pre-release info New Civ Game Guide: Mongolia

[Prester John 2]

Persia and Han on one side, Qing and Russia on the other.

Don't forget the Mughals/Timurids in India. They traced their lineage to the Mongols as well.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Well, that's Genghis getting revealed on Thursday (and Genghis being the leader the devs will play during the upcoming livestream)

 

[FXS_Sar]

I'm a little confused by the unique ability:



The phrasing of the bolded part with "but" is throwing me. As written, it seems like Mongolia gets a Settler Production malus every time it conquers a settlement. Is that something that lasts a few turns? Is it a permanent additional percentage for each conquest? Is it a general malus that only gets triggered after conquering 1 settlement?

Or is that wrong, and it has nothing to do with settlement conquest, and Mongolia just always has a Settler Production malus?

Your last statement is correct -- Mongolia always has reduced production to settlers.

 

[Nic@Melbourne]

The straight up victory point.
Instant boost to your 3rd age

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

It actually... kinda makes sense? Han Chinese obviously preceded and shaped all neighboring peoples and cultures, including Mongols. Persia is a bit of a moon logic but not that stupid moon logic, it's like going from ancient Persia either to Abbasids (Arabic cultural infusion) or Ilkhanate (Mongol, Turkic and Chinese cultural infusion). Qing I have already mentioned as a sensible succesor, and Russia also kinda makes sense as a heir to the Mongol Empire in Central Asia, many of its administrative systems, and assimilator of Turkic and Mongolian peoples.

It went both ways. While the Han Chinese state(s) definitely influenced culturally and technologically most of their neighbors in the region, they also received influences from prehistory on:

DNA studies show that the early 'Chinese' had lots of admixture from the steppes: the population was heavily influenced by migrants coming in.

The spoked wheel chariot, composite bow, early bronze working all seem to have been introduced to China from the steppes. In fact, there is no evidence in China for any wheels before the chariot arrives about 1700 BCE. The Chinese heavily modified the light steppe chariot, but they had no similar technologies before they got the 'chariot package'.

And of course, throughout the historical period China had intense interactions, both peaceful and warlike, with their neighbors, especially the horsemen to the north and west. Until possibly the Song Dynasty which opened up intensive sea trade with southeast Asia and Indonesia, the bulk of Chinese trade seems to have always been with the steppes, including pass-through trade from much further west in both direcions: silk all the way to Rome, horses, wool and other goods from central Asia to China.

All of which is simply more argument for an Antiquity Steppe/Pastoral Civ, given the great influence both to contemporary trade routes across Asia and to later Civ all around the region. I'll add to the Polish connection the fact that the island Celts in Britain like the Picts had 'origin stories' saying they came from the eastern steppes, so folks like the later Scots or Irish could also have a (indirect?) progression from a steppe Civ.

Given that a recent book was titled The Han - Xiong-Nu War I suggest that in addition to the 'western' pastorals like the Scythians or Sarmatians, the Xiong-Nu could also be a viable Antiquity Civ with pastoral roots, and any of them could Progress with some logic to Exploration Age Mongols, Persia, Poland, Russia, Ming, Scots, Irish, - even, a little late, Chola and of course, Modern Age Mughuls.

 

[Mr Jon of Cheam]

Certainly feels Mongol flavoured! No point making cities, just fly across the map wreaking havoc, capturing settlements and chaining Ortöö for even greater reach. Sounds fun!

 

[Zaarin]

I think we really really need Scythians or some other ancient steppe nomad civ for this game. Okay, Qing is sort of sensible continuity of Mongolian empire (especially if we imagine it going there via Yuan phase which never collapses), but Scythians would be sooo useful for so many latter civs. From ancient Scythians you may get sensible continuities of Mongols, Seljuks, Turks, Khazars, Tatars, Avars, but also sort of sensible heirs of Magyars and Bulgarians... Hell as weird as it sounds Poland or Rus aren't the worst heirs of Scythians (it's second best option after ancient Slavs) - they had a lot of presence in case of Ukraine and while they have no actual connection to Poland they featured very prominently in Polish consciousness of the early modern era, as supposed progenitors of horse riding Polish nobility loving Oriental fashion Plus you'd have one famous cavalry civ following another

The Scythians are one of a number of Civ6 choices that feel like they would have been more natural in Civ7; I do hope they make a return.

 

[MasterPaw]

Ortoo teleportation lol

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Hmm...the civilization is leaderless. Does that mean we shouldn't expect Genghis Khan in the base game? The reduced Production towards Settlers might seem as a disadvantage at first, but actually it's clever. Not only it is fitting for a nomadic civilization, but at the same time it will force the player to conquer settlements in order to expand.

All civilizations are leaderless. Even in the Shawnee and Tecumseh pack, Tecumseh is never referred to as a Shawnee leader, only just as leader

 

[Krikkit1]

China to Mongols is ass backwards.

Its Historical... especially if it is China->Mongols->China

 

[Krikkit1]

Your last statement is correct -- Mongolia always has reduced production to settlers.

Might want to reword the UA to

When you capture an opposing Settlement, gain the strongest Cavalry Unit you can currently train, but . Receive reduced Production towards Settlers. Gain a Victory Point toward the Non Sufficit Orbis Victory for controlled Settlements in the Distant Lands and conquered Settlements in the Homelands.

Edited for better clarity

 

[The Fanatical]

All civilizations are leaderless. Even in the Shawnee and Tecumseh pack, Tecumseh is never referred to as a Shawnee leader, only just as leader

Yes, in a way, but some civilizations have native leaders that accompany them, even if the leader isn't always the best choice for the civilization. Augustus is the Roman leader, Hatshepsut is the Egyptian one etc.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Yes, in a way, but some civilizations have native leaders that accompany them, even if the leader isn't always the best choice for the civilization. Augustus is the Roman leader, Hatshepsut is the Egyptian one etc.

Indeed, an in the case of some later age leaders, they unlock the civ they are associated with. For example, Franklin will always unlock America in the Modern Age, no matter if you went Roman>Norman or Khmer>Majapahit. Tecumseh will always unlock the Shawnee and Machiavelli apparently always unlocks the Normans.

 

[tedhebert]

Do we know the exact unlocks that will allow to lead into mongolia ? I think there's usually a geographic, an historical and a wildcard ? EDIT: I mean I think I remember something about finding horses on the map, but I'm not sure that was ever confirmed !

BTW great take on mongolia... this civ seems to induce really interesting gameplay, even if I'm not generally iinto a very domination state of mind....

 

[TheGhostEnthusiast]

Might want to reword the UA to

When you capture an opposing Settlement, gain the strongest Cavalry Unit you can currently train, but . Receive reduced Production towards Settlers, but Gain a Victory Point toward the Non Sufficit Orbis Victory for controlled Settlements in the Distant Lands and conquered Settlements in the Homelands.

I think this has a similar issue, it could be read as "receives reduced Production towards Settlers for controlled Settlements in the Distant Lands and conquered Settlements in the Homelands." I think the best way to go about it is make the malus its own sentence.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Do we know the exact unlocks that will allow to lead into mongolia ? I think there's usually a geographic, an historical and a wildcard ? EDIT: I mean I think I remember something about finding horses on the map, but I'm not sure that was ever confirmed !

BTW great take on mongolia... this civ seems to induce really interesting gameplay, even if I'm not generally iinto a very domination state of mind....

According to the PAX West panel, you had to have 3 horses to access the Mongols from a non-Historic Connection

 

[Zaarin]

Do we know the exact unlocks that will allow to lead into mongolia ? I think there's usually a geographic, an historical and a wildcard ?

We know Persia leads into Mongolia, and we suspect Han does as well.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Certainly feels Mongol flavoured! No point making cities, just fly across the map wreaking havoc, capturing settlements and chaining Ortöö for even greater reach. Sounds fun!

Pacifist me is still going to spam them anyway. Except I will buy the Settlers instead of produce them.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

According to the PAX West panel, you had to have 3 horses to access the Mongols from a non-Historic Connection

Which to me, as soon as I read that, implies that having the possible choice of Mongols may not be that difficult unless you start in the middle of a Tundra or Rainforest. If you are expanding anyway, expand to where there are Horses and it shouldn't take that many new Settlements in 150 - 200 turns to get 3 of them - unless Resource distribution is 'way different from Civs V or VI . . .

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

So Mongolia gets a Victory Point towards the "conquest/domination" victory condition for "for controlled Settlements in the Distant Lands and conquered Settlements in the Homelands".

• I assume that this Victory Point is an extra VP over and above whatever VP other civs may or may not get for controlling or conquering settlements.
• The conquering settlements in the Homelands part ties in understandably to actual Mongolian history.
• What do we make of the controlled settlements in Distant Lands part of the ability? Is it meant to be tied to Mongolian history? If so, could any part of your starting continent end up being classified as Distant Lands? If not, why is Mongolia given a bonus for settling other continents? I could see them getting whatever the standard VPs associated with colonizing a new continent, but why would they be given a bigger bonus than other civs?