2020 US Election (Part Two)

[Patine]

The point is, and this is the point you continually refuse to acknowledge, is that you act like a Democrat who once got a parking ticket is equally as bad as a Republican who makes a regular practice of raping babies to death on satanic alters.

What you post here trivializes the crimes of those who really are the most monstrous. And in doing so, effectively supports the ones who are most monstrous.

This has never been, at all, what I've ever said. Not once. Many Republican politicians have indeed been behind many very vile and horrid crimes, and supported many others - but so have many Democratic politicians, including Biden, as I have enumerated. Are these automatically and completely absolved and exonerated for all Democrats and multiplied in absolute ways for all Republicans? I'm sorry, I'm don't do "partisan-based justice." It's unfortunate that you do, but I'm glad you've openly admitted it. I'd like to see the great majority of elected and appointed U.S. Federal Government officers, serving and retired, get the full trials, with no political meddling and all seditiously-kept secret evidence cracked open, made public, and used against them, and then sentenced to the VERY LONG sentences - with no pardons - they deserve, regardless of party. It's unfortunate that you see "justice," as being hinged on lopsided partisan membership as the most important factor.

 

[Gorbles]

So that's a "yep, you're allowed to accuse me of things I didn't do and completely ignore being called on it". Alrighty then.

 

[Patine]

So that's a "yep, you're allowed to accuse me of things I didn't do and completely ignore being called on it". Alrighty then.

Grow up!

 

[Zardnaar]

Last few weeks were nice and quiet. Must be that time of year.

 

[Takhisis]

Last few weeks were nice and quiet. Must be that time of year.

It's just that Patine wasn't posting.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Grow up!

Can you stop tap dancing about and address his point like the grown up you're supposed to be

 

[Zardnaar]

Can you stop tap dancing about and address his point like the grown up you're supposed to be

Good point Comrade.

 

[Estebonrober]

Berz, c'mon... No. Global warming is good for us? Seriously?

First off, global warming means loss of glacial ice, which means rising sea levels which means loss of habitat, drinking water and arable land, right? Second, global warming means that deserts and dry spots will expand, decreasing arable land, right?

I mean maybe the case could be made that retreating cold zones means that land which was previously tundra becomes temperate, theoretically increasing arable land, but that also means loss of habitat for the species that live there, but there is another problem... thawing tundra releases deadly diseases like anthrax as the frozen carcasses of dead animals like caribou begin to thaw. As an aside... tundra thawing doesn't do much of anything for us in the US anyway, besides maybe Alaska, and I don't see us moving our breadbasket up there. Canada and Russia might benefit, but all we get is a bunch of dust bowls.

A related thing worth mentioning is something I saw in a NETFLIX documentary series called "Connected". One episode showed how the Amazon rainforest is actually dependent on a steady stream of tens of thousands of tons dust blowing in across the Atlantic from the Sahara desert. Without it, the erosion from the constant rainfall and extensive waterways would make plant life unsustainable, killing the Amazon and essentially turning it into a swamp rather than a jungle. So ironically, apparently even if global warming did somehow make the Sahara fertile, all that would accomplish is killing the Amazon in the process. They didn't go that far into it, but it was very interesting and worth a watch.

Connected was a great show imo. I mean I knew all of it before I watched it but it put things in better ways then I had heard previously. Also shout out to David Attenborough's "A Life on our Planet" also on Netflix also getting into just how much we have devastated the planet. The palm oil scenes alone just boggle the mind.

 

[Drakle]

What is your theory of politics Patine and Berserker? Lose for all time, and whine all the way? If we assume that your stated position is in good faith, and isn't just being shills for GOP talking points. If I thought that was the truth, I'd never pay attention to politics, instead of rage posting and copy-pasting GOP propaganda endlessly.

 

[Estebonrober]

Frankly, honesty has been at a high premium by politicians, ideologues, pundits, and even fervent supporter of both major parties since AT LEAST 2015. But, since I know you regard calling out both major U.S. parties at the same time to automatically be a discrediting sin with knee-jerk reaction and refusal to even consider or think about the point made on the issue, just hive-mind, denunciation, I imagine this point, too, will be dismissed without any thought on the matter.

You have done this for over a year now @Patine and it shows you are as guilty of speaking for other's positions as you accuse others of doing to you. You know I largely agree with your bothsidesism, but there is just not a viable comparison on the damage done. From antifa v white nationalists to Dem Party v GOP. The scope of the damage, the amount of power wielded to destroy, and the willingness to be evil just does not have a comparison. For me to act like that the difference in horribleness is not important is not only ignorant it is malicious.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Can you stop tap dancing about and address his point like the grown up you're supposed to be

The answer is no comrade, because the premise of the last part is incorrect.

The point is, and this is the point you continually refuse to acknowledge, is that you act like a Democrat who once got a parking ticket is equally as bad as a Republican who makes a regular practice of raping babies to death on satanic alters.

What you post here trivializes the crimes of those who really are the most monstrous. And in doing so, effectively supports the ones who are most monstrous.

The insidious nature of bothsidesism, succinctly explained

 

[Sommerswerd]

Connected was a great show imo. I mean I knew all of it before I watched it but it put things in better ways then I had heard previously. Also shout out to David Attenborough's "A Life on our Planet" also on Netflix also getting into just how much we have devastated the planet. The palm oil scenes alone just boggle the mind.

Yes Attenborough's documentary was excellent.

 

[amadeus]

An interesting article has been published showing that, to my surprise, Trump has improved his standing among black and Latino voters. He’s still far away from winning either demographic, but I would think that given how things have turned out this year that his support from those groups would have either stayed about the same or declined.

The article acknowledges there remains a double-digit Biden lead, so even improving his performance there doesn’t seem to make up the gap. I’d be interested to see if this changes anything on downballot races.

 

[Drakle]

An interesting article has been published showing that, to my surprise, Trump has improved his standing among black and Latino voters. He’s still far away from winning either demographic, but I would think that given how things have turned out this year that his support from those groups would have either stayed about the same or declined.

The article acknowledges there remains a double-digit Biden lead, so even improving his performance there doesn’t seem to make up the gap. I’d be interested to see if this changes anything on downballot races.

Polling subgroups is always hard. Particularly hard with Hispanic voters, when you have two different languages, and multiple generations from new migrants, to those who have lived in Texas and the Southwest since the US annexed it.

Polling often overstates the Hispanic support for Republicans. 2016 exits polls got it wrong, and the NYT polling of Hispanics in 2018 was pretty off. And Nate Cohn basically said he has little idea how to fix it.

Aside from them, there was a big miss in states like Texas. The only state where the bias went towards Republicans, is with Florida, which has Cubans. But Scott and De Santis did narrow the margins with others as well. Florida Republicans are generally competent campaigners, and Democrats are not.

There is a speciality Latino pollster, Latino decisions who show Hispanics not being a sign of improvement for Trump, but they have been criticised as potentially not capturing Hispanics who have most quickly accultured to being white. Big definition issue either way.

With Hispanics, in particular, it is basically the same gist as other white ethnics, like the Irish, Italian, etc. Very heavily Democratic, but once accepted into the mainstream they start politically diffusing.

Thought it could be said that Trump has stopped campaigning on immigration like in 2016, he is basically just campaigning on general republican issues and cultural crap. The median latino voter is much more conservative than the median white voters, since Democrats and Republicans are fighting over the 25-35% conservative latinos, while with white voters it is 40-50% range. With black voters it is even worse, the 10% most conservative voters.

But even if true, Biden's gains with white voters, vs small gains with minority voters by Republicans is a positive gain for Democrats. For example in Texas, if Democrats gain with white voters and don't really with Hispanics, then the Texas gerrymander will mean Democrats break into a bunch of cracked suburbs around major cities, but Republicans won't gain any seats from the packed Hispanic districts, because the Democratic margins are too large.

 

[Arwon]

Yeah the issue is preferred language and language proficiency is a cross-cutting thing that confounds the usual variables for which nationwide polling stratifies. If you're not working in both languages, and weighting responses by both languages, your sample can get skewed and miss differences within the group.

 

[amadeus]

Good breakdown, @Drakle.

I think over time the GOP will adjust itself to changing demographics and, like you said with Italian or Irish voters, attract more support from these groups. I’m not saying its exclusive to the Republicans; Democrats have changed over time too, of course.

Overall though I think the GOP has generally done poorly at identifying issues that are already in-line with party policy and can attract support from black and Latino voters. One area I always thought was kind of vexing was on the cultural conservatism: broadly speaking these groups are more conservative in these areas but break heavily for the Democrats.

It just leads me to think I should be a GOP political strategist because regardless of outcome they still get paid the big bucks.

 

[Farm Boy]

@Drakle - use a spoiler marked NSFW before you get spanked.

Oh nooo, whatever would we do without the game of smear the patine or the shitposter.

I mean, the you're with us or against us is a pretty amusing vibe to level at a Canadian, but I don't love GWB enough to be gagging out of... fondness.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Oh nooo, whatever would we do without the game of smear the patine or the ****poster.

I mean, the you're with us or against us is a pretty amusing vibe to level at a Canadian, but I don't love GWB enough to be gagging out of... fondness.

Huh? I don't see the connection... but since you brought it up... you are well aware of my attitude about that issue.

 

[Arwon]

Unsurprisingly, the rest of the world certainly doesn't think they're the same thing

 

[Farm Boy]

Eh, you'll probably get me too sooner or later. Then the biscuits n'gravy will be even sweeter.