia, shelled the area for several years and now
they are not doing that any more because they have been evicted from the area, with extreme
prejudice.

So I agree: you can do what you want within your own borders, but you don't get to choose the
consequences. Russia will also have to cope with the consequences of their reaction.

 

[Gorbles]

I agreed: Ukrainians and their neo-Nazis and ultra-Nationalists did what they liked in Donbas.
Goaded and armed by the US, they poked at Russia, shelled the area for several years and now
they are not doing that any more because they have been evicted from the area, with extreme
prejudice.

Can I get your sources for these claims? A lot of claims going about at the moment, and precious little evidence. The evidence provided to date in this thread suggests that while Nazis absolutely exist in Ukraine (much like they do in a bunch of other countries), and should be considered problematic (much like they should be in other countries), their actual presence is being overblown to support Putin's claim that the region needs to be "denazified".

Source (on my claim that Putin made such a claim): https://www.npr.org/2022/03/01/1083677765/putin-denazify-ukraine-russia-history

(there are a billion others, but this gets to the quote faster than others)

If one of Putin's goals is "denazification", then it's not whataboutism to mention his lack of action in Russia. Or lack of success. However you want to measure it. Which is - I'm sure - why you're now backpedalling to try to claim it's a "minor" reason for the invasion. I disagree, and apparently so does Putin.