Rebalance of 2/3 of all civs in April!

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

For Wihelmina, I don't really know what we have to do. First, I think the Trade Route have to be interesting for both ends: why would I want them to enjoy a free Culture? Maybe it just need to be unrestricted like: "Each Trade Route from or towards a Dutch city yields 1 Culture for the sending city and 1 Loyalty for the recipient city". It will not be strong, but useable and interesting. You could also add a little extra but gimmicky thing with the Broadcast Center like "Each Trade Route from or towards a Dutch city yields 1 Culture for the sending city and 1 Loyalty for the recipient city. Those value are doubled if the city has a Broadcast Center."

Never really thought of utilizing the broadcast center before in the ability. I guess with Radio Oranje that's a reasonable approach, but only late game. I've suggested maybe increasing the current yields whenever they research certain "communication" techs and civics such as writing, recorded history, printing, and radio etc.

 

[Menocchio]

If the developers do actually go the full distance and turn polders from just another water improvement into proper land reclamation, I will be thoroughly impressed. I think the main anxiety over the April patch remains the depth, rather than the breadth, of the changes that are going to be made. Will they outright alter systems, or simply change numbers?

 

[Aurelesk]

Never really thought of utilizing the broadcast center before in the ability. I guess with Radio Oranje that's a reasonable approach, but only late game. I've suggested maybe increasing the current yields whenever they research certain "communication" techs and civics such as writing, recorded history, printing, and radio etc.

I edited and changed the ability into: "Each internationnal Trade Route from or toward your cities yields 1 Culture and 1 Loyalty for both cities. Those values are doubled if the city has a Broadcast Center." You are far too quick to quote and answer!

I don't know about "flat" increase from key Technologies or Civics. The policy cards are doing the job quite decently. Too bad the only domestic Trade Routes policy cards are locked behind a Dark Age between the classical and renaissance era (Isolationism) or behind Communism (Collectivization). But I guess it makes sense: you want to reward more those who engage into diplomatic actions. If domestic Trade Routes are going to be too good, then there would be no real downside from going to war too much and having no allies or trading partners. Democracy's legacy / Wisselbanken are amazing policy cards. Amazing policy cards that work with Cities-States. In a sense, you can already circumvent having no allies or trading partner with Cities-States.
Maybe we need more "domestic trade route" card after all!


From what I understand from Wihelmina ability is the whole Resistance effort and internationnal passive or indirect assistance during the WWII. But there is no real "Resistance" side of her ability, except for the Loyalty mechanic which is quite underwhelming. Maybe she needs a "When a civilization declares war to you, all Trade Routes it has with you are instanly plundered. Yields doubled from plundering Trade Routes." That's sabotage! Also it works as a way to convey "stealing the spice trade from Portugal" and the whole pirate history.
This will further prevent the player to declare war to her, while she has a way to "know" if someone is going to declare war to her. If you are not trading with her, while she proposes free Culture to you, then she knows you are up to no good! And her agenda would make sense!

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

If the developers do actually go the full distance and turn polders from just another water improvement into proper land reclamation, I will be thoroughly impressed. I think the main anxiety over the April patch remains the depth, rather than the breadth, of the changes that are going to be made. Will they outright alter systems, or simply change numbers?

I think before they said it was too hard to implement. Now with Canals and Bridges changing things up in GS I'm curious to see if they could make it to where land units can traverse polders without embarking.

I edited and changed the ability into: "Each internationnal Trade Route from or toward a Dutch city yields 1 Culture and 1 Loyalty for both cities. Those values are doubled if the city has a Broadcast Center." You are far to quick to quote and answer!

Not sure if I like the idea of giving loyalty to another civilization, but I do like the synergy between you and the other civilization getting something in return.

Maybe you gain +4 loyalty in the origin city for international trade routes while the other civilization cities gain +2 culture? I still think only 1 of each still might not be too much.

 

[Aurelesk]

I think before they said it was too hard to implement. Now with Canals and Bridges changing things up in GS I'm curious to see if they could make it to where land units can traverse polders without embarking.

I am afraid if Polders do count as land tiles, it would be possible to replace all Coast tiles into Lands tiles in the process. All Coasts are now Polders!
Instead, maybe the Netherlands could have the ability to put districts on Polders tile improvement. I don't know how it will be done, but it would be a nice addition and add a unique flavor to the civilization.

Not sure if I like the idea of giving loyalty to another civilization, but I do like the synergy between you and the other civilization getting something in return.

Maybe you gain +4 loyalty in the origin city for international trade routes while the other civilization cities gain +2 culture? I still think only 1 of each still might not be too much.

We are slowly getting back to the original ability! I know what you want: better value. Dare I say: good enough value so it can be useable! And... I am afraid the Netherlands are already powerful and making Wihelmina too decent will end up to have a civilization way too powerful*. I guess the middle ground could be:
« Your Trade Routes provide +2 Loyalty per turn for the starting city. Each internationnal Trade Route from or toward your cities yields 1 Culture for both cities. Loyalty and Culture are doubled if the city has a Broadcast Center. »
The change from the original ability are: Loyalty is increased and not specific to domestic trade routes; other civilizations can enjoy the Culture so they are more likely to send a Trade Route to Wihelmina, meaning she will probably enjoy more Culture from her ability if both ends enjoy from it; and a way to increase the yields by the end game.

* : I say that, but I am not even coherent/consistent with myself, because I want to add to her ability this: « When a civilization declares war to you, all Trade Routes it has with you are instantly plundered. Yields doubled from plundering Trade Routes. »

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I am afraid if Polders do count as land tiles, it would be possible to replace all Coast tiles into Lands tiles in the process. All Coasts are now Polders!
Instead, maybe the Netherlands could have the ability to put districts on Polders tile improvement. I don't know how it will be done, but it would be a nice addition and add a unique flavor to the civilization.

I don't know about making them completely land tiles, but just allow land units to be able to traverse on them, similar to how the Golden Gate Bridge Wonder works.

We are slowly getting back to the original ability! I know what you want: better value. Dare I say: good enough value so it can be useable! And... I am afraid the Netherlands are already powerful and making Wihelmina too decent will end up to have a civilization way too powerful*. I guess the middle ground could be:
« Your Trade Routes provide +2 Loyalty per turn for the starting city. Each internationnal Trade Route from or toward your cities yields 1 Culture for both cities. Loyalty and Culture are doubled if the city has a Broadcast Center. »
The change from the original ability are: Loyalty is increased and not specific to domestic trade routes; other civilizations can enjoy the Culture so they are more likely to send a Trade Route to Wihelmina, meaning she will probably enjoy more Culture from her ability if both ends enjoy from it; and a way to increase the yields by the end game.

Yeah I realize making the ability too powerful, might make them OP. Though after Portugal's release I think it will help them considering most of the time her leader ability in the game is non-existent to begin with. The same goes for Peter too.

 

[Menocchio]

I return with wild speculation: could this be a new asset coming in April? https://twitter.com/actsukrit/status/1377292929757192193

My reasoning: Sukritact has done freelance asset modeling (not modding, but official work) for the NFP recently, having made the Portuguese, Gallic, and Byzantine palaces. Below this tweet, someone asked if it is for a new resource mod, and Sukritact replied no, that it is for something else - with a little cheeky emote at the end. Also, Kevin liked the image, and he has also consistently been cheeky in his hints for April.

The developers have uniquely done interviews about the April patch specifically, and have touted it as a "beefy" pack - not update. Altogether, I take this as suggesting the April patch genuinely is going to be big, and prior evidence further suggests that it is something they have been working on for quite some time. Before now, one of the main mysteries about the April patch was if it was going to involve new assets or not, which is a serious indicator of its beefiness.

What do you think? Am I on to something, or have I lost my mind?

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I return with wild speculation: could this be a new asset coming in April? https://twitter.com/actsukrit/status/1377292929757192193

My reasoning: Sukritact has done freelance asset modeling (not modding, but official work) for the NFP recently, having made the Portuguese, Gallic, and Byzantine palaces. Below this tweet, someone asked if it is for a new resource mod, and Sukritact replied no, that it is for something else - with a little cheeky emote at the end. Also, Kevin liked the image, and he has also consistently been cheeky in his hints for April.

The developers have uniquely done interviews about the April patch specifically, and have touted it as a "beefy" pack - not update. Altogether, I take this as suggesting the April patch genuinely is going to be big, and prior evidence further suggests that it is something they have been working on for quite some time. Before now, one of the main mysteries about the April patch was if it was going to involve new assets or not, which is a serious indicator of its beefiness.

What do you think? Am I on to something, or have I lost my mind?

Is that bison on the right side of the picture?

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

I return with wild speculation: could this be a new asset coming in April? https://twitter.com/actsukrit/status/1377292929757192193

My reasoning: Sukritact has done freelance asset modeling (not modding, but official work) for the NFP recently, having made the Portuguese, Gallic, and Byzantine palaces. Below this tweet, someone asked if it is for a new resource mod, and Sukritact replied no, that it is for something else - with a little cheeky emote at the end. Also, Kevin liked the image, and he has also consistently been cheeky in his hints for April.

The developers have uniquely done interviews about the April patch specifically, and have touted it as a "beefy" pack - not update. Altogether, I take this as suggesting the April patch genuinely is going to be big, and prior evidence further suggests that it is something they have been working on for quite some time. Before now, one of the main mysteries about the April patch was if it was going to involve new assets or not, which is a serious indicator of its beefiness.

What do you think? Am I on to something, or have I lost my mind?

No, my brother... WE have lost our minds.

In all seriousness, given how Kevin voted on a poll earlier and stated that he voted for a wrong option, and with this new information, I am stoked for April.

Is that bison on the right side of the picture?

No, it's on the right side. Damn it, I was gonna correct you, and then you corrected yourself.

 

[Menocchio]

Is that bison on the right side of the picture?

Bison are from Sukritact's resources mod, so not something new.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Bison are from Sukritact's resources mod, so not something new.

Well I was way more excited about seeing the bison then the kelp, but still something new to speculate.

Would kelp be considered a feature or a resource?

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Would kelp be considered a feature or a resource?

Sukritact's wording doesn't help.

 

[Menocchio]

It looks more like a feature to me considering how numerous it is. Maybe +1 food or something, considering how many cultures subsisted off of seaweed and seaweed-dwelling creatures in the past.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

It looks more like a feature to me considering how numerous it is. Maybe +1 food or something, considering how many cultures subsisted off of seaweed and seaweed-dwelling creatures in the past.

Well possibly a feitoria/Portugal nerf already if it's not a removable resource.

 

[AsH2]

I'm thinking of a CO2-revamp..

 

[Eva-kun]

Polders on marsh and flood plains been brought up?

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Polders on marsh and flood plains been brought up?

Looooooong time ago.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

I return with wild speculation: could this be a new asset coming in April? https://twitter.com/actsukrit/status/1377292929757192193

My reasoning: Sukritact has done freelance asset modeling (not modding, but official work) for the NFP recently, having made the Portuguese, Gallic, and Byzantine palaces. Below this tweet, someone asked if it is for a new resource mod, and Sukritact replied no, that it is for something else - with a little cheeky emote at the end. Also, Kevin liked the image, and he has also consistently been cheeky in his hints for April.

The developers have uniquely done interviews about the April patch specifically, and have touted it as a "beefy" pack - not update. Altogether, I take this as suggesting the April patch genuinely is going to be big, and prior evidence further suggests that it is something they have been working on for quite some time. Before now, one of the main mysteries about the April patch was if it was going to involve new assets or not, which is a serious indicator of its beefiness.

What do you think? Am I on to something, or have I lost my mind?

I think it's pretty obvious the bonus April content is mermaids.

 

[sukritact]

I’m just reworking coastal gameplay as part of a mod. The kelp is NOT official content.

the “it’s not a new resource” is because, as someone correctly guessed, I’m adding kelp forests as a feature.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

I’m just reworking coastal gameplay as part of a mod. The kelp is NOT official content.

the “it’s not a new resource” is because, as someone correctly guessed, I’m adding kelp forests as a feature.

Okay got it. The official content is hidden inside the kelp forests.