2020 US Election (Part One)

[Truthy]

Don't get me wrong, if he had said something to the effect of "he was a terrible human being, he died like a coward, he took children with him,"* I would have been like aight, fine by me. But he said the phrase "died like a coward, whimpering, screaming, crying" over and over, combined with all these odd interjections about how great and beautiful the dog was and how he's the king of Twitter.

*not that I buy his account of what happened (and the US has made plenty of children collateral damage in the past...), but that's beside the point

 

[Lexicus]

"died like a coward, whimpering, screaming, crying" over and over, combined with all these odd interjections about how great and beautiful the dog was and how he's the king of Twitter.

It's just amusing to me because there's no doubt whatsoever that Trump himself is a coward, and I have no doubt whatever that he would die like a coward in a similar situation. I actually saw a report that Baghdadi died by setting off a suicide vest which I find much more credible than Trump's account.

 

[Kyriakos]

Indeed, Isis people are scum, yet it doesn't follow they are cowards. Cowards usually shy from being in war.

It is obvious that Trump is just lying, and is dumb enough that he can't estimate how clear it is.

That's sort of the whole thing with Trump though anyway: up to now you had politicians control at least 2,5 brain cells so they would be conscious at least of some need to spin reality. Trump is so incapable of thinking that he just says stuff and I think he becomes surprised when the listeners immediately get he is all bs.

 

[Lexicus]

Indeed, Isis people are scum, yet it doesn't follow they are cowards. Cowards usually shy from being in war.

Replace the word "stubbornly" with "courageously" and you have it

 

[Kyriakos]

^Isis are a whole militant movement which managed to control a state, though. They are more like Prussia ( ), not the regular crowd of civilians who have various checks and balances and seldom want change unless things get to boiling point

 

[Lexicus]

^Isis are a whole militant movement which managed to control a state, though. They are more like Prussia ( ), not the regular crowd of civilians who have various checks and balances and seldom want change unless things get to boiling point

You are missing the point, which is that people display courage as readily in the service of horrible causes as great ones.

 

[Kyriakos]

You are missing the point, which is that people display courage as readily in the service of horrible causes as great ones.

Well, yes - but I thought this wasn't disputed in the first place. It does help if one identifies the cause as good, though (regardless of whether it can be said to be so or not).

Usually barbarian invasions weren't sold on some lofty idea - but the barbarians were more willing to fight, maybe cause the civilized entity didn't consist entirely of bloodthirsty warriors.

 

[Lexicus]

Well, yes - but I thought this wasn't disputed in the first place.

Not between us, but look at any US (or Israeli) military press materials about "terrorists", it almost always calls them cowards because they engage in the tactics of the weak against the strong. It's like saying US soldiers are cowards because they take cover when they come under fire.

 

[Kyriakos]

Not between us, but look at any US (or Israeli) military press materials about "terrorists", it almost always calls them cowards because they engage in the tactics of the weak against the strong. It's like saying US soldiers are cowards because they take cover when they come under fire.

Yes. Pretty sure that one shouldn't be called a "coward" if they don't want to fight tanks and airplanes with guerilla weapons. They should be called "sane" for not wanting that.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Indeed, Isis people are scum, yet it doesn't follow they are cowards. Cowards usually shy from being in war.

Bill Maher got his show on NBC cancelled for saying that while the 9/11 hijackers were horrific people, they weren't cowards.

It set his career back but led to his much better show on HBO so it was probably a net win.

 

[Lexicus]

Bill Maher got his show on NBC cancelled for saying that while the 9/11 hijackers were horrific people, they weren't cowards.

In this case, a rant about political correctness would have been warranted, lol

 

[Gori the Grey]

Since this is the 2020 election thread do people think the Baghdadi operation will help Trump?

Any boost in popularity he realized from this didn't last until the World Series game later in the day, at which the crowd booed him when he was shown on the jumbotron.

 

[Kyriakos]

Bill Maher got his show on NBC cancelled for saying that while the 9/11 hijackers were horrific people, they weren't cowards.

It set his career back but led to his much better show on HBO so it was probably a net win.

Maher says some logical stuff at times, but he has insane views on Israel state and all-around doesn't seem to be particularly a force for good by now. Not quite republican pundit level, but...

 

[hobbsyoyo]

In this case, a rant about political correctness would have been warranted, lol

Ha! The show was called Politically Incorrect!

Maher says some logical stuff at times, but he has insane views on Israel state and all-around doesn't seem to be particularly a force for good by now. Not quite republican pundit level, but...

I don't think his views on Israel are insane. I don't agree with a lot of his points but I wouldn't call them insane. His views on space exploration, on the other hand...

 

[Lexicus]

Ha! The show was called Politically Incorrect!

Yeah I know

I don't think his views on Israel are insane. I don't agree with a lot of his points but I wouldn't call them insane.

Yeah, I wouldn't use the word insane, but I would use words like Racist and Uninformed

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Do you watch his show?

 

[Lexicus]

Do you watch his show?

No, but I am aware of his views on Israel from secondary sources.

 

[Kyriakos]

Do you watch his show?

New rule:

If you don't accept Maher's views on Israel state as insane,
you are only left with the option to view them as racist and uninformed.
/Maher grimace-stares silently into the camera
/audience laughs/claps

 

[Berzerker]

Trump's probably lying about Baghdadi crying etc, you dont want others thinking the guy died making a courageous last stand against the forces of imperialism. Call him a whining dog instead, I can see the logic I guess.

Bill Maher got his show on NBC cancelled for saying that while the 9/11 hijackers were horrific people, they weren't cowards.

It set his career back but led to his much better show on HBO so it was probably a net win.

I was watching the show that night, Dinesh D'Souza said it wasn't cowardly to die on a suicide mission, Maher agreed but then added it was cowardly to launch cruise missiles. Thats why he got canned.

 

[Kyriakos]

Trump's probably lying about Baghdadi crying etc, you dont want others thinking the guy died making a courageous last stand against the forces of imperialism. Call him a whining dog instead, I can see the logic I guess.



I was watching the show that night, Dinesh D'Souza said it wasn't cowardly to die on a suicide mission, Maher agreed but then added it was cowardly to launch cruise missiles. Thats why he got canned.

Well, it is rather cowardly to win by missiles. It is why (eg) the spartans scoffed at archers. Use of light infantry like peltasts, javelin-men and archers only became the norm with the Theban hegemony.
I suppose it is also why when a bow is presented as special for a hero, they must have exceptional skill, as with Odysseus being able to drive an arrow through the cylindrical gaps on the base of a number of axes. That said, afaik not even Odysseus fought primarily with a bow - he even wanted the spear and shield of Achilles, which he got in the end (through treachery).

And speaking of Ajax:

εἰ δέ τις θεῶν βλάπτοι, φύγοι τἂν χὡ κακὸς τὸν κρείσσονα.

which loosely translates to: "If a god means to harm (one), then even the coward can find himself in a better position than the brave".