Why do people freak out about "Happy holidays"?

[cardgame]

Another MB-FM skirmish!

 

[Ecofarm]

While the Christmas tree likely does have a (Northern European) pagan origin, the trees decorated with silver and gold mentioned in the bible were not Christmas Trees but Canaanite/Philistine idols. While neighboring peoples idols were usually made of stone or solid metal, the natives of Canaan used wooden carvings that were often covered in gold or silver leaf.

Hate to muddy your well referenced post, but a personal anecdote about where tree decoration comes from:


I was going to school early one morning in Sweden, and saw something I've never seen before or since. The temperature was just right and the moisture in the air perfect, to cause the most amazing light display in the trees. All of the branches were coated with a fine layer of clear ice (ice that has cooled uniformly and slowly). The layer was so thin and clear that it created the affect of a million tiny lights in the tree. I found myself standing on the sidewalk, staring at natural trees that were more brilliant than the most expensive private light displays.

I'm sure that is how we got the idea.

 

[Formaldehyde]

I totally trolled one of my co-workers yesterday with a "Happy Holidays!"

That wasn't my intent, although I can see it could be perceived that way.

Yes, you have tons to say about Bill O'Reilly. We can still have our opinions or insights. We don't have to watch your videos.

True enough. But can't I then point out that facts were previously provided which directly contradict that opinion?

And once again, the issue is not about Bill O'Reilly, although he was clearly an early proponent. It is about a very massive and widescale campaign which has been occurring for nearly a decade now.

 

[warpus]

Uhm, here people say: "Happy Holidays" in order to be polite and inclusive.

I didn't realize that it was an actual "issue" in the U.S.

 

[MobBoss]

Not sure how many times I have to say this before it finally sinks in for you. Mentioning that you are not a Bill O'Reilly fan is an obvious red herring.

Dude. YOU BROUGHT HIM UP. Not me. Thus its not a red herring, its actually directly addressing what you implied in your previous comment.

Also, I wish to god you would stop with the lame logical fallacy accusations almost every single reply. You get them wrong more than half the time, and then turn around and completely deny it when you commit one in turn. Honestly, its sad and really pathetic to see you overuse those terms in some lame attempt to build your own ego.

While O'Reilly was an early proponent of this predominantly right-wing religious crusade to try to force retailers into using "Merry Christmas" instead of "Happy Holidays", it is obviously not limited to him and his sycophants.

And like I said, in everyday life, its simply not that big of a deal.

You can try to pretend that there is no widescale "war on Christmas" campaign being waged by the Christian right

There isnt. Unless of course one equates Bill O'Rielly as being 'the' Christian Right. I dont. Maybe thats the problem.

despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

There simply isnt any 'overwhelming evidence' and I am willing to bet that most of us here have seen very little of this 'war' and that the vast majority of people, christian or otherwise, remain quite polite to each other over the holidays. The very small minority that desires to make this an issue, pro or con, are simply not 'overwhelming' at all.

But it is obviously not going to change anything. The facts continue to be the facts.

Thats a big assumption that your 'facts' are indeed 'facts'. Something I tend to dispute.

Happy holidays.

And Merry Christmas to you too!

 

[Mise]

I agree, I don't see why people are so uptight about it. If I say it it's because I want you to have a good time over the few days off you'll get. Don't be a dick and ruin it

 

[Formaldehyde]

Dude. YOU BROUGHT HIM UP. Not me. Thus its not a red herring, its actually directly addressing what you implied in your previous comment.

Yes, I brought him up. I also posted an article that mocked Fox News because the entire network is guilty of it. And I also posted the url to a Wikipedia article which made it clear that this campaign is far bigger than one individual.

So I think trying to dismiss it as being a matter of O'Reilly's personal opinion is disinengenuous at best.

Also, I wish to god you would stop with the idiotic logical fallacy accusations. You get them wrong more than half the time, and then turn around and completely deny it when you commit one in turn. Honestly, its sad and really pathetic to see you overuse those terms in some lame attempt to build your own ego.

There is a very simple way for you to stop me from doing so. Stop trying to put words into my mouth and change the subject instead of addressing the issues.

And you may think they are "wrong", but I certainly don't. And you certainly haven't been able to prove it while continuing to engage in the same use of logical fallacies over and over again...

There isnt. Unless of course one equates Bill O'Rielly as being 'the' Christian Right. I dont. Maybe thats the problem.

There you go again. You are still trying to claim that it is all a matter of Bill O'Reilly's opinion when it clearly isn't...

There simply isnt any 'overwhelming evidence' and I am willing to bet that most of us here have seen very little of this 'war' and that the vast majority of people, christian or otherwise, remain quite polite to each other over the holidays. The very small minority that desires to make this an issue are not 'overwhelming' at all.

Take a look at all the opinions in this thread. So far, you are the only person who is trying to claim this "war on Christmas" campaign, which has been going on for nearly a decade now, doesn't really exist or that it is just Bill O'Reilly's personal opinion.

And it is clearly not a matter of politeness. As you keep pointing out, there is nothing impolite about "happy holidays". It is just another red herring.

Thats a big assumption that your 'facts' are indeed 'facts'. Something I tend to dispute.

Yet you never seem to be able to find any "facts" of your own which actually repudiate my facts.

And Merry Christmas to you too!

Back atcha.

 

[MobBoss]

Yes, I brought him up.

So you agree then your accusation of it being a 'red herring' was in error in light of you making him a pertinent part of the subject?

So I think trying to dismiss it all as being a matter of O'Reilly's personal opinion is disinengenuous at best.

However, O'Reilly is indeed the figurehead of that particular issue, and is by far more vocal on it than probably the rest combined.

There is a very simple way for you to stop me from doing so. Stop trying to put words into my mouth and change the subject instead of addressing the issues.

Just now in this very thread. You brought up the subject: Bill O'. I didnt put any words in your mouth regarding Bill O' but made my own observations in regards to him. It didnt slow you down in the slightest from making another such accusation in error. The most simple way for you to stop doing this is for you to show some restraint in doing it. They are your comments, show some backbone and own them instead of trying to blame everyone else for your error or simply denying it outright.

And you may think they are "wrong", but I certainly don't. And you certainly haven't been able to prove it while continuing to engage in the same use of logical fallacies over and over again...

Didnt I just prove it right here and now?

There you go again. You are still trying to claim that it is all a matter of Bill O'Reilly's opinion when it clearly isn't...

This sentence is parsed really bad for you. It makes it sound like Bill O' doesnt believe in the war on christmas when he so obviously does. My point is that he is more vocal than anyone else in regards to it, and without his incitment as it were, a lot of the rhetoric about it would die down.

Take a look at all the opinions in this thread. So far, you are the only person who is trying to claim this "war on Christmas" campaign, which has been going on for nearly a decade now, doesn't really exist or that it is just Bill O'Reilly's personal opinion.

I never said it didnt exist, I merely said its not as big a deal as people make out. I admitted earlier in the thread that there are indeed rude people, on both sides, that get pulled into this thing, but fact it....the vast, vast majority of people could really care less and just want people to be polite and respectful over the holidays. Most of them do indeed treat others the way they desire to be treated over the holidays.

And it is clearly not a matter of politeness. As you keep pointing out, there is nothing impolite about "happy holidays". It is just another red herring.

Huh? A red herring for what? By who?

Heh, you really just cant help yourself can you? Its like watching someone with a Logical Fallacy version of Tourettes Syndrome, with your tic simply being that you spout 'red herring' or 'strawman' involuntarily.

Yet you never seem to be able to find any "facts" of your own which actually repudiate my facts.

No, my fact in this case in simply anecdotal and relies upon the personal experience of actual people here in the OT, not some talking head on the boob tube. By far the vast majority of us will experience the holiday season with absolutely no exposure to the 'War On Christmas', and most of us will have perfectly polite interactions with the people around us because thats really what the season is about, not about being politically correct in one way or another.

 

[JollyRoger]

People that get offened by the phrase "Happy Holidays" are just a bit scrooged up - I just ask them to lend me their other ear so I can say it again.

 

[MobBoss]

People that get offened by the phrase "Happy Holidays" are just a bit scrooged up - I just ask them to lend me their other ear so I can say it again.

Do you offer them the other cheek when they scrooge you?

 

[rilnator]

As long as people aren't saying 'happy holidays' just in case they offend someone not of christian faith its all good.

And as along as the saying saying stays in America.

 

[Fr8monkey]

While I don't deny Christmas has pagan roots, most of what is in those quotes is false.

You say "I don't think" and "I believe" alot for someone who thinks what I say is false. Facts are facts despite what you all want them to say.

Give christians time and we will all be saying things like Happy Fourth of Christ, Happy St. Christ Day and Happy Hallow-Christ. Some people are never happy.

 

[GoodGame]

I often read articles where people saying the world is doomed and kittens will die because people say "Happy holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas."

Personally, I don't see how it really matters?

Also, why the "happy" or "merry"? Because for a lot of people its a sad time because it's a sad time. Isn't it sorta rubbing it in to tell them to be happy? And isn't

Statistics, or it didn't happen.

 

[cardgame]

Statistics, or it didn't happen.

The suicide rate spikes around Christmas

 

[GoodGame]

The suicide rate spikes around Christmas

True that. I was referring to the 'truth' that most people get up in arms by the use of "happy holidays" over "Merry Christmas".

 

[JollyRoger]

Do you offer them the other cheek when they scrooge you?

Nope, just hand them the business card of the local lumberjack/ophthalmologist.

 

[Ecofarm]

As long as people aren't saying 'happy holidays' just in case they offend someone not of christian faith its all good.

Don't worry. I only say it to piss off christians.

Christmas is christmas, calander-wise, no matter what belief/faith someone has. It's dec. 25, give and take a few days. Merry christmas is have a nice week. Construeing it as something else is just being a dick, and throwing alternatives in the face whom's religion we are well aware of is the same.

Don't think for a moment that anyone is trying to be polite.

Onward, anti-christmas soldier.

 

[Bill3000]

The point isn't to be polite. The point is to maximize profits. If you are aginst "Happy holidays", or political correctness in business in general, you are a communist.

 

[The Omega]

To be quite honest, whether I say Happy Holidays or Happy Christmas (to hell with that merry nonsense!) depends on what I know the beliefs of the one I am speaking to. If they are Christian, I tend to say "Holidays". If they aren't (and especially if they are militantly atheist), I go with "Christmas". If I'm not sure, I just take my best guess, or go with the always popular "Hail Satan!"
As a result, my Decembers tend to be very exciting months.

 

[Cheetah]

What's the big deal?

As long as people mean it, they can say whatever nice thing they want.

Personally, I, like all Scandinavians, say "God jul" (Good Yule), the equivalent of Merry Christmas.

If someone says merry Christmas to me, then that's nice of them. If they say happy holidays, that's good too!

I'm not religious, but if some Christian or Muslim or Jew or whatever would say "May God be with you" or something equivalent to me, then that would be a friendly gesture by them and taken as such.

People should say whatever nice thing they want. There's no reason to be insulted for anyone.