Random Philosophical Thoughts

[Save_Ferris]

If someone told you that Earth would eventually be a star, what would your reaction be?

I'd watch a movie they were in and decided if I liked their acting.

 

[Tahuti]

Again, I have to ask, are you talking about metaphysics or epistemology? It's possible to assert, on the one hand, that an objective reality exists beyond the subject, but that the subject cannot access it in an objective manner on the other.

Well, I for one do not even believe reality itself can be objective.

 

[Traitorfish]

Well, I for one do not even believe reality itself can be objective.

How do you mean?

 

[Tahuti]

How do you mean?

That reality itself is subjective, since "reality" is ultimately a human construct as well.

 

[bhsup]

That reality itself is subjective, since "reality" is ultimately a human construct as well.

I'd dispute that since I am sure the earth was quite real before the rise of humans on this ball of mud and rock.

 

[Narz]

I think it was D-d-derrida who said there was no such thing as actual empirical truth

What nonsense. There is empirical truth & I posses it. My taste in women, objects & fine spices reflects it. My being is objectively correct, love me, praise me!!

I'd dispute that since I am sure the earth was quite real before the rise of humans on this ball of mud and rock.

Of course, we weren't created 'till what, the 5th day right?

 

[Narz]

My main reoccurring philosophical thought is pondering on choices.

Choice is such a complicated word. Very emotionally loaded too.

When I was a little boy my dad would occasionally reprimand me for being clumsy by such statements as "Why did you choose to pour that all over the floor!". What a dick!

Anyway, it's no wonder liberal minded people are careful about the word choice. It's almost a dirty word to talk about (along with willpower), regarding emotional or physical hurdles people are trying to overcome. It is true there is so much conditioning & barriers holding people back but ultimately our destinies depend on our choices (and our genetics, stuff that happens to us, etc.).

You can't "choose" to do 100 push-ups at once right now. But you can choose to do it two years from now (assuming you're a reasonably healthy adult). It just takes lots of choices along the way.

The most frustrating things in life are those that feel beyond choice like the ability to sleep, motivation, emotions, desire, even food etc. I've been tinkering with myself trying to "fix" my sleep schedule for almost two decades but it's hard. It's that elusive realm that is influenced by choice yet beyond it.

 

[Dachs]

What nonsense. There is empirical truth & I posses it. My taste in women, objects & fine spices reflects it. My being is objectively correct, love me, praise me!!


Of course, we weren't created 'till what, the 5th day right?

Referential humor.

 

[Narz]

Ah, ok. Is that The Office?

 

[Narz]

One insight that's been reinforced time & again in my 32 years is this : Thinking/believing that something is good or bad is useless in changing behavior (by itself). Many gamblers think gambling is bad, many drinkers think drinking is bad. You have to know what to change to in order to change. Otherwise you'll just go back to your comfort level.

Also, one positive friend is worth 100 positive books. Not that I have many particularly positive friends.

 

[Traitorfish]

That reality itself is subjective, since "reality" is ultimately a human construct as well.

I don't follow.

 

[Agent327]

It´s a philosophical idea.

1) ´reality´ itself is a human concept
2) all human perception is coloured in some way (i.e. it is not ´objective´)

so all perceived reality will always be subjective.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

It´s a philosophical idea.

1) ´reality´ itself is a human concept
2) all human perception is coloured in some way (i.e. it is not ´objective´)

so all perceived reality will always be subjective.

1) "reality" is not human invention even though the name itself is. Just like there was Earth before the arrival of man there was reality as well.
2) this is very true but socalled manysidedness(reality aproached, seen or realised in many different ways) is just another aspect of the reality.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

One insight that's been reinforced time & again in my 32 years is this : Thinking/believing that something is good or bad is useless in changing behavior (by itself).

If you want change something/ get rid off something unhealthy or some weakness first thing is that you recognize it as such (as something "bad"). So it is not useless it is only insufficient to make the actual change.

Many gamblers think gambling is bad, many drinkers think drinking is bad. You have to know what to change to in order to change. Otherwise you'll just go back to your comfort level.

Yes, all of us has seen this in our own life. You have to know what to change. You should also know why you want the change so that you can be realy sincere about it and many other things...

Also, one positive friend is worth 100 positive books. Not that I have many particularly positive friends.

In my experience realy good book can be positive and invaluable friend.

My main reoccurring philosophical thought is pondering on choices.

Choice is such a complicated word. Very emotionally loaded too.

Thats is I think something defining a human being - capability of making somewhat great choices.
True, choice can be at times very complicated and emotionaly hard to make.
Thats why I make it a point to bring simplicity into my life: between two bad choices choose neither between two good choices choose both

Anyway, it's no wonder liberal minded people are careful about the word choice. It's almost a dirty word to talk about (along with willpower), regarding emotional or physical hurdles people are trying to overcome.

To be careful about ones choices is good. To use wisdom while choosing is better. To make wise choices with ones willpower is the best.

It is true there is so much conditioning & barriers holding people back but ultimately our destinies depend on our choices (and our genetics, stuff that happens to us, etc.)

Whatever limits or binds you unlearn or throw a way. Choose whatever makes you stronger or gives you capacity.

The most frustrating things in life are those that feel beyond choice like the ability to sleep, motivation, emotions, desire, even food etc. I've been tinkering with myself trying to "fix" my sleep schedule for almost two decades but it's hard. It's that elusive realm that is influenced by choice yet beyond it.

It seem to me that even death is not ultimately "beyond choice" not to speak of the things you mention.

Why/how you want to fix the sleep schedule?

 

[Agent327]

1) "reality" is not human invention even though the name itself is. Just like there was Earth before the arrival of man there was reality as well.
2) this is very true but socalled manysidedness(reality aproached, seen or realised in many different ways) is just another aspect of the reality.

You are missing the point, besides being incorrect: since ´reality´ is a human concept (i.e. made up by man), everything we perceive as reality falls within that concept.

Since perception of reality is also not objective, it follows that what we perceive as ´reality´ is in fact subjective (that, is subject to both our concepts and our perceptions).

Taken to the extreme one might even conclude that reality is, in fact, unknowable. However, I wouldn´t go as far as that, since our perception of reality ultimately still is a reflection of that reality, however distorted.

It´s easy to give an example of this. If you watch an item on a news show, you will know of certain events. However, the way you view these events is limited by the news item (and any prior knowledge you may have of the circumstances involved). But unless you know all of the circumstances involved, your view of the incident will always be limited. (Or think of a youtube-clip you might watch; if you do not know the context, the clip might make no sense.)

 

[Traitorfish]

I'm not sure I follow; in the same post, you claim that reality as such has a purely conceptual existence, but then you affirm the existence of an independent and objective reality. So which is it?

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

You are missing the point, besides being incorrect: since ´reality´ is a human concept (i.e. made up by man), everything we perceive as reality falls within that concept.

Isnt it rather that human concept of reality is made up of things which we percieve as real? That way you can say that human concept of reality expands with the deepening of our knowledge of it.

Since perception of reality is also not objective, it follows that what we perceive as ´reality´ is in fact subjective (that, is subject to both our concepts and our perceptions).

Let me ask you at what point you can consider reality or some truth as objective?

Taken to the extreme one might even conclude that reality is, in fact, unknowable. However, I wouldn´t go as far as that, since our perception of reality ultimately still is a reflection of that reality, however distorted.

I am afraid it may be much more complicated than that as there is many more factors which can enter the picture...

It´s easy to give an example of this. If you watch an item on a news show, you will know of certain events. However, the way you view these events is limited by the news item (and any prior knowledge you may have of the circumstances involved). But unless you know all of the circumstances involved, your view of the incident will always be limited. (Or think of a youtube-clip you might watch; if you do not know the context, the clip might make no sense.)

You seem to wiew reality as some largest possible collection of most detailed information while I would rather percieve reality as something which under numerous and different conditons remains in its core unchanged. So you see two different humans can have quite different concepts....

 

[Narz]

If you want change something/ get rid off something unhealthy or some weakness first thing is that you recognize it as such (as something "bad"). So it is not useless it is only insufficient to make the actual change.

That's why I said "by itself". It's an important first step but it's only the first step.

In my experience realy good book can be positive and invaluable friend.

I love good books but, in my experience, the solace and/or inspiration they provide is temporary. Like a song they don't change, evolve or interact. They might spurn you forward but you can't overuse them or they grow stale. Unlike the flesh & blood kind of friends.

Thats why I make it a point to bring simplicity into my life: between two bad choices choose neither between two good choices choose both

Yeah, choosing neither or both are often the best of experiences.

I had an experience of "choosing both" today. My daughter was bored @ home & I didn't really want to play with her alone for like eight hours straight, I wanted to goto a chess tournament. I didn't want to have to choose to abandon my daughter with her tired mom all day but I didn't want to forgo doing what I wanted to do either so I called the guy who ran the tournament & her brought his wife & daughter (who's a year older than mine) and they played happily together while I got to do my thing & everyone was happy (of course I would've been happier had I won 1st place but whatever, can't have it all!).

To be careful about ones choices is good. To use wisdom while choosing is better. To make wise choices with ones willpower is the best.

I think I understand what you're saying & I agree. It's a good feeling knowing you are using willpower to choose wisely. It's much more satisfying than just doing "the right thing" out of inertia.

Whatever limits or binds you unlearn or throw a way. Choose whatever makes you stronger or gives you capacity.

A good policy. Easier said than done of course.

It seem to me that even death is not ultimately "beyond choice" not to speak of the things you mention.

Well, for those in the developed world the #1 cause of premature death is poor choices. It's a lot of responsibility!

Why/how you want to fix the sleep schedule?

I have some ideas on how. Why is because I feel much better when I get to sleep before midnight but it's an extremely rare thing (maybe a few times a year I am able to).

 

[Agent327]

Isnt it rather that human concept of reality is made up of things which we percieve as real? That way you can say that human concept of reality expands with the deepening of our knowledge of it.

How do you know something is ´real´? And any useful concept isn´t static, obviously.

Let me ask you at what point you can consider reality or some truth as objective?

You cannot. As I tried to explain. The way you perceive reality is by definition distorted (or coloured, if you prefer).

I am afraid it may be much more complicated than that as there is many more factors which can enter the picture...

Obviously. I´ve only tried to explain it succinctly.

You seem to wiew reality as some largest possible collection of most detailed information while I would rather percieve reality as something which under numerous and different conditons remains in its core unchanged. So you see two different humans can have quite different concepts....

You mistake my explanation of a philosophical idea for my personal opinion. A clear example of distorted perception, and therefore it actually supports what I explained. (I.e. your perception is subjective, not objective.)

 

[Leoreth]

But can't you derive some degree of objectivity in the world by comparing the subjective impressions of several people?

It sounds a lot like you're trying to pursue a solipsist perspective.