US Congresswoman shot in Arizona

[GinandTonic]

Government cannot interfere with freedom of speech, period.

They can and they do, every day. Silly hyperbole is silly.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

 

[Arwon]

I hope everyone going "he's just a nut" said the same thing about Nidal Hasan at Fort Hood.

 

[El_Machinae]

No, because I never saw reason to think that Hasan was schizophrenic.

C'mon people, schizophrenia is an actual disease. This man's condition is an indictment of our mental health services more than anything.
edit: if he's schizophrenic, which I think is likely.

 

[duckstab]

And not an indictment of the fact that individuals who are that messed up are so easily able to obtain firearms?

 

[Leonel]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

LOCK AND LOAD!

 

[Berzerker]

it was the pot, folks...You pot smokers are responsible

for something

oh yeah, for murders in Mexico

and now this

 

[BSmith1068]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

Unfortunately that is total craptastic revisionism being used to cover one's rear end, and precisely NOT what needs to be said or done right now.

...

All that said, this exchange between Palin aide Rebecca Mansour and Palin-supporting radio host Tammy Bruce is completely absurd. Bruce begins by describing the map of SarahPAC's 20 midterm election targets -- members of Congress in districts that went for McCain/Palin in 2008 who voted for health care reform -- and referring to the targets on the map as "surveyor's symbols." Mansour points out that "targeted districts" are part of political parlance -- obviously true -- and says this. (It starts at around 11:40 in the clip.)

MANSOUR: I just want to clarify again, and maybe it wasn't done on the record enough by us when this came out, the graphic, is just, it's basically -- we never, ever, ever intended it to be gunsights. It was simply crosshairs like you see on maps.

BRUCE: Well, it's a surveyor's symbol. It's a surveyor's symbol.

MANSOUR: It's a surveyor's symbol. I just want to say this, Tammy, if I can. This graphic was done, not even done in house -- we had a political graphics professional who did this for us.

This is deeply stupid. Here's the map:

Among the people who gave the impression that these were targets: Sarah Palin. When she announced the list in a tweet, she wrote "don't retreat, instead - RELOAD!" I'm not an expert surveyor, but I'm not sure what sort of tools need reloading. Jonathan Martin points out that after the election, Palin tweeted about her success (18 of the seats went to the GOP) by saying "remember months ago 'bullseye' icon used 2 target the 20 Obamacare-lovin' incumbent seats?" Throughout 2010, when Palin was criticized for the target map, she either didn't respond or mocked the "lamestream media" for interpreting her gun metaphors as calls for violence. At the Southern Republican Leadership Conference, for example, she got big applause when she said "Don't retreat, reload -- and that is not a call for violence!" The media wasn't going to force her to stop using the gun line.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/blogs/we...ox-targets-on-sarahpac-map-were-actually.aspx

And perhaps these guys are just confused about the labeling of their images?: http://www.shutterstock.com/similar...gun-sight-isolated-over-white-background.html

 

[GhostWriter16]

They can and they do, every day. Silly hyperbole is silly.

I am aware they DO IT, but its still WRONG for them to do it.

 

[illram]

No, because I never saw reason to think that Hasan was schizophrenic.

C'mon people, schizophrenia is an actual disease. This man's condition is an indictment of our mental health services more than anything.
edit: if he's schizophrenic, which I think is likely.

I remember a lot of discussion regarding Hasan's mental health, and some questions being raised as to his supervision. Example.

Kind of a side topic, but is it off base to just go ahead and assume that, generally, folks that go on killing rampages probably suffer from some kind of mental illness?

 

[Formaldehyde]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

I had no idea that momma grizzlies were so into math.


Link to video.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

Yeah and my real name is Adolf bin Laden.

 

[Ajidica]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

So the 'Don't retreat, reload' phrase is just refering to reloading camera film into the surveyor tool?

(Yes, I know surveyor tools don't use film, but I can't think of anything that they need to 'reload'.)

 

[Silurian]

Reload new a new battery pack if they have been taking lots of shots with their Leica EDM

 

[Bugfatty300]

According to BBC radio news earlier, Sarah Palin has said the symbols on the map weren't sniper sight crosshairs, but a surveyor's symbol.

So that clears that one up folks.

Pretty redundant distinction since crosshairs are crosshairs and they ain't much difference between a rifle scope and a surveyor scope.

 

[Ajidica]

Don't retreat, reload the battery in your surveyor so you can more pictures and measurements?

 

[El_Machinae]

I remember a lot of discussion regarding Hasan's mental health, and some questions being raised as to his supervision. Example.

Thanks!

Kind of a side topic, but is it off base to just go ahead and assume that, generally, folks that go on killing rampages probably suffer from some kind of mental illness?

Well, it's certainly something to consider. But, no. A person might have a lucid and realistic grasp of reality, and still go on a killing rampage in order to fulfill their goals. I guess you could redefine mental illness such that 'killing rampages aren't performed by healthy people', but that might be too broad.

That said, I very might well have reiterated by 0.01% statistic, because I think it's important for people to know. It's important to not let the crazy people poison dialogue or even encourage partisanship instincts. edit: hmmn, maybe not. I did bring it up when people were being afraid of muslims in the NYC community center thread

 

[FriendlyFire]

You strongly imply that it may be the cause. Stop trying to deny what you are alleging here.

speaking of which ..... huh huh

 

[Cutlass]

In more bad news, our "friends" at the Westboro Baptist Church are going to "attend" the 9 year old's funeral.

Because, as they said "God Sent the Shooter"

Ugh.

I think someone should rent a fire truck and give them a bath.

 

[DaveShack]

Figured there would probably be a thread on this, may as well contribute what I can from a local perspective. (was away for weekend then had to work, not that I spend much time in OT)

I have shopped in that store. Talk about major shock finding out about this when the news broke on Saturday. The federal judge was an acquaintance, which made it even more surreal. I knew intellectually that there is a big difference between a tragedy where you have no connection and one where you're personally involved in the slightest degree. Now I've felt it...

On another day, with a different representative, I might have been one of the people standing in line. I wonder if I would have noticed it going down in time to try to do something about it. And I wonder if I would duck or try to tackle the guy.

I expected to find comments in the thread about the "crosshairs". It's nothing more than coincidence. According to local news (which gives a lot more detail) the suspect had nothing linking him to the tea party, Republicans, Palin, or anything else written, on the computer, or anywhere else they could find. In my educated but not professional opinion, he's a one of a kind nutcase. Whether he's technically insane or not is another question. But it appears his "motive" if you can call it that was disjoint and did not align closely with any political party or group.

Taking another tack on crosshairs -- there is a well-defined demographic sector (gun enthusiasts) who are very strongly Republican. If you want to rouse a rabble, you use language and imagery that appeals to that demographic. Gun enthusiasts know that painting a target on someone does not mean open season is declared. It means target this person / contest as someone we can beat and take their seat, nothing more. And "reload" means if your contribution isn't enough to win the election this time, then give more. If your candidate doesn't win this year, come back with another one next time.