Shadow Game - First Time at Monarch

[Fippy]

We can make a great example of unhappies don't eat food when producing settlers & workers thou, in Hamburg

Spoiler :

Still making 10h here, not too bad. 5 from food surplus which means neither unhappy or unealthy matter much (for this example).
Ofc with a warrior inside you could also take the ph mine from Berlin.

So if we want another settler, Hamburg could do that as well (or worker as Lymond suggested).
Imo settler looks better, workers are out of chopping around Berlin but we have 2 more great city spots close.

 

[Gumbolt]

Yeah size 2 capital building a settler is not great.
Unhappiness in Hamburg due to no MP. These things should of been obvious to spot before they happened. 40H settler and whip or worker whip.
2440bc you got the wheel. Ivory still not hooked up.
You have built up 76 gold. At 100% science you are -4 gold. You could of had fishing 2 turns ago. Fish would of helped with health too. No need building up so much gold.
The granary also provides +1 health with rice.
Fishing and a tech for border pops would really help here.
I don't see a big threat on monarch with barbs. Main danger is barb cities spawning.

So fish then writing? Or are monuments quiclker for border pops? A city would need 30H for a 2 pop whip for library.

Saving some forest here might of been useful.

 

[Olafeson]

I was surprised you didn't go fishing first

May i ask the question if there could ever be a reason not to go fishing ? I heard that fishing is the best tech in the game.

 

[Olafeson]

Fishing and a tech for border pops would really help here.

If OldDude doesn t have mysticism or writing yet, it would be an absoute waste of beakers to go for fishing. What use has a workboat, if the seafood is outside his cultural borders and he needs a borderpop anyway.

In this specific case, i think Munich would get the borderpop a lot quicker with a monument. It has only FP to grow to size 4. Probably best way for a border pop would be grow to size 2 on a farmed FP and then work a forest for a few turns + 1 chop. It still could use a librabry later, to work 2 scientists, but for that it needs to grow first for the librabry whip and then regrow to size 4 or above to run 2 scientists.

 

[elmurcis]

May i ask the question if there could ever be a reason not to go fishing ? I heard that fishing is the best tech in the game.

"Only reason not to go Fishing is when you start with Fishing"

 

[OldDude]

Agreed with everything @lymond said. After clam city I would definitely go to the SE fish. It has THREE food specials in the BFC and plenty of cottageable grass riverside tiles.

@OldDude - I was surprised you didn't go fishing first. If you had before pottery, you would've gotten a 20% discount on researching that tech (or is it researching it 20% faster...not sure the details but the general idea is the same). The basic thing about techs is that for every direct prerequisite you have (as indicated by an arrow pointing to it), you research that tech faster.

I felt I needed Pottery before Fishing as I didn't have any coastal cities yet. The one up north needs a border pop before it can claim that seafood and that will take a while. Anyway, is it worth it to tech something you don't need yet to gain that discount? I would imagine the answer to that might be that it's situational?

After fishing definitely go writing and then alphabet.

Good job on city placement - those are not where I would've put it but decent spots nonetheless. A small critique - I would've 2-pop whipped a granary in Hamburg. At 4 pop that city is both unhappy and unhealthy, decreasing efficiency a lot; if you had the granary earlier you could've put the OF into a warrior to get rid of 1 , gotten an extra , AND grown twice as efficiently from then onward.

What follows is more of a theoretical discussion on tech order - you don't have to replay turns but in shadowing your shadow game I experimented with some things. That being said...I went TW, fishing, and pottery all before BW. My rationale for this was fourfold: with the sizeable sum of extra commerce I got from those techs (city connections, WB/working water tiles, and cottages, respectively), I would've reached BW in short order anyways, and furthermore be in far better economic shape to show for it. Additionally, having granaries quite early on increases whip efficiency by just about double, meaning you get more mileage from BW if, by the time you reach it, granaries are in place or at least in progress. There are not a lot of forests and not a lot of food to start with anyways (wet rice and hill pigs is solid, but the rest is seafood requiring WBs and/or border pops), so the actual gain from whipping compared to not whipping and chopping later is dampened, say, compared to a triple wet corn start with flatland pigs and wheat nearby while every other tile is covered in forest. Finally, the saying "food is king" still holds true - and I feel like I got a lot more out of this start from settling the obvious 1st-ring food sources and teching what enabled me to improve them as fast as possible; hence, fishing at least before BW. Keep in mind too that even unimproved, seafood is a nice source of early commerce, acting basically as a riverside cottage that needs no workerturns or pottery and cannot be pillaged. Same with lake tile(s) as well.

Anyhow - here is my 2240BC position; notice how I have pottery and all the stuff before, but also am just about at BW as well, AND I have 3 cities to show for it - even without whips or chops I haven't had much trouble expanding. The only drawback to a tech path like this is having to slow-build work boats for a bit as well as lower production in general at least until BW, but here the PH helps a lot, and once BW is in I can get those suckers out in a pinch. I do need more warriors though. About to whip a worker in Berlin in 3-4 turns; using whip OF to complete granaries is also something I like to do. Finally, notice the lion to the right - barbs units haven't even started spawning in full force on t44, as there are still animals. This alone should demonstrate that, on monarch, on a map like this, barbs shouldn't be a problem until much, much farther down the line, if ever.

Also if you're planning something with the GLH and/or Oracle it helps to save some forests...like I eventually do here.

Spoiler :

View attachment 530612

That's very nice @Fish Man ! I've been taught to get to BW as soon as possible so you can get to chopping and also to reveal copper. Since in this game I went AH early and there were no horses anywhere I felt like I needed to see if there was any metal anywhere as soon as possible in addition to getting to chop. Your position at this point in the game looks better than mine without the chopping so maybe I should keep an open mind on when to go BW instead of doing it by rote.

Thanks a bunch for your feedback!

 

[OldDude]

No, the ivory is not hooked up.

By "hooked up" I thought you meant improved, which is was. I thought about roading it but didn't want to get chastised for building unnecessary roads but it turns out it needs a road to be hooked up to get the happy bonus. My bad, lesson learned.

Well, it's pretty simple really. Without any happies connected, the cap gets an extra happy from the Palace, so it will need MP at Size 5. All other cities need MP at size 4. (Note: Charismatic trait gives one extra happy from trait and 1 from a monument)

This I didn't know either and that is a case of not paying attention to some small details. Another lesson learned.

​

So, what you do is either stall growth in a city - like with a worker or settler - or plan to 2 pop whip something at size 4 (or 5). For instance, Hamburg could have planned to 2pop whip granary at size 4 but too late since more than 29H has been produced (40H). Or 1 pop whip the granary earlier at size 3 or 2 into a settler or worker for a bit until unhappy wears off or you can station a unit there.

Happy/unhappy can be seen in the top right of the city screen just right of the Food Bar at the top. Regardless of what the messages say in the tooltip there, it is simple math.
inot
I think you best thing here in Ham is to queue up a worker this turn and then immediately 2pop whip it next turn into the granary. New worker can hook up ivory and then help chop around Munich or cottage.

Berlin worker might as well start road to clams city. Hop on pigs to road then road a tile N of pigs. Then he can move to forest next to plains hill near clams to start chop for WB, which should work out well if my timing are correct.

I'd say 1pop settler in Berlin in 2 turns into granary, then let Berlin grow for a while. 1t into granary then start a warrior.

Finish Fishing now, you've accumulated too way more gold than you need to finish it. Try to be cognizant of that. You want to complete techs as soon as you have enough gold.

Yep, as Fishman said, and he should know his Fishing, here I would have teched Fish before POT for the bonus.

(A second scout wb out of clam city later might be nice to open trade routes along coast. Just start sending it W/NW toward Monty)

Thanks for your help!

 

[OldDude]

Yeah size 2 capital building a settler is not great.
Unhappiness in Hamburg due to no MP. These things should of been obvious to spot before they happened. 40H settler and whip or worker whip.
2440bc you got the wheel. Ivory still not hooked up.
You have built up 76 gold. At 100% science you are -4 gold. You could of had fishing 2 turns ago. Fish would of helped with health too. No need building up so much gold.
The granary also provides +1 health with rice.
Fishing and a tech for border pops would really help here.
I don't see a big threat on monarch with barbs. Main danger is barb cities spawning.

So fish then writing? Or are monuments quiclker for border pops? A city would need 30H for a 2 pop whip for library.

Saving some forest here might of been useful.

RE: Gold-fishing, yes I should have gone to 100% research earlier, but I just missed it. It wasn't done "on purpose" but I do need to keep a close eye on that.
Thanks for your feedback @Gumbolt, I appreciate it.

 

[OldDude]

Sorry everybody, got busy and couldn't get back to this for a few days.

OK it appears I didn't do much right in my turns from 45 to 51 so I went back to 45 to do it over. I roaded the ivory to get it hooked up, I'm building warrior in Berlin to allow it to grow so I'm not building settler with only 2 population. I just finished a 2-pop granary in Munich and will probably go warrior until Writing is in then I will start on Library. That worker in Munich will move to the FP shared between Berlin and the new city up north to start on a cottage. Fishing is in, teching Writing. I'll switch to 0% research in 2 turns and then switch back to 100% as soon as is possible. After Berlin gets up to 4 population I'll start on another settler for the clam city. Worker up north chopping Granary.

Spoiler T51 Version 2 :

Let me know how this version looks and thanks again to ALL for your help!

 

[lymond]

Yep, if you know an early city will have fish as a food resource, there is no harm in going Fish before POT.

I assume you meant 2pop gran in Ham. With OF from gran whip and chop next turn, I would put those hammers into a new settler for 1t. Then maybe a warrior or just continue with barracks for a few turns until you grow onto ivory - then finish settler.

Two things that stand out to me here that need correcting:

1) Berlin should take back its FP for growth. Max growth while growing, and you have a gran in Berlin now so even more important. This really goes to paying more attention to what tiles cities are working each turn, especially after they grow.

2) Not sure what the exact worker actions were for the Berlin worker, but I'm inclined to do something else before that NW cottage. There was a forest to chop still. But I'm inclined to improve shareable cottages first, like work his way toward the tile 1S2E of Berlin, or work my way to the FP to cottage first. Right now, I would have worker step 1E or 1NE and put 1t or road, then step to FP 2N1E of Berlin and cottage.

Overall, things are ok here. I'd probably have a settler already in progress somewhere, but I'm not sure what has actually occurred these past turns.

Lastly, go to EP screen and put EP focus on Mansa by putting weight to 1. Always do this when you meet strong techer like Mansa. If Mansa wasn't met here, I'd probably put focus on Joao or Asoka.

edit: Basically, each turn check your cities to make sure they are worker best tiles. Max food when you are growing, best tiles when building settlers or workers (since you don't grow) or if you are stalling growth due to unhappy concerns.

edit: I think you just need 1t of binary research on Writing to get enough gold to finish. It appears 1g short (4 X 6 = 24g), but should be enough to finish in 6 turns. Just adjust slider slightly on last turn.

 

[OldDude]

Yep, if you know an early city will have fish as a food resource, there is no harm in going Fish before POT.

I assume you meant 2pop gran in Ham. With OF from gran whip and chop next turn, I would put those hammers into a new settler for 1t. Then maybe a warrior or just continue with barracks for a few turns until you grow onto ivory - then finish settler.

Two things that stand out to me here that need correcting:

1) Berlin should take back its FP for growth. Max growth while growing, and you have a gran in Berlin now so even more important. This really goes to paying more attention to what tiles cities are working each turn, especially after they grow.

2) Not sure what the exact worker actions were for the Berlin worker, but I'm inclined to do something else before that NW cottage. There was a forest to chop still. But I'm inclined to improve shareable cottages first, like work his way toward the tile 1S2E of Berlin, or work my way to the FP to cottage first. Right now, I would have worker step 1E or 1NE and put 1t or road, then step to FP 2N1E of Berlin and cottage.

Overall, things are ok here. I'd probably have a settler already in progress somewhere, but I'm not sure what has actually occurred these past turns.

Lastly, go to EP screen and put EP focus on Mansa by putting weight to 1. Always do this when you meet strong techer like Mansa. If Mansa wasn't met here, I'd probably put focus on Joao or Asoka.

edit: Basically, each turn check your cities to make sure they are worker best tiles. Max food when you are growing, best tiles when building settlers or workers (since you don't grow) or if you are stalling growth due to unhappy concerns.

edit: I think you just need 1t of binary research on Writing to get enough gold to finish. It appears 1g short (4 X 6 = 24g), but should be enough to finish in 6 turns. Just adjust slider slightly on last turn.

Yes I did mean 2pop granary in Hamburg.

Great point on putting the OF and chop hammers in Hamburg into a settler for 1t. I didn't want to build settler with only 2 population but doing it for 1t to catch the hammers is great and something I need to remember. Same idea in Berlin I think. I didn't want the chop hammers to go into a warrior so I just pre-chopped that remaining forest. I could do the same settler for 1t trick. I was saving it for a settler anyway.

I did play a few turns but I'm going to go back to T51 to make these small adjustments.

Thank you.

 

[lymond]

Ok..I play just a few turns to right before Writing to show a couple of things (save attached):

First, here is your empire:

Spoiler germs :

As you can see Berlin is growing fast with the granary - size 5 in just a few turns - working best 2F tiles, pigs, and fp - and soon Size 6. I will grow to size 6 and then prepare for a 6>3 3 pop whip of a settler.

Ham is size 3 working rice, fp and ivory and building a settler after growth to 3. I put first chop into settler for 1t then switch back to barrack for growth. That worker moved to forest 1NW of there to chop that for Hamburg...note: make sure you activate that tile for Ham as Munich owned it before. I assume you know how to do that.

Put another chop into gran in Munich then 1popped gran at size 2 into settler.

here is a view of Berlin showing its nice growth:

Spoiler Berlin :

I just queued up another warrior for now to continue to size 6...1 more warrior won't hurt here.

Lastly, do you have the BULL mod activated as well, such that workers automatically stop chopping on the last turn ? or are they just finishing chops indiscriminately

edit: Note that I went 100% research after the 1t of binary at the point of your last save, but on this turn just knock it down to 90% to finish Writing. You can do that at the end when you just need enough to finish the tech.

 

[lymond]

Yes I did mean 2pop granary in Hamburg.

Great point on putting the OF and chop hammers in Hamburg into a settler for 1t. I didn't want to build settler with only 2 population but doing it for 1t to catch the hammers is great and something I need to remember. Same idea in Berlin I think. I didn't want the chop hammers to go into a warrior so I just pre-chopped that remaining forest. I could do the same settler for 1t trick. I was saving it for a settler anyway.

yes yes, absolutely! You want to be cognizant of your OF hammers and chop hammers. You don't want them going into things like warriors where it is wasted. "Catching the hammers" is exactly the right the term.

 

[lymond]

Ok..here's a few things a few turns later, and in between:

I grew Berlin to Size 6 , and now I want to show you something about maxxing whip OF. But first, I want to make one thing very clear - whipping workers and settler is just as much about speed than OF or maxxing OF. In other words, you whip them as soon as you can to get them out fast - there is usually some bits of OF regardless. But for this purpose I wanted to show you how you can max OF, and I want you to try it.

First, here is Berlin at Size 6. I put 3 turns into the Settler to get it to 36H out of 100H production cost. For a 3 pop whip, you need to put <40 hammers into the settler. The closer to 40 hammers the more OF. 39H into settler is the max before it becomes a 2 pop whip.

Each citizen = 30H, so a 3 pop whip is 3X30=90H instantly from whipping 3 citizens. Obviously then, a 2pop whip = 60H

100-60=40H, so 40H into a settler the threshold where it becomes a 2pop whip. Less than 40H and you need that 3rd citizen whipped to complete. (3pop settlers are extremely efficient whips if you have a gran and the growth potential)

Here is Berlin before the whip:

Spoiler :

See that I hover the mouse cursor over the production bar so you can see I put 36H into the settler. It's not 39H but it is more than good enough. I will 3pop whip it.

Math:

100-36H = 64H - remaining cost of production for settler

90H(whip) - 64H = 26H overflow directly from whip of settler

Here is Berlin after whip (same turn):

Spoiler :

Note again the production bar tool tip. You see production is at 126H/100H for the settler. Hey! The math worked!

Also, note that I made sure the city is working best tiles at size 3. The gov does not always do that after a whip.

So I would expect 26H OF? Well, maybe it will be more than that because you need to factor in the base hammers (11H from and ) of the city going into the settler this turn. I think the OF will actually be quite a bit more.

Here is Berlin the next turn:

Spoiler :

As you can see here, I hover over the area just left of the production bar that shows a city's base production and any OF. The tooltip shows 37H! Nice! That is actually the base whip OF + the base hammers. (edit: clarification - base hammers refers to those 11H that the city put into the settler last turn - the full OF is from the activity from the previous turn)

So that is how you turn food into production.

I plan to put that into a new worker.


Lastly, here is a couple of turns later showing the 5 city empire (save attached):

Spoiler :

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I adjusted cities a bit during these two turns. Clam city was just settled.

A turn ago I gave Munich Berlin's FP for more growth as it just grew, while not impacting timing of Berlin's worker.

Clam city (Frank) took the pigs this turn actually, as again it did not impact Berlin's worker timing ..and well, Berlin is not growing anyway while building a worker. This gives Frank a quick boost of growth ...at least for a turn. These are little micro things you can do when sharing tiles.

I had preroaded Frank, then moved that worker back to forest to chop for WB.

Meanwhile, Ham's worker had worked his way to Cologne to chop for that wb, after it finished cottaging Ham's FP. (I acually put 1t into road and 1t into cottage on the way to the forest, but you don't necessarily need to do that..but 1 chop does not complete a WB, so it needs some production in Cologne anyway).

I had put OF from Gran whip in Munich into new settler, back to growth on Library, then put that last chop into settler, back to growth. That settler has 53H so can be 2popped at size 4 later.

I will probably 2pop another worker in Munich at size 5, as more cannot hurt so these cities start working more improved tiles.

Next turn Berlin worker will put 1t road 1SE of Berlin, then finish cottage 1E of there on river grass tiles shared by Berlin and Ham.

Cologne needs 2 tiles roaded only. 1 tile can be the one the worker stands on currently chopping WB that connects city to river. The other can be that tile we just preroad 1SE of Berlin that connects Berlin to the same river. But that road can be timed later when those workers are ready (chop and cottage)...probably finishing the 2 roads simultaneously.

whew!

edit: lastly, I open borders with Joao and Asoka immediately after Writing since they have no WE. Monty is rather disliked at the moment so I'll ignore him for now. Monty does not like Mansa so I will not ob with him for now...I think Mansa is farther away than most here so no prob except the diplo boost. Better than having to stop trade demands. But things with WE can change over time, so keep an eye on that.

 

[OldDude]

@lymond, I follow your steps to the same turn and there are a couple of very small differences but as far as I can see nothing important. I 1popped the granary in Munich and have a settler poised to catch the OF. Next turn Writing is in so I'll switch to Lib after that. Gotta get some border pops. Chopped hammers went into a settler in Hamburg and then I let it grow to 3 on barracks. Once that forest 1NW was about finished with the chop I switched that tile to Hamburg and then switched build to settler to catch those hammers. So 3t away from a settler there.

Berlin will grow to size 5 next turn and I'll follow your advice to let it grow to size 6 before switching to settler. With this settler and the one out of Hamburg I'll settle the clam city and then on the tile my scout is on. After Writing I'll go Aph.

Spoiler T57 :

Thank you.

EDIT: You posted again while I was posting this so I'll catch up.

EDIT 2: Yes I have Bull so workers don't automatically finish the chops.

 

[lymond]

looks good...yeah, my last post was a doozy so take your time with that and practice. Getting the settler whip right in Berlin should be easy. I sent the Ham settler directly to fish city, so Berlin settler can do clams.

As for Berlin worker, and you don't necessarily have to do this, but I like to make the most of turns. I sent him 1SW of FP to put 1t of cottage. Then completed that road on spice you'd started, then hopped on Pigs to start road to clam city which timed right. (you don't necessarily have to have roads in place first, but it is nice if you can...plus I wanted the worker close to clam city anyway for chop there)

gotta go proofread my big post, so you might find corrections there later.

edit: ha..yep...definitely need proofread...a pic did not even show up due to some type around the spoiler tag

ah..good you have BULL.. .the worker prechop thing from BULL is great. I use BAT usually which has that too, so when I play your saves I don't always have BULL DLL active..and forget. Just want to make sure you are controlling your chops.

edit: The one thing i noticed from your current save is that you sent 2 warriors NW. I think it is about time you MP Berlin and Ham, so I would have kept those home, or at least 1. Berlin will definitely need 1 to get to size 6.

also, you still have not focused your eps on Mansa....you'd be very close to seeing what he is teching by now if you had earlier.

edit: nevermind on road to Cologne (fish/crab city). Apparently it was already connected to the trade route somehow. I think via the lake south of Berlin that Berlin is connected to via the road to clam city. i've never fully understood that.

 

[OldDude]

looks good...yeah, my last post was a doozy so take your time with that and practice. Getting the settler whip right in Berlin should be easy. I sent the Ham settler directly to fish city, so Berlin settler can do clams.

As for Berlin worker, and you don't necessarily have to do this, but I like to make the most of turns. I sent him 1SW of FP to put 1t of cottage. Then completed that road on spice you'd started, then hopped on Pigs to start road to clam city which timed right. (you don't necessarily have to have roads in place first, but it is nice if you can...plus I wanted the worker close to clam city anyway for chop there)

gotta go proofread my big post, so you might find corrections there later.

edit: ha..yep...definitely need proofread...a pic did not even show up due to some type around the spoiler tag

ah..good you have BULL.. .the worker prechop thing from BULL is great. I use BAT usually which has that too, so when I play your saves I don't always have BULL DLL active..and forget. Just want to make sure you are controlling your chops.

edit: The one thing i noticed from your current save is that you sent 2 warriors NW. I think it is about time you MP Berlin and Ham, so I would have kept those home, or at least 1. Berlin will definitely need 1 to get to size 6.

also, you still have not focused your eps on Mansa....you'd be very close to seeing what he is teching by now if you had earlier.

edit: nevermind on road to Cologne (fish/crab city). Apparently it was already connected to the trade route somehow. I think via the lake south of Berlin that Berlin is connected to via the road to clam city. i've never fully understood that.

OK, great explanation on maxing out OF. I followed your example and it ended up the same. Building worker now in Berlin. It looks like I may have roaded the wrong tile going to the clam city, compared to yours. Apparently it didn't matter though regarding the trade route to Cologne as that is there.

Yep I did forget about the EP. That is going now.

I've got an MP in Berlin and the northernmost warrior is making his way back to Hamburg to MP there.

At the same turn (65) I'm pretty much where you are at as far as I can see, except my clam city looks to be 1t behind yours...not sure why. Worker there is ready to chop that WB.

Question: I can 2pop the library in Hamburg...should I do it? Wait a minute...I went and looked again and a 2pop would yield 5OF. I grow in 2t. If I wait until I grow, OF should be 19. I'm now thinking I should wait?

By the way, what is WE?

Thanks @lymond. This discussion about the math and timing is cool. I know it's been talked about before a bit but I think then I was a bit overwhelmed with all of the new stuff to learn and remember, plus concentrating on trying to break bad habits.

EDIT: I noticed after this post that I needed to change to 100% research, which I just did, probably 1t late.

 

[lymond]

Sorry, WE is worst enemy.

I’m out for a while.

Ok..back a bit to follow up on the library question.

Again, as I mentioned earlier in my OF discussion, you don't necessarily need to reach max OF points or any particular point to whip something. Settlers and workers are built by both a city's food and hammer output (base hammers and food surplus). So whipping them is a great way to turn food into production.

A library is built from pure hammers, so generally you are just going to whip one as soon as you are able. In case of Ham, without actually having a save from that point, I'd say just 2pop it now. Any small OF from that whip can just be put into something - I think you were still building a barracks there. Now Ham might grow into some scientists to stem any unhappy issues.
(if I actually have a bonus on a wonder or the IND trait, I will often put these little bits of OF into a wonder for fail gold later)

I did things differently a bit with Ham as I wasn't paying that much attention to it after I finished the settler there. I think I just finished the barracks there as it was fairly close anyway. Not everything needs to be exact here with our games. The library is actually far more important.

Berlin sets up nicely to grow back for a 3 pop Library (<30H into library). Whip immediately at size 6 but keep track of the hammers going into the Library so you don't exceed 30H. A 2pop library is fine as well though. Berlin can grow back into scientists, likely getting your first two running there for the academy.

in my game, I'd initially considered a Maths bulb with that first GS, but was teching so well that I teched Maths outright.

Anyway, the whole exercise on maxxing the OF from a settler whip was exactly that...an exercise. It acclimates you more to the details of whipping and viewing the info a city provides you with regards to food and production. The more you micro these things, especially early, the more success you will have and the more you will come to understand the intricacies of this game. And.....some of this will start to become almost second nature.

 

[OldDude]

I've played 10 more turns and hopefully I'm in good shape.

Munich: 1 plan to 2pop the library and that should happen in 2t.
Hamburg: Building settler there to keep from growing, at least until that whip unhappy is gone.
Berlin: I could 2pop the library now for 33OF. Berlin is only size 4 but grows next turn. I'm thinking I should go ahead and whip, putting the OF into a settler for 1t? Then finish the barracks after that.
Cologne: Building granary there, will 2pop when I can.
Frankfurt: Almost done with granary, library next to get some culture going.

1t away from Alph. I'm thinking of Maths > Construction > HBR to get Elephults online asap. It hasn't been an issue so far only having warriors but that won't last forever. I'm pretty sure right after Alph is in I could trade for archery just in case until someone trades me IW.

I've marked a few potential city spots that I think might be good.

Spoiler T75 :

On a second look, I'm thinking that potential city spot 2E of the nanners isn't good; no food at all in the inner ring. Maybe 1N of there?

Holding here for now. Thanks!

 

[lymond]

Ok, I will list some tweaks to the current turn, but first I would impress upon you to check your cities each turn and make sure they are working improvements where possible. I'd remind you, just in case, that cottages do not grow unless worked by a citizen.

1) Berlin - I'd say whip Library now into barracks. We want this city to grow into scientists. It will grow into 1 scientist next turn. Take cottage when complete with scientist, then grow back into 2 scientists there. After barracks, Berlin can probably just build research for a time.

2) Ham - Take cottage down S from Berlin this turn. Queue warrior to grow in two turns onto completed ivory...finish settler.

3) Munich - take cottage that is unworked currently. Will slow Lib whip by a turn by that is ok. (edit: okay ..change my mind..let's get that settler out now...2pop it and send it to the pigs city West) This delays fish a bit but city is at least working cottages. I think getting cities up is more important now, especially with IW trade close.

4) Cologne - work the grass hill for 1t. This adds a hammer that will allow you to 1pop gran next turn...this works well there.

5) Frank - just chopped into gran, so work the forest grass hill for 2 turns to complete gran at perfect point (12F out of 24F to grow...let me know if you don't yet understand this concept)

Other things:

Scout should stand 1S of current position as it busts that fogged coastal tile to prevent galley spawn

Cities in order:

2S of Fish on desert tile E of Ham. This city will grab the gems eventually and share pigs with Ham...nice spot even though food is not in first ring, but you are settling with knowledge that pigs is available soon. Probably trade for Myst soon here so can get monument there.

1SE of Pigs to the NW is the only spot I would settle there. Pigs obviously - you should have IW soon - plus dyes, banana, and a shared cottage tile with Berlin

Cow/wine city I'd probably just settle on the wine...Cows will eventually be grabbed long before by borders from Cologne..city is fine here and does not need to be coastal. Actually could be decent production city with food from farms and cows.

Post again next turn so we can assess tech trades initially. Archery you would not like to trade for usually.

You can see Mansa's tech now with an 8ep buffer on the threshold. I might start some EP on someone else like Pacal or Joao - both good candidates. Leave Mansa at 1 weight and put 1 weight on Pacal, which means 2ept on each leader. Keep an eye on this each turn or so in case Mansa bumps his EPs on you. You can adjust the weight accordingly.