No good comes of calling the cops

[Zelig]

I say this all the time; that there is no situation so bad that calling the cops won't make it worse.

I spend all day calling in fake police reports to remote areas in order to reduce the number of cops available to make other places more dangerous.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Can it be solved in less than a century?

I think so. While the problem of institutional racism is literally everywhere, police abuse of authority is a relatively narrow scope issue.

Just as illustration, consider the numbers of people involved; school admissions and administration, the entire justice system, employers, ordinary people on the street, stereotyped portrayals in media...on and on and on. As Formy said (which I have said in a more optimistic fashion) you really have to just wait for it to die out.

But at the end of the day there are only a million cops. It is actually possible, though challenging, to just replace every last one of them if the problem proves to be impossible to solve any other way.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I spend all day calling in fake police reports to remote areas in order to reduce the number of cops available to make other places more dangerous.

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

 

[Zelig]

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

I built a robot to place the calls for me. I spend all day doing a lot of things.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I built a robot to place the calls for me. I spend all day doing a lot of things.

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

 

[Zelig]

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

I built a robot to place the calls for me. I spend all day doing a lot of things.

 

[Formaldehyde]

But when you say "it's institutional racism" you provide an excuse for not solving the immediate problem of people being intimidated, falsely incarcerated, beaten, and outright killed by "law enforcement," and the system of law enforcement letting it happen unless someone happens to catch it in an indisputable video.

I still contend the reason they get away with it is due to the inherent racism. Far too many whites just don't care that the cops frequently act like Nazi storm troopers against people they consider to all be prospective criminals, even though there is occasional "collateral damage". That is because by doing so, they think the cops are protecting them from the evil blacks and other minorities who they think are understandably trying to get even with them for treating them so badly for centuries.

Of course, the blacks and other minorities aren't actually doing so. Ironically, most of them are god-fearing Christians who forgive them for being hateful racists, like all good Christians are supposed to do. But by some of them rioting on rare occasions, they reinforce that fear and make the racists think they are justified in fearing them, despite the riots typically occurring in black neighborhoods and not becoming that widespread.

Many people have arsenals in their homes specifically for the day they try to get even. My next door neighbors used to practice what they were going to do on a regular basis, until they became too sick to do so anymore.

 

[caketastydelish]

I think this is partially about race but not completely. For what it's worth, there are tons of videos I could post of white people getting the crap torn out of them by cops (or even killed).

edit: to be more clear, yes on a per-capita basis blacks and browns are getting beaten by cops more frequently. But it happens to lots of whites as well. Especially if the white in question is of lower socioeconomic background or has a mental illness.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I still contend the reason they get away with it is due to the inherent racism. Far too many whites just don't care that the cops frequently act like Nazi storm troopers against people they consider to all be prospective criminals, even though there is occasional "collateral damage". That is because by doing so, they think the cops are protecting them from the evil blacks and other minorities who they think are understandably trying to get even with them for treating them so badly for centuries.

Of course, the blacks and other minorities aren't actually doing so. Ironically, most of them are god-fearing Christians who forgive them for being hateful racists, like all good Christians are supposed to do.

Partly. And since that inherent racism is going to allow for them to get away with stuff by focusing on the racist aspects we are promoting letting them get away with stuff. That's why I consider it useful to not put the emphasis on racism as the background that makes racist people not care if the problem gets solved.

The cops in my town absolutely love it when they are called racists. Cue the obfuscations about blacks and Hispanics in uniform. Cue the song and dance of approval without approving from the people who in their heart of hearts say "The cops are racist? Good!" who in many cases pay the freight for our local law enforcement. Start pointing out that the cops are a hazard to everyone and the cops aren't quite so smug that they will be able to just keep on keepin' on.

 

[BvBPL]

Hopefully, the incidents in the past year or so will now give enough impetus to allow Obama to start that process.

He wouldn't do anything that is meaningful to these sorts of situations. Obama's race policy involves placing people of color in high positions, not addressing concerns of race on the ground. He's given us Attorneys General and a Supreme Court justice of color rather than try to change the situation on the ground. That may be progress, but it is not the kind of progress that will be helpful to people facing police violence.

Obama and Hilary Clinton are not leftists that are going to enact these sort of change. They are moderate, and American moderates at that meaning that in many nations they would fit in well with right-centrist parties. Nor are they populist. They are not a man and woman of the people, and their concerns and policies primarily address the American elite rather than the citizenry they supposedly serve.

 

[FriendlyFire]

You're right, no good ever does come from calling the cops. Especially when some anti-cop terrorist calls the police and then murders the officer that responds. You know, like what happened in my hometown of Cincinnati today. Thankfully, another officer showed up and killed that piece of human garbage as well.

Dont call the police while being "black" !

Seriously though, police have withdrawn from a certain area and now the community is complaining about sky rocketing murder rate and crime. Why not simply push to have police body cameras rather then attacking the entire law enforcement as being bad ?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

He wouldn't do anything that is meaningful to these sorts of situations. Obama's race policy involves placing people of color in high positions, not addressing concerns of race on the ground. He's given us Attorneys General and a Supreme Court justice of color rather than try to change the situation on the ground. That may be progress, but it is not the kind of progress that will be helpful to people facing police violence.

Obama and Hilary Clinton are not leftists that are going to enact these sort of change. They are moderate, and American moderates at that meaning that in many nations they would fit in well with right-centrist parties. Nor are they populist. They are not a man and woman of the people, and their concerns and policies primarily address the American elite rather than the citizenry they supposedly serve.

The president of the US has no bearing on anything BUT high positions. He can't replace the LA County Sheriff. He can't enforce the law on every street corner in the US. The problem with law enforcement does NOT actually stem from inadequate regulation. We have plenty of laws against shooting people armed with towels and calling it self defense.

The problem is that at the local and "on the scene" level we have a total lack of enforcement of law when law enforcement personnel are the criminals. As has been pointed out SOME of that problem clearly results from there being a portion of the population that just doesn't care as long as the victim is brown. Perhaps even more of it comes from the trumped up levels of fear that we allow to permeate society, that convince people that we need to let the cops do whatever in the fight against the criminals that are lurking behind every blade of grass. Overall it is endemic because for whatever reasons too many people just allow it, and that can't be changed by one man in Washington, even if he is the president.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Dont call the police while being "black" !

Seriously though, police have withdrawn from a certain area and now the community is complaining about sky rocketing murder rate and crime. Why not simply push to have police body cameras rather then attacking the entire law enforcement as being bad ?

And this is the kind of stuff I was referring to. A police spokesman in Baltimore is saying "morale is low" ever since they got called out for killing Freddy Grey...I mean, don't the citizens of Baltimore understand that cops just wanna have fun?

So the police spokesman says that this low morale has lead to a skyrocketing crime rate. Of course "skyrocketing" is a good word for making his point, as compared to "increase over last year but still in the bandwidth of ordinary rates," which would be more accurate but less useful in the fearmongering trade.

By the way, anyone care to guess what enterprising band of truth seeking journalists took this load of tripe national in order to "back the badge" with utter disregard to facts? Three guesses, first two don't count...

Spoiler :

That's right, it's Faux News!!!

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Are you actually trying to claim there isn't inherent institutional racism in virtually all police departments, as well as most other governmental institutions, especially the prisons and the rest of the criminal justice system? That blacks and other minorities aren't treated differently than whites are, except where it is supposedly warranted because there are more black and minority criminals? That it is a matter of their supposed levels of "involvement in crime" as an entire race or ethic group which justly makes them all suspect far more than whites are?

Do you really think an affluent white man with his hand covered by a towel would have been shot in the head in an upscale section of LA, while trying to flag down two cops to help him with his disabled car, after they falsely assumed he must have been hiding a gun to kill them both in the most inept ambush attempt in history?

Even Barack Obama and his wife all too familiar how they are treated differently than whites are, merely because their skin is a few shades darker than your own.

This isn't "hyperbole". This is life in racist America nearly 150 years after the end of the Civil War. And it must finally end.

No, I am claiming that institutional racism in the police force targets some races much more consistently than others.

 

[Hygro]

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

I built a robot to place the calls for me. I spend all day doing a lot of things.

And yet you still have time to make comments like this. Unfortunate.

I built a robot to place the calls for me. I spend all day doing a lot of things.

 

[Narz]

Can it be solved in less than a century?

Have cops ever not been at least somewhat corrupt?

I suppose there's a huge range of how corrupt/violent/incompetent cops already are. Perhaps we could simply learn from other nations?

IIRC, the police force of Iceland just shot their first person a few months ago (and we're deeply regretful about it). Meanwhile US cops kill someone hourly it seems.

 

[Farm Boy]

It's no good, you know. The only real solution is segregation. All members of police forces should be obliged to live in their own country (and leave the rest of us in peace): the "Police State", let's call it.

Spoiler :

I jest. I jest.

Spoiler :

Well, mostly I jest.

Gallowglass?

When you're making such assertions, it's best to approach the constructs accurately. Where you're living makes a big difference on this type of violent crime, and the racism is more targeted than global (Black, Hispanic, White, and Asian have different levels of involvement in this sort of crime). That doesn't make it better, but it might change what is ultimately done that can successfully stop it.

I don't trust cops any more than I trust people in general, but this thread is hyperbole because it paints an entire profession as acting like its worst members. Even if police are inordinately worse than an average person (a tough sell), this thread is still hyperbole.

I've had the good fortune to not have many situations where calling the police was merited, though I've reported a few accidents that looked bad enough that the people involved might need urgent medical attention.

I think this is mostly a good post, though I'm not sure I want to butt too much into Tim and Formy winding themselves up. Tim might forget that I agree with him in large part when he's forgetting to call some of my immediate family and much of my social circle thugs.

 

[Kyriakos]

All these problems will go away if people stop illegally filming police

 

[Formaldehyde]

No, I am claiming that institutional racism in the police force targets some races much more consistently than others.

Well, that is obviously true. What gave you the impression that is in any way contrary to my own views?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Well, that is obviously true. What gave you the impression that is in any way contrary to my own views?

It is simply not safe in our society if your skin color is even as dark as Michael Jackson.

Not that it is much, if any, safer for Hispanics armed with a towel.

To me, this was misleading and depending on where exactly one lives, inaccurate. Systemic racism is fundamentally irrational, but it is also irrational in how it is non-uniform. I felt the quoted part implied a bit more uniformity in the systemic issue than exists in practice.

With the ideal being to remove systemic racism, I find statements like that to harm the argumentative construct. I realize I do that myself sometimes, though I delete that kind of stuff when I catch myself.