2008 NBA Playoffs
- Thread starter Kraznaya
- Start date
Serutan
Eatibus Anythingibus
The most impressive thing about Paul so far is his assist to turnover ratio. If I'm remembering the numbers correctly, it's just insane.
Spartan117
Immortal
Bravo my good sir!
Kobe officially MVP, not sure if it's been announced to the CFC world yet
I like the choice, even though I hate Kobe. No one thought this Laker team could be this good. Saying Pau was the biggest catalyst of that is a total crock, he was essentially a replacement for the production they were getting out of Bynum.
LeBron scored alot and got his team to the 4th seed in the East.
Garnett was a great player on a great team, but maybe we could give co-MVP's to Garnett & Allen & Pierce. Then again, just because it's the CELTICS being turned around does not mean they deserve an MVP trophy.
Chris Paul was the only other player with a legitimate argument. Still, Kobe strikes me as a more unstoppable force and technically Kobe's team finished ahead of Paul's team...no one thought either had much talent to start the year so the tiebreaker should be overall record.
A bit mistaken about Pau gasol. While Bynum is developing and has became much better this past season. At the moment Pau Gasol adds much more to the lakers then Bynum. Pau Gasol is simply better in like every category.
Although the Lakers were a good team without Gasol, however, with him they can easily be considered the best team in the west.
Kraznaya
Princeps
A bit mistaken about Pau gasol. While Bynum is developing and has became much better this past season. At the moment Pau Gasol adds much more to the lakers then Bynum. Pau Gasol is simply better in like every category.
Although the Lakers were a good team without Gasol, however, with him they can easily be considered the best team in the west.
All I can say is that Lebron is genuinely one of the greatest players I have ever seen, and that I am very happy I do not have to see him any more for the next 3 weeks.
Also in case anyone didn't know Paul Pierce is among the top 10 greatest players of the 21st century.
Also in case anyone didn't know Paul Pierce is among the top 10 greatest players of the 21st century.
I wouldn't go that far.
That was a hell of a basketball game, although I'm sorry it ended the way it did. I hope the Cavs front office makes the moves we need to make the next step. We have the best player in the world, two decent PG shooters, one alright vet big...and thats it. We need Redd.
That was a hell of a basketball game, although I'm sorry it ended the way it did. I hope the Cavs front office makes the moves we need to make the next step. We have the best player in the world, two decent PG shooters, one alright vet big...and thats it. We need Redd.
Darkness
Shadow creature
He was fantastic in game 7, but he's definitely not one of the 10 best players this century. Somewhere around 20-25, IMHO...
Wait, when did the Cavs trade for Kobe? I must have missed something
As for Pierce being top 10...well, whos in front of him?
Duncan, Kobe, LeBron, Garnett, Shaq, Nash, Iverson, Kidd, Ginobili is all I can name off the top of my head that have been better since 2000.
McGrady, Billups, Rasheed Wallace, Jermaine O'Neal, Ray Allen, Elton Brand, Chris Webber, and maybe a few others might have a case but...not really.
Pierce has been a consistent 20 ppg guy on the same team, led them to plenty of playoff appearances and two Eastern Conference Finals. His sidekick before was Antoine Walker who basically fell off the Earth after he left Boston.
Spartan117
Immortal
Sure He played extremely well in the last game. But one must remember the Cavs team has actually played quite well despite the horrible performances by James through the early part of the series. James averaged nearly 5 1/2 turnovers a game through the series. He shot horrible and many of of his shots were of poor quality. ( low percentage)
The Cavs want to build around Lebron James but they obviously took it the wrong way
. Instead they have a bunch of three point shooters (which none of the could create their own shot) and have Lebron James playing point guard. I think the Cavs are approaching their team the wrong way. Also Spurs win !!!!... Down the stretch the Hornets looked quite static offensively. Pargo was taking all their shots and there was not much ball movement offensively. Maybe they were tired for all the minutes their starters played (minus pargo the bench played a grand total of 9 minutes) or maybe it was inexperience. They could not take advantage of the spurs only getting like 1 field goal for a large portion of the 4th quarter.
Wait, when did the Cavs trade for Kobe? I must have missed something
As for Pierce being top 10...well, whos in front of him?
Duncan, Kobe, LeBron, Garnett, Shaq, Nash, Iverson, Kidd, Ginobili is all I can name off the top of my head that have been better since 2000.
McGrady, Billups, Rasheed Wallace, Jermaine O'Neal, Ray Allen, Elton Brand, Chris Webber, and maybe a few others might have a case but...not really.
Pierce has been a consistent 20 ppg guy on the same team, led them to plenty of playoff appearances and two Eastern Conference Finals. His sidekick before was Antoine Walker who basically fell off the Earth after he left Boston.
I admit to being a little hasty on top 10, maybe top 20 is more realistic but the guys I bolded above are no way better than Pierce in my opinion.
Since 2000 he's been closer to 25 PPG and has a career avg of 23. I'm not an NBA stat junkie so I'm not sure how PPG is truly definitive of a great player, and I'd guess defensive ability should be equally weighed (why Garnett would be considered better). Also I recognize that a player like Kidd as a PG makes his team better in different ways than a forward and comparisons are difficult. Still, the guy is a superstar, should be remembered as one of the Celtic greats (even before his heroics last game) and hasn't gotten the notoriety of some other players because he's languished on what has been a pretty mediocre squad for the past 5 or 6 years. (Even when they were in the playoffs they were clearly outmatched). Game 7 proved he can take over a game like LeBron or Kobe. I also remember his amazing performance, I think it was in '02, against the Nets where they were down something like 30 points in the 4th quarter and he led the most amazing comeback I have ever seen. They lost that series but that was one of the greatest games in any sport I have ever seen.
And Antoine Walker had the goofiest looking game I have ever seen. His crazy stutter step thing that was supposed to pass for "running" was comical. (But he still managed to be kind of good when he was here.)
Darkness
Shadow creature
Spurs close out the Hornets in game 7: Nice! 
Come on Azale, where are the days when it was you and me on the Spurs bandwagon versus everybody else?
Come on Azale, where are the days when it was you and me on the Spurs bandwagon versus everybody else?
Spurs close out the Hornets in game 7: Nice!
Come on Azale, where are the days when it was you and me on the Spurs bandwagon versus everybody else?
Don't worry, you'll be celebrating another championship in a couple weeks. None of the teams remaining can realistically beat the Spurs.
Spurs close out the Hornets in game 7: Nice!
Come on Azale, where are the days when it was you and me on the Spurs bandwagon versus everybody else?
Hey, I thought the Spurs would lose in 7...it's not like I was setting the bandwagon on fire
Now it's nemesis time. Been a while since we had a good Spurs-Lakers series. I couldn't pick the Lakers if Wilt Chamberlain was playing center with Magic Johnson at the point, of course I'm back on the bandwagon
@illram, Kidd is widely considered a HoF...he led the Nets to two consecutive NBA Finals, which Pierce has not done once.
Nash has two MVP's and a considerable argument for 3, also has one of the best statsheets for a PG in history and just as many conference final visits in a much tougher conference. Not to mention how Nash transformed the Suns, he single handedly made D'Antoni's system viable.
Ginobili has averaged near the same PPG playing off the bench and in the starting rotation. He has won 3 championships since 2000 and been the second best player (or arguably the best player) on those teams. I might agree that he is not quite as good as Pierce, but it's arguable...and I might change my mind again mid argument
Pierce is certainly a good player, but he's not quite a SUPERstar. He just doesn't have the resume for it. He's arguable for even being a top 25 player in any given season. Even beyond the players that Azale mentioned, there are still guys like Allen Iverson, Dirk Nowitzki, Dwight Howard, and Chris Paul who are better along with a bunch of players could be considered better or at the same level as Pierce like Carmelo Anthony, Dewayne Wade, Gilbert Arenas, Carlos Boozer, Deron Williams, and Yao Ming. Where he ranks against those types of players is a matter of personal opinion, but he's definitely not a top 15 player, and is an arguable top 20.
I'm surprised you haven't even mentioned guys like Allen Iverson and Dirk Nowitzki
I'm surprised you haven't even mentioned guys like Allen Iverson and Dirk Nowitzki
I did mention Iverson. I think Nowitzki is overrated...there is a reason that a team as talented as the ones Dallas has had has not won a championship yet, and why they have basically wasted the last two years. Cuban should have pulled the trigger for the Shaq trade in retrospect.
The rest of those guys you mentioned do not have the body of work to say they are a top 10 player this century when compared to Pierce.
The rest of those guys you mentioned do not have the body of work to say they are a top 10 player this century when compared to Pierce.
Meh. Haters!
Spartan117
Immortal
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/steve_nash/career_stats.html
Not quite what you expected? huh..
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dirk_nowitzki/career_stats.html
Whatever you say the stats speak for themselves.
You may think he is overrated but that doesn't change the fact that Nowitzki has an MVP.
And I never said that those players were top 10. I did say those people had accomplishments that one could argue is on par with those of Pierce...as arguable top 25 players. Take Yao Ming for example; he, like Pierce are both 6-time all stars and 3 time all-nba selections--though Yao has been an all-star every season he's played. And while Pierce has taken his team deeper in the playoffs on a couple occasions, Yao is easily a much better player at his respective position. Averaging over 20 PPG as a center puts him is very select company and almost assures him of being an eventual hall of famer.
