Rise of Asia

[ShiroKobbure]

I am sorry. I went back home to Japan. Then returned to the US. I have had many computer problems lately. I have reformatted 3 times just this week. I am taking many classes this semester, also I am working often, because we have new owner and almost everyones has quit! Also I have had problems in my love life...

I came up with a better way for me to make leaderheads faster. So once I finish downloading the files I need for poser. I am going to stop all other projects I have for civ 3 I just focus on heads. For now Rise of Asia will only be 2 eras, Ancient and Medievil.

I am going to set a release date for Jan 2007.

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

I'm glad your alright Shiro. I was worried you had left the mod!

Any thoughts on the tech trees?

 

[Blue Monkey]

Shirou, you've been back more than a month; computer problems this week are not the issue.

If love, school, and work, in other words Real Life, make it so Civ has to be made a lower priority, that's fine. There have been times when Sword of Geddon or myself have had to do the same thing.

Don't react by making arbitrary decisions that will cripple the project (like cutting the tech tree in half just to reduce the number of Leaderheads you feel obligated to make, or setting an arbitrary deadline that's unconnected with any assessment of what work remains to be done).

Do the work you're able to do; let the project come to fruition. Try to understand the first quote in my sig - there's a reason the Roman Empire lasted as long as it did - & it fell apart when public image became more important than honest assesment of available resources and ego superceded commitment to the task at hand.

 

[Virote_Considon]

Virote's still here, if he's needed!

 

[ShiroKobbure]

are we going to have specific religious techs?

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

Did you see the tech trees I posted Shiro? I already made adjustments to them as Blue recommended I should. All that remains is the addition of more techs, units etc to iron it out. I have yet to add all the civs.

 

[ShiroKobbure]

I saw it, thats why I asked.

 

[ShiroKobbure]

Hows this?

correction: Code of Laws leads to Legalism, not Confucionsim

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

Looking good Shiro.

 

[ShiroKobbure]

Governments so far:
Tribalism
Monarchy
Legalism
Shogunate/Bakufu

Possible goverments?
Republic
Theocracy
Fedualism
Khanate? (no tech required, all Steppes Civs start as Khanates)

Other possible Techs in Ancient era:
Naval Warfare
Taoism
Siege engines
Nobility
Armor
Crossbows

 

[Sword_Of_Geddon]

Naval Warfare is a good one, which I have in the tech tree I was working on already, I like the others, the more the merrier.

What about calling Monarchy Dynasty for flavor purposes?

 

[ShiroKobbure]

Possible 2nd era techs:
Bakufu
Piracy
State Religion
Contact with the West
Compass
Ocean Navagation
Gun Powder
Fedualism
Alchemy
Chemistry
Physics
Isolationism
Bushido
Literature
Nationalism

 

[Ogedei_the_Mad]

Three suggestions:

1) Rename "Pottery" to "Irrigation." Pottery goes way back into Neolithic times and long before people even started farming.

2) Isolationsim shouldn't really be considered a tech. It mostly occurred due to a combination of negative internal and external political pressures. Also, Asian empires were never truly isolationistic; it was mostly the government attempting to clamp down on contact although merchants and coastal communities continued to deal with foreigners.

3) There were indeed democratic and republic-like systems utilized, but that was mostly done at the local level and not the government level. Perhaps replace "Republic" with "Bureaucratic Monarchy." Although there were no "Republic" style governments in Asia, Asian monarchies were some of the most sophisticated in the world, which is the reason why they lasted so long.

 

[Quinzy]

wasnt gunpowder in the far east as early as 600BC?

 

[ShiroKobbure]

"Gunpowder was the first known chemical explosive and propellant.[1] The earliest record of gunpowder, a Chinese book from c. 850 CE called 'Classified Essentials of the Mysterious Tao of the True Origin of Things'"

"The Chinese first used gunpowder in warfare in 904, as incendiary projectiles called 'flying fires.'"
Wikipedia

 

[ShiroKobbure]

@ Ogedei_the_Mad, what about the Mahajanapadas of India? Werent those republics?
the Republic could be a tech that is only found when a civ finds that the Mahajanapadas barbarian camp in India. Is that even possible with the editor?

 

[Blue Monkey]

Not possible AFAIK

 

[Ogedei_the_Mad]

There were systems reminiscent of republic and democratic systems (such as the Balinese "subak", which existed only at the local village level), but they were not very common. I'm not so certain about South Asia, but in Eastern Asia (including Vietnam), sophisticated bureaucratic systems staffed by educated administrative officials usually served as a counter-balance to excessive despotism. In imperial China, the emperor technically had absolute power, but in many cases, he still could not get things done without the consensus of his council.

 

[ShiroKobbure]

Wonders:
Prambanan (Hinduism)
Great Wall (Masonry)
Temple of Heaven (?)
Sun Tzu's Art of War (Warrior Code)
Kabuki Theater (public entertainment?)
Golden Horde (The Horde (Steppes unqiue tech))
Angkor Temple (Fedualism)
Terracotta Army (Caste System)
Itsukushima Shrine (Shintoism (Japan's unquie tech))
Zheng He's voyage(Ocean Going Vessels?)

Small Wonders:
Geat Buddha (Buddhism)
Forbiden City (?)

 

[Blue Monkey]

There were systems reminiscent of republic and democratic systems ... but they were not very common. I'm not so certain about South Asia...

Commonality (or the lack thereof) is not a valid argument. One could argue that tyrants were far more common than democracy in the Graeco-Roman world as well. The Mahajanapada style of government would look very much like an Athenian style of Democracy (probably more like what we would call an Oligarchy/Republic).

Wonders:
Prambanan (Hinduism)
....
Small Wonders:
Geat Buddha (Buddhism)

The monolithic (cut from a single stone) temple complex at Mahabalipuram would make a more suitable Wonder for Hinduism, IMHO. It's actually in the homeland of Hinduism, and in addition to its aesthetic appeal combines cultural elements of Dravidian and Aryan architecture and evolved as Hinduism evolved, later incorporating theistic elements from Buddhism.

Buddhists were noted for founding centers of learning such as Nalanda University, which among other things, became centers for medical research. Some such would be a suitable SW.