1700AD Scenario Development Thread

[soul-breathing]

Both should appear in 1800 AD.

But they don't appear in 1800AD now in Scenerio 1700AD

And also, Argentina sometimes has 2 frigates and 1 galleon, but more times, they don't have them.

 

[Tigranes]

Which city does Sam suppose to represent? Damascus?

Also do you think Roman roads where still relevant in 1700?

2 Chinese cities are starving at the start, can we fix that please.

 

[Leoreth]

Sam = Damascus, yes. I based the scenario on 600 AD so I simply left the Roman roads in. Which Chinese cities exactly are affected?

 

[Tigranes]

Lhasa and Chengdu.

Is it possible for 1700 China to better represent their Manchu origins? Change the name of the leader, for example. Get a Summer Capital in Shenyang (Manchu Capital before Qinq take over). Right now Shenyang does not even have Granary (and no Religion). Or perhaps having a minor city Hetu Ala, which was the heartland of Manchu people before they become rulers of China. For right now (Northern) Manchuria does not even appear to be a part of China!

 

[Jusos2108]

Did you test that?

I tested it without Toronto and they still founded Winnipeg, probably because they start with a settler and three(?) Red Coats in York Factory, this time though the French founded Fort Detroit, completely blocking America to the East Coast. The surroundings of New Orleans are perhaps too developed. Also a war between England and France would most likely stop the colonisation from going overboard too early.

 

[Tigranes]

Japan is being penalized twice in 1700 start (albeit unintentionally).

1. There are 2 Rice fields but they are not irrigated. I mean, they should, but one has to break mature village to deliver water to those fields. The island is not that big and its unfair to leave them without that extra little food (Rice gives 1 less then Corn or Wheat already and by the way would not even grow without plenty of water). If only that coast may be reformed in Fresh Water lake (still will look as a COast, I know there is no actual lake) -- this problem could be solved.

2. Two of the few cool things Japan has are Samurais and Himeji Castle. Unfortunately they partially overlap in benefits: Drill 1 (and by the way taken by itself, without Drill II, it is the least useful promotion in the game). How about Himeji provide units with Comandos promotion instead of Drill I? Using enemy roads for Melee (but not Gunpowder) units will beautifully represent Ninjas! Lets add more fun to the Rising Sun !

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Commando is one of the most hilariously OP Promotions in this game. You might as well let Himeji Castle provide 20 ICBMs to whoever builds it.

Samurai is irrelevant regardless. As are any UU whose distinguishing feature is extra Strength, First Strikes, etc. because of the Japanese UP.

The only UU Japan could possibly make use of is something like the A6M Zero, a Fighter with (for example) double the operation range.

 

[Tigranes]

Commando is one of the most hilariously OP Promotions in this game. You might as well let Himeji Castle provide 20 ICBMs to whoever builds it.

Samurai is irrelevant regardless. As are any UU whose distinguishing feature is extra Strength, First Strikes, etc. because of the Japanese UP.

The only UU Japan could possibly make use of is something like the A6M Zero, a Fighter with (for example) double the operation range.

You exaggerate. On both occasions. Moving 2 extra spaces faster for few units originated from the city with a famous Castle does not equal IBCM. True, Comandos are powerful, but so were Ninjas. If it relaxes things a little -- Samurais could start with Comandos and no Drill while Castle can stay with Drill. The mod in my signature has SAS unit as UK's UU, which start with Comandos. Tests show that when you are an island with limited tiles extra boost to your UU improves the balance instead of completely destroying like you are suggesting. Plus in case of Samurais such a promotion adds flavor and historically justifiable.

You also exaggerate the irrelevancy of extras to UU because of Japanese UP: remember that those "extras" are coming on top of any promotions units would get in regular way. So right now with Barracks it is possible and easier to produce Drill III Samurais vs non UU Drill II Archers, for example.

 

[UnholyMudcrab]

You exaggerate. On both occasions. Moving 2 extra spaces faster for few units originated from the city with a famous Castle does not equal IBCM. True, Comandos are powerful, but so were Ninjas. If it relaxes things a little -- Samurais could start with Comandos and no Drill while Castle can stay with Drill. The mod in my signature has SAS unit as UK's UU, which start with Comandos. Tests show that when you are an island with limited tiles extra boost to your UU improves the balance instead of completely destroying like you are suggesting. Plus in case of Samurais such a promotion adds flavor and historically justifiable.

The samurai and the ninja were not the same, though. Samurai were the warrior class and nobility while ninja for the most part consisted of disgruntled farmers and peasants. They came from totally different backgrounds, filled different roles, and had very different opinions about the idea of honor.

 

[giant49er]

I think that it would be a good idea to give samurai commando instead of drill. Not to represent ninjas or anything, just because it would make samurai awesome. Also, how about giving Japan 4 (or more) samurai and taking away 2 (or more) musketmen at the start of 1700? In fact, I think this should apply to all non-European civs in the beginning of the 1700 scenario, less muskets more heavy swords!

 

[iOnlySignIn]

You exaggerate.

No I do not. You know nothing about Commando Cavalry or Commando Tanks.

The last thing Japan needs in this game is a buff to its military capabilities. It is already invincible in the hands of any decent player. You can give Samurai free Commando + March + Strength 6 or whatever. It makes zero difference.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

What Japan needs are:

(1) A way to rapidly catch up in tech during the late game (Meiji Restoration). This is more for the AI than the player as Japan's tech rate is already excellent.

(2) Either a different UHV than the Culture UHV, or a different method to achieve the UHV other than relying on a Wonder which is not historically Japanese (Borobudur).

(3) A UB that doesn't give so you will not be hesitant to build it in your most populous cities. I've changed Kaizen Plant to give no but to cost 200 - same as Hydro Plant. But I really think Japan needs a new UB - something which actually exists in reality, instead of "Kaizen Plant". "Kaizen" and "Plant" both exist in reality but "Kaizen Plant" does not.

 

[Leoreth]

I have achieved the Japanese UHV multiple times without Borobudur.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Ideas for new Japanese UB:

Torii (replaces Amphitheater)
Jinja (replaces Amphitheater)
Geisha House (replaces Amphitheater)
Kabuki Theater (replaces Theater)

Graphics for these already exist.

Effects for them would be among the following:
- 1~2 extra Artist slots: so that Japan is not forced to rush Borobudur;
- +10~25% , Spy slots, + : Japan is probably the best civ to play Espionage both for gameplay and historical reasons.
- + : helps with culture UHV.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

I have achieved the Japanese UHV multiple times without Borobudur.

You'd do much better with Borobudur though. No exceptions.

 

[Leoreth]

So what?

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Nothing.

Borobudur is so much inferior to Sistine Chapel in every way it's almost insulting anyway.

 

[merijn_v1]

(3) A UB that doesn't give so you will not be hesitant to build it in your most populous cities. I've changed Kaizen Plant to give no but to cost 200 - same as Hydro Plant. But I really think Japan needs a new UB - something which actually exists in reality, instead of "Kaizen Plant". "Kaizen" and "Plant" both exist in reality but "Kaizen Plant" does not.

Alternatively, the Kaizen Plant can produce clean power, like a hydro plant. Instead, the building itself provides 2 .
If you build a recycling center, the from buildings (and so the Kaizen Plant too), will be removed. Whereas the from dirty power (like with a coal plant) will stay.

 

[Tigranes]

No I do not. You know nothing about Commando Cavalry or Commando Tanks.

The last thing Japan needs in this game is a buff to its military capabilities. It is already invincible in the hands of any decent player. You can give Samurai free Commando + March + Strength 6 or whatever. It makes zero difference.

You can't know what I know and you compare apples with the Big Apple. Its called exaggerating. Mass production of Comandos Tanks is impossible, you need to win many battles or use Great General, sometimes it is happening in real life -- like getting through Ardennes Forest during a Battle of France.

Of course Ninja and Samurai were not the same thing, but we cannot have many UUs. Blending two in one simply adds more "Japanese" to Japanese UU.

Few cultures on the planet revolve so deeply around military ideals. Britain produced the concept of gentleman, Japan produced the concept of Samurai. Does not hurt to stress it in a fun way.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Samurai Commandos would be excellent for upgrading to Commando Grenadiers and such. Too excellent, probably.