Realpolitik CIV - An Interactive AAR

[Gruekiller]

I have a suspicion, but I won't point any fingers... At any rate. In light of these developments:

We should send delegations to try and ally these civilizations in the New World. They could make valuable friends and trading partners. Settling in the northern half of this great continent would perhaps not be wise, as there's little land, and we'd quickly come into conflict with the Americans or Sioux. We should focus on settling the eastern shore of the southern continent, as it seems to be relatively unpopulated.

I am greatly pleased that Ragnar has come to see us as we truly are - proud, honourable, and strong. I advise that we attempt to further improve relations with Vikingland, and in them gain a great and powerful ally.

We should try to get the Russian princess from the Ukrainians - with reason and diplomacy, if at all possible. If this is unworkable, we should not betray the Ukrainians to get to her. Their support is worth more in the long run than whatever knowledge the princess has.

These Arabs are alright with me. Give the Russkis hell.

 

[Celticfury]

Ok, firstly, YEEEEEEEAAAAHHHH! Moscow is down! But to the Arabs. Not to good.

Glad that the scientists and Valhalla worked out. Of course, now we have to deal with these Ukrainians and this Russian princess. Ugh. We might want to try and work with the Ukrainians to release her to us.

Gruekiller, its was Poland that made that remark. Ragnar probably still is ticked off at us, and most likely won't be too happy about our plan to set up shop in Norway (if that is still the plan). In my opinion, Ragnar is a lost cause. Its a good thing that Poland is starting to warm up to us, though. My hope is that, in the case of a war with Vikingdom, we can beat back Ragnar, and when they are weak enough, convince Alexander to abandon them and join us as a vassal.

I do agree with you on the American civs, however. These New World civilizations would make wonderful allies, especially since they are all Christian nations. I would like to know about their tech status.

As with these sabotages, I have my suspicions, but I'm not going to pursue them. However, it would for you, MN, to tread very lightly. You're recent party change is sure to arouse suspicions, especially with your political opponents.

Edit: I changed my mind on Ragnar. After reviewing the info, it might, and I mean might, be a good idea to review the possibility of befriending/vassalizing the Vikings.

 

[Ravus_Sol]

Ravus - Military General

Diplomatic Crisis
Befriend Vikingdom? Really? huh.

The problem becomes, in all warfare, in what your goals are. With Vikingland we were prepared to take their main science cities and perhaps their greek vassal (giving us a path to Russia) then letting them stagnate.

The only other options would have been total annihilation or Vassalage. Which both have their downsides, Annihilation from the effort it would take and the maintainance cost from the new cities, Vassalage from the continued "We wish to rejoin our homeland" from captured cities, plus by then the Norse people would probably be useless to us.

So now we come to this, Three potential targets;
The Vikings, whose leader is now singing our praises. He is our greatest rival and largest threat yet only has a bare few lands that are worthwhile

The Russians, Our Religious rivals, they converted Europe and turned many against us. Now they are being beaten back by the Arabs from the East, in fact we technically helped them do so by joining with the Arabs in taking the Valhalla Facility. We could support them.. try to turn them into a vassal perhaps. I know i don't want Russian land, merely their holy city so they stop getting money.

The Arabs, So far the Hindu block in the east has made no large declarations at us. The Arabs asked us to join them in their holy war once and now they attack Russia themselves. Personally i don't like giving them support. They are only going to get worse.

I would like to see Russia come under our banner as a Vassal. They would be useful as the perfect buffer to take the useless lands of the North East. But should we defend Russia... then see if they will vassal willingly? Or do we attack them as well and beat them down to Capitulation to us first?

The Norse Still needs to go, but i suppose now we could concentrate on Russia first... Or try to woo the Greeks even while fighting with their leaders?

Luckily that decision will be made by the next leader. Aysee's job is to get the army up and running. We have Red-Coats and soon we will have Cannons. Then the army just needs to be upgraded for battle.

-

The Great People
Have we done anything with them? Now that we have Constitution we could settle one or two of them for greater benefits.

We could also send the Great Merchant into the new world for a huge gold burst to upgrade troops.

The Engineer i would keep seeing as we are so close to Democracy we can build the Statue of Liberty quite quickly

The Americas
First Contact and we have the Savages converted to Christianity! Which as you all know means more money. Finally some converts to fill our banks. Fredrick needs one more missionary but then he should convert as well.

Sitting Bull however is a worry. He has about three times our land claimed... once he gains communism or something he is going to be powerful...

-

The Valhalla Facility
Saving Catherine only matters if we believe she has information, or we want to use her as some kind of leverage.

If we want to play good cop we could return her to Russia, If we want to play bad we can interrogate her then kill her but make it look like the Arabs did it. Technically she is a person of Royalty... so i wonder if we could push her onto the throne in a attempt to Vassalise Russia?

-

The Scientists
They continue under my protection and i would support them getting another 50 gold. We don't know how long they will stay safe and secure...

-

Sabotages
It was Mathnerd. Nuff said. If it continues i will start to support Emergancy Powers for the next Presidential Election

-

BREAKING NEWS EDIT:
The Arabs have claimed the Buddist Holy City of Moscow, but they are also eyeing up the Asoka of India's Holy City... These Greedy Religious Fanatics could turn their eyes on Christianity next...

Extra news:
People at war with Asoka of India = Carthage, Vikings, Arabia, Shaka and Egypt

Egypt has Vassalised to Shaka!! Our attempts at gaining an ally in the middle east have failed as they will now support the southern barbarian!

Japan and Korea are at War. Japan is advancing towards Australia.

The Americas have tense relations between the United states and the Natives

 

[mechaerik]

Interesting. We appear to have entered an era of detente with Norden.

However, Russia still holds Ireland, and has in fact made it his capital. We cannot stand this outrage. At least the Irish were of British stock; the Russians are completely foreign, and seem intent on making a nation in our backyard.

As for Norden, exactly how unstable is it becoming? With this possible new era of relations and possible end to the Cold War, could we see a cracking up of the Northern bloc?

Also, what is the tech situation for the new world? Are we ahead? How far away are we from Astro and Communism?

 

[Ravus_Sol]

Darn i hadn't spotted that thing about the Captial... Russia is getting pushy. We are currently researching Steel then Astronomy. Communism would be after that, we'd need scientific method then communism. So we are quite close the IngSoc dream.

I'm quite happy to change targets now. We've ignored the larger political stage and as such Egypt now bows to the Zulus, The Hindu's have all fallen into War with each other and Russia has been beaten to nearly the brink.

I'd recommend Trying to Vasslaise the Russians... But which method is still up for choice. Making them Capitulate, defending them from Arabia and seeing if they bow willingly... or kidnapping Catherine and perhaps trying a bit of political trickery to seize their throne.

 

[NinjaCow64]

Lighthearter, could you tell us what civics we are in and what civics are available? Also, if it isn’t to much trouble, could you post a few screenshots of the world?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Lighthearter]

I am now announcing the True Player Measure. This is a gameplay rule to prevent lurker-spam from dominating politics - if you want to vote, you have to play. Here's how it works:

- If you are a regular, and comment and voice your opinions regularly, relax! You're safe.
- If, however, you only pop in for elections, or simply lurk and never post until elections, pay attention! If you only arrive to vote in elections, and come and vote every election but never post in between, then you are going to have your votes taken away because you obviously don't have a stake in the game. In order to get them back, you need to be an active player - even if not the most active - and remain active up to and through an election where you have no voting rights. That's right. You have to prove that you're here to play, not just to vote for a friend. Currently I am censuring Domination3000 in accordance with this new rule. If you want your votes back, Domination, rejoin the game and participate through the next election even while you have no votes. I will be paying strict attention to all lurker voters in the future and adding their names to this list as they qualify. This will also be added to the front page so everyone can keep track of who is Censured.

Thank you, and have a nice game! Continue the debates!

- Lighthearter

 

[Nukeknockout]

Lighthearter, could you tell us what civics we are in and what civics are available? Also, if it isn’t to much trouble, could you post a few screenshots of the world?

Thanks in advance.

there's an update with a bunch of screenshots hidden by spoiler tags on the previous page I'm not sure about the civics, but the screenshots should help with that.

you're welcome,
Nukeknockout
Imperial Party Member

 

[ilduce349]

The Princess Catherine

I would like to announce the upcoming marriage between Catherine and I, she shall not be harmed or I will send in some assassins to take revenge!!!!!

The Scientists

FUND THEM!!!!!

Foreign Aid and the Cold War -

This is a chance for peace!!!! I say we take it!!!!!

BREAKING NEWS! MOSCOW FALLS TO ARABIA!

Perfect, we go in assisting the Russians, retake the city and have the 3rd most valuable city on the continent in our hands.

SABOTAGE!

I would blame Arya, but he is in Valhalla so

OK, it wasn't me. I'm serious.

Sabotages are too low for me.

You just said you were going to sabotage...

We should send delegations to try and ally these civilizations in the New World. They could make valuable friends and trading partners. Settling in the northern half of this great continent would perhaps not be wise, as there's little land, and we'd quickly come into conflict with the Americans or Sioux. We should focus on settling the eastern shore of the southern continent, as it seems to be relatively unpopulated.

Agree

 

[Captain Fargle]

Okay, first of all Russia needs to go. Proclaiming New Horizons as their capital is just one step waaaaaaaaaaaaay to far.

However, I don't think we should eliminate Russia completely. Russia as it is now needs to go, yes, but Russia as a whole? Not when we have the potential that Lady Catherine offers. We should declare war on Russia, at once, without delay, while they are so weak from fighting Saladin. Take back the British Isles, and then, force them to capitulate and turn them into a vassal state with Lady Catherine at it's command.

As for Vikingdom and Ragnar? We should court him now while we have the chance, perhaps we can sweet talk him enough that he won't join in when we declare war on Russia.

We should obviously keep funding the scientists.

As for the sabotage, I fully support emergency powers to combat it.

In summary: Butter up Ragnar, War with Russia with the aim of liberating Ireland and installing Catherine as puppet, greater scientific funding and Emergency Powers.

SERIOUSLY GUYS: We need to go to war with Russia. NOW! They moved their capital right into our backyard where they will have a nearly impossible time creating a supply line to back it up. Especially when they are obviously depleted from war with Arabia and their closest ally is making speeches praising us. THIS IS THE BEST CHANCE WE WILL EVER GET. WE NEED TO TAKE IT.

 

[Ravus_Sol]

I would like to announce the upcoming marriage between Catherine and I, she shall not be harmed or I will send in some assassins to take revenge!!!!!

Poor Catherine... Guess we don't have equal gender roles in Europe yet or ilduce would at least ask what she wants first...

 

[ilduce349]

I am trying to save her life, then I will propose to her.

@CF: I disagree with everything in your last post. If It wasn't 3 am and I am going to sleep, I would argue with you

 

[Lighthearter]

In summary: Butter up Ragnar, War with Russia with the aim of liberating Ireland and installing Catherine as puppet, greater scientific funding and Emergency Powers.

I take it then that you support rescuing her from the Ukrainian rebels? Their commander, Nadia, is doubtless cautious that we might try just such a thing prior to her lovingly planned execution.

- Lighthearter

 

[ilduce349]

Tell that Ukranians that they will be messing with Ilduce if they try to execute her. They don't want me as an enemy, I can promise them that,.

 

[Ravus_Sol]

The History of England through the eyes of the Mortals​

BC = Before Christianity
AD = After Declaration

The English Tribe - Spirituality: 4000BC - 1200BC (The Age of Wonder)

Spoiler :

4000BC; We Settle down. Island Explored. Seem big. Hide in Village.

3200BC; Alone on Island. Boring. Mainland interesting. Hut for warriors go missing. How Hut get lost? Strange.

2800BC; Workers bullied out of London. Need that cow and stone. They do work.

2480BC; Red Russian scout wave from across big river. They worship man called buddha. He fat. Who we worship? We Jealous.

2080BC; Build big rocks. Biggest Rocks of all! People happy. Us Have Monks who meditate on rocks. Better then fat buddha. Call it Stongehenge. Monks say it is Wonder.

1720BC; Men with horns on head float by on big tree with cloth. They also worship Fat Man. Immortal Leaders say we need to get of island fast.

1720BC; Romans wave to us as well. They wear funny dresses called Toga's. We laugh at them but they no worship Fat man so they OK.

1680BC; Strange man that look like woman says hello. His scouts travel long way. Called Asoka of India.

1200BC; Finally get floating thing of our own. Call it a boat. Sail to mainland. Toga wearing girls making more then one city. We quickly make more then one city too. They ain't having more land then us. Call second city "York"

The English City States - Pioneers: 1200BC - 1AD (The Expansion Age)

Spoiler :

1160BC; Them Law Breakers were thrown out to sea, They manage to make it to the large island to the West and Call themselves Irish of Ireland... Strange. Immortals say we should leave them Independent.

900BC; The Scottish city of Liverpool is built securing the Home Island. Now ships are built and sailors claims the seas. A Big piece of the mainland has lots of resources... good plunder. We call it Spain or Iberia.

625BC; Birmingham is founded in Spain. The Start of a fast expansion to claim the whole landmass there with no club holding thugs. Who needs clubs when we have boats? No-one has ever seen any of these Barbarian Hordes the Immortals worry about.

500BC; Silent Carthage greets us. Diplomatically they have little to do with England. They stick to their little boating lake in the mediterrainian and we stick to our seas.

425BC; The Romans claim all of Germania. Eastern Europe is now in their hands. They have land power...

400BC; Norwich is founded in Southern Spain. Our City States claim land quickly with the Blessing of Stonehenge.

375BC; A Great Prophet emerges from London. He is Called Ravus. Strange man.

275BC; Shaka the Destroyer is in the lowest part of the world... isolated... for now.

250BC; Ramesses II of Middle Egypt reveals himself. They have a useful position in the middle of the known world. Without their open borders we would have to try to sail all around Africa to get to India.

75BC; Nottingham built in the Netherlands to stop Roman settlers getting everywhere. They like bugs.

25BC; All Buddists are enslaved or killed in English lands. Slavery is accepted publically. Strange stuff happening on the mainland. The City States didn't really care... But suddenly one of those Barbarians appeared and only one archer unit was in spain... oops. Maybe we should try this nation stuff...

English Holy Nation - Slave Masters: 1AD - 100AD (The Religious Founding Age)

Spoiler :

1AD; Christianity is founded. England has a Holy Religion!

100AD; The final Spanish settlement is founded, called "Kent". Those Barbarians have settled down and founded a city of their own. We didn't even know they could do that.

British Theocracy - Holy Defenders of the Faith: 100AD - 1000AD (The Ceasarian Wars)

Spoiler :

100AD; Rome declares itself Buddist. They also declare war upon England deriding our new religion even though we have not yet converted to it. The Evil Infidels!

375AD; Roman Pratorians spotted. These super soilders could defeat our military. So far only border clashes have taken place. No mass invasion. Giving England time... Time is what we need. Damn our forefathers for only supporting boats instead of axes and bows. By the grace of the One we just need more time.

400AD; The Roman Army marches on the Holy City of Ravus-York. They are too powerful. We battle bravly but vainly. Ravus-York Falls. During this time our neighbours the Norse Vikings and Buddist Russia also declare war on Rome. Finally acknowledging its agressive war-policy. Stupid Infidels.

425AD; Construction is completed allowing england to start building Catapults. Siege Units, The Kings of Battle. The pass between Spain and France is easily guarded allowing us to stop the Roman Horde from advancing. A Great Artist sings in Amsterdam (The Renamed Nottingham). This allows our borders to push all the way to the edge of Roman cities giving us the ability to use Roads in more lands.

520AD; The Romans leave Ravus-York under defended. Perhaps the troops were needed to defend againt the Vikings or the Russians? Who cares. We Live for the One, We Die for the One. Swordsmen push forward and liberate the Holy City.

700AD; The Romans had enslaved and whipped Ravus-York's population into creating some Tiremes to blockade and pillage English sea lanes. They are still active to this day contending with our now old Galleys.

820AD; The Vikings sign a peace treaty with the Romans. English Galleys manage to sink the Roman Tiremes. Britannia Rules the Waves!

860AD; Plymouth is founded on the south west point of the main island. Securing it from invasion forces.

1000AD; The Mountain Fortress Antium is captured from the Romans! The Catapults rained boulders upon our enemies and now with Antium under our rule we can Block the main Roman Troop deployment Road into English lands. The Eastern Roman provinces declare themselves independent and call themselves German... England cries with one voice that NOW is the time to attack.

British Kingdom - Feudal Crusaders: 1000AD - 1300AD (The War of New German Independence)

Spoiler :

1100AD; One of the Immortals Crowns himself King. Ordained by the One. Neapolis falls. Antium holds against the Infidels and a Viking army is spotted as our ally also pushes back against the Roman Evil. Seems their peace treaty with Rome did not last.

1150AD; Cumae falls to a joint Viking and English assault with English Crusaders just managing to sieze the city in our name first. Arabia declares war on Russia.

1200AD; Germany agrees to become a vassal to our Kingdom provided we protect them from Rome. The Army is thus sent east.

1300AD; Our army lies decimated outside the Roman stronghold of Mediolanum. Behind us is the Norse Vikings army and to the east is our Vassal Germany. The king decides to ask for aid from our vassal and promise the city to them instead of letting any part of italy fall into Norse hands. The Immortal Ragnar is annoyed. Tough. Long Live the King!

British Imperial Empire - Knights of Peace: 1300AD - Present (The Golden Age)

Spoiler :

1310AD; The Wars end. Rome surrenders. Italy is annexed into English lands and the Vassal of our growing empire is pleased with his new city. For now, all is well.

1320AD; Norse Vikings found their own empire and put forward the old Roman lands as their vassal. Now named Greece. Relations sour.

1360AD; Vikings demand that England become buddist in the face of the rising Hindu block now bound together under the Indian Aposolistic Palace. We Decline.

1390AD; The Isolated Japan manages to sneak an envoy to meet england... They are weak and can be ignored. The Pious Koreans also send envoys. Obviously they are merely the snivling lackeys of India.

1440AD; Joint Viking and Russian Naval force spotted heading for the English Isle...

1450AD; The Irish Mongols. Our long time isolated friend falls to this Norse agression. Vikings claim the northern isles. Russia Claims Ireland.

1520AD; The Taj Mahal is built. Signaling this time of Golden Nationialism.

1545AD; The United States are met after a Galley managed to sail all the way across the Atlantic Ocean.

1550AD; The Arabs try to get England to decalre war on the Russians. They seem annoyed they lost the Aposolistic Palace election to India.

1580AD; The Egyptians bow to the Souther Zulu Devils who Worship Confucianism.

1590AD; When a Viking City is starving English patriots provide them with food earning their good will... perhaps war with the north is not needed after all...

1600AD; The Hindu block alliance explodes. Japan and Korea come to blows and Arabia lures in war allies against India, but now it is fighting a war on two fronts.

1625AD; Arabia secures Moscow the Russian Capital. They now hold the Buddist Holy City...

 

[W|M]

Why are you all so eager for war? It's disgusting. Russia is weak, we have nothing to worry about them setting up shop in Ireland. Think of them as the New Mongols.

 

[ilduce349]

Why are you all so eager for war? It's disgusting. Russia is weak, we have nothing to worry about them setting up shop in Ireland. Think of them as the New Mongols.

Better yet, with the Vikings finally acknowledging us as a potential ally, we should liberate Russia from the Arabs and take control of the Buddhist Holy city (Think of the gold bonus). We can then declare free religion and gain more respect of the Vikings and Carthaginians (who are Buddhist).

 

[Spectrite]

How are the American civs doing tech-wise? Judging by their low score, it doesn't seem to be very well...

 

[arya126]

Guys I'm still here reading. Cant type much right now. Hopefully I will be able to reply in full later.

 

[Aysee]

American Civs always do poorly.

What do you guys think should be done with our great people? I personally think we should rush the Globe Theater with him, or maybe West Point.

If we can start winning Vikingdom over, that rules out a potential threat. However, the Arabs are starting to flex their dominance... Perhaps we could negotiate something with the Russians; We give them military aid if they yield Ireland... Just a thought.

I support providing additional funding to the scientists.