Returning Civ Leaders-Elimination Thread

[Roman Citizen]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 22+1=23 He is the most interesting of the remaining.
Hammurabi 29
Hannibal Barca 28
João II 24-3=21 I like Joao II but he is the least interesting of the remaining.
Louis XIV 31
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Siptah]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 24 (23+1) More cultural leaders. And since Barbarossa is military focused, this could give Germany a nice twist.
Hammurabi 29
Hannibal Barca 25 (28-3) A good choice for Carthage, but for me Carthage is a very low priority. To be honest, it would be much, much lower (and much less known) if it wasn't for this guy.
João II 21
Louis XIV 31
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Zaarin]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 24
Hammurabi 26 (29 - 3) -- I'd prefer a Neo-Babylonian emperor like Nabopolassar or Nebuchadnezzar.
Hannibal Barca 25
João II 21
Louis XIV 32 (31 + 1) -- I grant that Lincoln was more humble than Louis XIV (or indeed that just about anyone was more humble than Louis XIV...), but I'm not convinced that humility is a desirable quality in a game whose art style seems to favor the bombastic.
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Morningcalm]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 24
Hammurabi 26
Hannibal Barca 25 + 1 = 26 (Upvoting him for his generalship and his economic management as sufet. What an epic and successful life he led, even if it ended in tragedy. He should outlast Joao at least.)
João II 21
Louis XIV 32 - 3 = 29 (He was arrogant, but that just makes him cartoony over bombastic. He bankrupted his nation. While he was an art lover, that hardly makes him that compelling an include IMO (especially since other leaders, like Frederick the Great, also were art fanatics). Not impressed with his leadership except in that he was able to subdue the nobility, but that would be tricky to represent in-game anyway.)
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[IgorS]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 24
Hammurabi 26 + 1 = 27 - He's a must in Civ, and it was weird not to have him in Civ V.
Hannibal Barca 26 - 3 = 23 - Looks like he's the next to go.
João II 21
Louis XIV 29
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Kimiimaro]

Hannibal Barca 26 - 3 = 23 - Looks like he's the next to go.

I disagree.

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 24-3=21 - Frankly, Germany doesn't need another ruler right now. This one was cultured, played flute, etc. But I prefer Ashoka and Louis XIV as alternative rulers of their countries due the bad leader choices. Germany has good leader, so we don't need another one.
Hammurabi 27
Hannibal Barca 23+1=24 - He's dropping too fast. He was great ruler, general, builder, admiral... He had incredible life. He beated Rome several times and Carthage became economic superpower of Mediterranean again. We need him.
João II 21
Louis XIV 29
Mansa Musa 35
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Roman Citizen]

Ashoka 31
Frederick the Great 21+1=22 He was not just cultured, but one of the best defense military leaders ever. He was seen as an old fatherly figure and made Prussia a state to inspire from or at least to see it in awe.
Hannibal Barca 24
João II 21
Louis XIV 29
Mansa Musa 35-3=32 He was mega rich, crashed an entire economy, and funded stuff. He just doesn't scream big personality to me.
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Siptah]

Ashoka 28 (31-3) I prefer other Indian rulers
Frederick the Great 22
Hannibal Barca 24
Hammurabi 27
João II 22 (21+1) While he might be not as great as some others on the list, I think he is the best choice for Portugal.
Louis XIV 29
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Zaarin]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 22
Hannibal Barca 25 (24 + 1) -- Kimiimaro is right, he's dropping too fast.
Hammurabi 24 (27 - 3) -- Nabopolassar for emperor of Babylon, please.
João II 22
Louis XIV 29
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Manifold]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 22
Hannibal Barca 25
Hammurabi 25 (24+1) must have him
João II 22
Louis XIV 26 (29-3) second leader should be from another era
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Morningcalm]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 22
Hannibal Barca 25
Hammurabi 25 + 1 = 26 (Upvoting my favorite Machiavellian ruler in Mesopotamia. He made alliances to win wars, then turned around and broke them every time, yet somehow won, made an important legal code, and enhanced life for his citizens with numerous civic improvements (hence his title of Bani Matim, or Builder of the Land).)
João II 22
Louis XIV 26 - 3 = 23 (Pompous, rather than glorious. A warrior who bankrupted his nation and left pretty tourist buildings, but there are better leaders, and more storied leaders)
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Kimiimaro]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 22-3=19 - I'm sorry, but Germany really doesn't need another leader. We don't really need him.
Hannibal Barca 25+1=26 - Yes please. Military genius, great leader, represents Civ that isn't in game. I really want him.
Hammurabi 26
João II 22
Louis XIV 23
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Zaarin]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 19
Hannibal Barca 26
Hammurabi 23 (26 - 3) -- Great leader, wrong era. Firaxis has shown a preference in Civ6 for leaders who ruled their empire at its apex, which means a Neo-Babylonian ruler. Plus Neo-Babylon was simply more significant.
João II 22
Louis XIV 24 (23 + 1) -- "L'État demeurera toujours."
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Siptah]

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 20 (19+1) While it makes my stomach rumoring a bit when I think of a pre-imperial Prussian leading Germany - I think he is a solid choice if you don't want a later leader and not double up on medieval ones.
Hannibal Barca 23 (26-3) I'm just not too much into Carthage. Give me the Phoenicians this time! And I fear Hannibal would lead Carthage to an end similar to Gilgamesh and Sumeria. Mountain crossing bonuses for Carthage? No, thanks! Elephant UU? Again, no! Carthage certainly was more than this one time event.
Hammurabi 23
João II 22
Louis XIV 24
Mansa Musa 32
Suryavarman II 25

 

[Zaarin]

@Siptah To be fair concerning the elephant UU, Carthage most certainly did employ now-extinct North African elephants in warfare; that being said, in the scope of Punic history a naval UU like the quinquereme makes more sense. Maybe attach the elephant to Hannibal himself like Teddy's Rough Riders?

 

[Siptah]

@Siptah To be fair concerning the elephant UU, Carthage most certainly did employ now-extinct North African elephants in warfare; that being said, in the scope of Punic history a naval UU like the quinquereme makes more sense. Maybe attach the elephant to Hannibal himself like Teddy's Rough Riders?

Yes, they probably did, like the Ptolemaic kings and others after them. But not on the scale that many people think they did. Livy and Polybius are also contradict themselves when describing how they were used and equipped, which doesn't help. And I don't think that any modern scholars would agree any more with a horde of 80 elephants occurring in a single battle (Zama) as described by those two. If that battle ever happened (which some scholars seem to doubt), it did employ probably 0 elephants. The rest is of course propaganda.
If I think of Carthaginian warfare, I think of mercenaries more than anything else (and ships, yes). So a UU that goes into that direction would make sense to me (not buildable but cheap to buy). Numidian Cavalry as a horseman addition perhaps?
And yes - as a UU for Hannibal, this could work. But wouldn't it put more focus on war for Carthage if it gets 2 early UUs? I'd be happy to see it in a more trading and colonizing way with an emphasis on doing this by sea. So exactly like I would do their Phoenician ancestors as well. Which is why I think they should be replaced by them for once.

 

[Zaarin]

@Siptah I do agree on all points, and I'd love to see the devs remember that Carthaginian history is so much more than the Punic Wars. Sumer doesn't give me high hopes, however...

 

[Manifold]

early vote today

Ashoka 28
Frederick the Great 20
Hannibal Barca 23
Hammurabi 23
João II 22
Louis XIV 24
Mansa Musa 33 (32+1) needs more points
Suryavarman II 22 (25-3) this time him

 

[Roman Citizen]

Ashoka 28-3=25 I like Ashoka but there are so many other people in India's history to choose from.
Frederick the Great 20+1=21 Same as last time.
Hannibal Barca 23
Hammurabi 23
João II 22
Louis XIV 24
Mansa Musa 33
Suryavarman II 22

 

[IgorS]

Ashoka 25 + 1 = 26 - He should be the first choice for India
Frederick the Great 21
Hannibal Barca 23 - 3 = 20 - I actually prefer Dido, because I agree with what was said earlier about Carthage being not just Hannibal and his North African elephants
Hammurabi 23
João II 22
Louis XIV 24
Mansa Musa 33
Suryavarman II 22