What does a MAGA hat stand for?

[rah]

No doubt for vastly different reasons though.

Hence the lol afterwards. I'm going to ignore the rest of ranting that followed and give you the benefit of doubt.
No I've never been pulled from a toilet but have had my head stuck in one for being different, and I would have proffered just being dragged out.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Hence the lol afterwards. I'm going to ignore the rest of ranting that followed and give you the benefit of doubt.

Whatever.

 

[IglooDame]

Hence the lol afterwards. I'm going to ignore the rest of ranting that followed and give you the benefit of doubt.
No I've never been pulled from a toilet but have had my head stuck in one for being different, and I would have proffered just being dragged out.

Just so I'm clear, you're saying you have been materially abused because you're a rich white man?

Edit: This should have been directed to Patine instead, my apologies @rah.

 

[Patine]

Just so I'm clear, you're saying you have been materially abused because you're a rich white man?

I don't know if @rah said that, but you may have meant to quote my post. The two men in questioned beat me, saying I deserved it, "because I was a rich White boy who wouldn't cough up," as in, cough up a cigarette or dollar. I was not ACTUALLY rich at the time, nor am I now, but that didn't seem to matter - they seemed to assume I might as well be. Being straight, cis, and male probably weren't issues at stake, as they both very much SEEMED to be as well. I think it was a racial issue, and PERCEIVED economic disparity.

 

[El_Machinae]

Conflating it with racism is a dangerous position to take. The majority of Trump voters aren't racists. Shocker right?

It might be true, probably is. But there's good reason to think that the racism isn't a deal breaker.
Trump tweeted false (and racist) crime statistics in order to woo his desired base. That more (R) came around to supporting him just means it wasn't a deal-breaker for them.

 

[Patine]

It might be true, probably is. But there's good reason to think that the racism isn't a deal breaker.
Trump tweeted false (and racist) crime statistics in order to woo his desired base. That more (R) came around to supporting him just means it wasn't a deal-breaker for them.

Franklin D. Roosevelt and John F. Kennedy both had to work with the Southern branches of their parties. But they're aren't constant barrages of calling them racists for refusing such associations of necessity being levied all the time today.

 

[rah]

Probably because the 40 and early 60's were a much different time. i.e. racism wasn't considered that bad of a thing by a majority of the population.

 

[El_Machinae]

Franklin D. Roosevelt and John F. Kennedy both had to work with the Southern branches of their parties.

the Prophet Samuel was thought of as a holy man despite ordering Israeli soldiers to stab babies.

Our ability to highlight people's abuses will evolve over time.

 

[Socrates99]

That's not Brown People's faults, that's not transpeoples faults, thats not LGB peoples faults, that's not women's faults, that's not immigrants faults, that's nobody's fault but the government and the economic system, so why are we getting the brunt of it then?

"Economic Anxiety" isn't a good enough reason when some of Trump's biggest promises were to keep the brown menace out.

Which is why his trade policy (ill advised as it is) isnt just aimed at "brown" countries. Hes tossed tariffs at Canada, Australia, and Europe. Dismissing that sentiment as just racism without redirecting it in a more appropriate direction is not a good idea. Not everyone that voted for him thought Mexicans were coming to take their jobs. Many of them worried that their jobs were going to go to Mexico.

 

[Berzerker]

It might be true, probably is. But there's good reason to think that the racism isn't a deal breaker. Trump tweeted false (and racist) crime statistics in order to woo his desired base. That more (R) came around to supporting him just means it wasn't a deal-breaker for them.

could be just a mistake

 

[Truthy]

I've seen one solitary MAGA hat since 2016. On some old guy at a beer festival in a hyper conservative town (it's been red since I was a kid).

I do wonder if Trump's popularity isnt just overplayed for publicity. Most Republicans in my RL life only support him by proxy (support his nominations or endorsees but not the man himself). I know many in my family just voted for him because of Scalia's empty seat. That's it. A lot of them are kind of embarrassed by him.

I think the MAGA hat is legitimately about a reinvigorated American Industrial sector and that's why they're worn. My neighbor cites the reinvigorated iron and steel industry as reason enough to vote Trump.

Conflating it with racism is a dangerous position to take. The majority of Trump voters aren't racists. Shocker right? They're pissed off because that good factory/mining/refining job they used to have or their dad retired from is gone, just gone. Dump promised to bring thos back. It might've been an empty and impossible promise but gave more hope than "America's already great."

Also, take coal and fracking jobs, which a lot of Dems do not signal much appreciation for. A Dem like Warren, who says we should ban fracking, would be in very serious trouble in Pennsylvania in the general. And a lot of Dems think all the talk of "green union jobs" and "job guarantees" will persuade those workers to abandon Trump. That's just not going to happen.

 

[El_Machinae]

could be just a mistake

Yes. But the mistake was so obvious that if it was presented using any other variables, the idiocy would be apparent to everyone and their dog. But put the word 'black' into the statistical description, and suddenly Trump makes the mistake. That's racism.

 

[Farm Boy]

Franklin D. Roosevelt and John F. Kennedy both had to work with the Southern branches of their parties. But they're aren't constant barrages of calling them racists for refusing such associations of necessity being levied all the time today.

It's 2020. What you mean is who and who?

 

[Socrates99]

Also, take coal and fracking jobs, which a lot of Dems do not signal much appreciation for. A Dem like Warren, who says we should ban fracking, would be in very serious trouble in Pennsylvania in the general. And a lot of Dems think all the talk of "green union jobs" and "job guarantees" will persuade those workers to abandon Trump. That's just not going to happen.

I'd say they're mostly distrustful that a jobs guarantee will happen. The only way working in a mine would be preferable over a windmill is if you're afraid of heights. There's a fear that the government won't follow through and will leave them high and dry. Increase windmill production with a promise to use only American steel and those Pennsylvanians will come around.

 

[Patine]

I'd say they're mostly distrustful that a jobs guarantee will happen. The only way working in a mine would be preferable over a windmill is if you're afraid of heights. There's a fear that the government won't follow through and will leave them high and dry. Increase windmill production with a promise to use only American steel and those Pennsylvanians will come around.

Fossil fuel power are dead end industries all around. The sooner people realize that, and governments stop taking bribes (and committing the crimes of corruption and graft) from big fossil fuel resource companies, and make plans for real solutions of big-scale renewable energy infrastructure, the better off EVERYONE will be. Except maybe the al-Saud's, but you can't pity them too much.

 

[Farm Boy]

I'll consider believing it when I see it.

 

[Patine]

I'll consider believing it when I see it.

Are you referring to my post, or @Socrates99's?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Just less the two weeks ago, I saw a burly, older man shuffling down the steps from the Alberta Courthouse on the east edge of Downtown Edmonton, and he was wearing a MAGA, and without attraction that would indicate "staring," I had a glance, and it was definitely one of the original versions that said "Make AMERICA Great Again," not make "Make ALBERTA Great Again."

Just because that's what the hat says, don't assume there aren't people going around using this acronym to push their separatist/Wexit notions (that group got registered as a legitimate political party, even though the leader is stark raving nuts, with a history of violence). Some of them are Trump worshipers, and when they praise him on CBC.ca, I either wonder if they're really an American poster trying to pass for Canadian (they usually get tripped up over some detail they don't know is different in this country), or if they really do want Alberta to be like the U.S.

You must have mistaken me for someone else my friend because i have no reason to automatically discount their lived experiences.

A shakedown is a shakedown, no matter who does it, and yes, there are plenty of racist non-white people around. Thankfully I haven't run into more than a couple in my life, but to be consistent, you aren't going to automatically discount the lived experiences of those who have, right?

 

[Patine]

A shakedown is a shakedown, no matter who does it, and yes, there are plenty of racist non-white people around. Thankfully I haven't run into more than a couple in my life, but to be consistent, you aren't going to automatically discount the lived experiences of those who have, right?

Absolutely not. It's just the poster I responded to, @Cloud_Strife, has a bad habit of all but demanding her issues and problems (which indeed, sound very nasty and horrible indeed) be put as the central axis around which to judge EVERYONE'S morals and choices, but she has also visibly shown cold apathy to the unfair suffering of others in similar - but different enough from her perspective - situations to just shrug off. I was not saying such don't happen to others - even MANY others - I was moreso trying to put things into perspective a little.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Absolutely not. It's just the poster I responded to, @Cloud_Strife, has a bad habit of all but demanding her issues and problems (which indeed, sound very nasty and horrible indeed) be put as the central axis around which to judge EVERYONE'S morals and choices, but she has also visibly shown cold apathy to the unfair suffering of others in similar - but different enough from her perspective - situations to just shrug off. I was not saying such don't happen to others - even MANY others - I was moreso trying to put things into perspective a little.

It was Cloud Strife I was asking, and referring to the lived experiences of people who have run into bigotry and race-based violence from non-white people. I think you and I are basically in agreement in this conversation.

Thankfully my own encounters haven't been violent, just racist comments from native people (that's what they were calling themselves back then; it's hard to keep up with the terminology, particularly when some prefer one term and others prefer different terms) at Red Deer College.

Those were my in-person experiences. Later on... I am so sick and tired of this "colonizer" crap. As I said to someone on FB a couple of weeks ago, I was born here. So were my parents, and one of my grandparents. I didn't ask to be born here, and being told to "go home" is ridiculous. I am home. Going 'back' to Europe would mean trying to figure out which of 5 or 6 countries I should consider ancestral, and I don't speak the language in most of them.

I'm also tired of "cultural appropriation." It only seems to go one way.