Another First World Muslim Joins ISIS

[Formaldehyde]

But how many who sign up when the predator comes to their school actually believe any of that, instead of seeking revenge for 9/11 or just wanting jobs?

What does invading and occupying Iraq on the basis of lies and deceit have to do with good secular ideas? The two major wars since WWII were completely unnecessary from the perspective of the defense of the US.

 

[Traitorfish]

That's my point. No terror organization comes even close in offering benefits when compared to first world countries.

Even if you join the Canadian army, chances of death are low. More Canadians died from suicide than actual combat in Afghanistan.

Wait, so you're not asking about their political or religious motivations, uou're just asking about their career choices?

 

[illram]

But how many who sign up when the predator comes to their school actually believe any of that, instead of seeking revenge for 9/11.

I don't know. I do strongly disagree with many of the recruitment tactics of our armed forces and feel very sad for the kids and families of those kids who joined under false pretenses.

 

[Borachio]

Isn't it sad when the military is the best career option for so many people?

 

[Sanguivorant]

Wait, so you're not asking about their political or religious motivations, uou're just asking about their career choices?

Sorry for the confusion. No, I am mostly concerned about their motivations, but the benefits part did come up so I responded to it. What's sure is that those guys are not joining ISIS to make money.

 

[warpus]

Name a single terrorist organization which provides college tuition, a housing allowance, and free substandard medical coverage with lengthy wait times for the rest of your life.

Al Qaeda offers free dental IIRC. (No they don't)

They were also typically deployed to the safest areas, as they were in Iraq.

The Canadian contingent in Afghanistan was in one of the most violent provinces, but maybe I'm just parroting what the Canadian propaganda machine has been feeding me. Still, I've talked to one of the soldiers who has gone (guy from my highschool), and that's what he says too. Mind you, for the most part most people sent there were safe, but the part of the country they were in was one of the most volatile regions.

Isn't it sad when the military is the best career option for so many people?

Very sad, but in a lot of cases it helps people form stable lives, etc. I guess?

 

[kramerfan86]

Presumably these young men don't regard Canada as their nation or Canadian liberalism as their way of life, and who are we to tell them that they are mistaken?

You're right that they aren't defending their families, but, then, are those who join the Canadian Army? Is Canada at serious risk of being invaded by the Taliban? Which further brings the "nation and way of life" explanation into question. So whatever it is that fundamentally distinguishes the one from the other is still unclear.

There is a reason i said theoretically, modern armies in reality do very little actual defending of home, family, or way of life, but to me that would be the theoretical difference.

 

[Sanguivorant]

I agree, we are no longer in an era where armies bear meaning. But hey if it employs people.

 

[CELTICEMPIRE]

Anyone who fights for ISIS should be banned from reentering their country of origin.

 

[Sanguivorant]

As if they want to go back. The guy I'm talking about burned his passport.

 

[kramerfan86]

Anyone who fights for ISIS should be banned from reentering their country of origin.

That sounds nice in theory but as soon as you do it those who go fight for these groups will wise up and not admit they did so, and once they dont admit they did that its not something the home country can particularly prove.

 

[Traitorfish]

Anyone who fights for ISIS should be banned from reentering their country of origin.

Aside from the practical issues raised by Kramer, most jurisdictions forbids stripping citizenship if it would leave an individual stateless, so unless these people have dual citizenship, that wouldn't be possible even with definitive proof of their membership.

 

[Tahuti]

Aside from the practical issues raised by Kramer, most jurisdictions forbids stripping citizenship if it would leave an individual stateless, so unless these people have dual citizenship, that wouldn't be possible even with definitive proof of their membership.

Then allow it.

 

[Sanguivorant]

Stateless until the Caliphate starts issuing passports.

 

[Traitorfish]

Then allow it.

In most cases it's guaranteed by international treaties. I think that it's also prevented by European law.

 

[kramerfan86]

Could always charge them with terrorism and imprison them if the group they join is a designated terrorist group, but once again proof is near impossible.

 

[Bugfatty300]

As if they want to go back. The guy I'm talking about burned his passport.

He can't send off for a replacement?

 

[HannibalBarka]

...
I think the difference with joining the military is that joining the military is something legally and culturally approved of in most places. Joining a terrorist organization is usually not, even among most Muslims.

The thing is I don't really think they (those who join ISIS) consider ISIS as a terrorist organization. It's the never ending debate terrorist/freedom fighters

 

[HannibalBarka]

Yeah. Some join the military for benefits in a country like Canada, where you are paid for your university if you serve afterwards.

I mean it's not like ISIS will give scholarships to their fighters or something.

You don't join ISIS to become rich, it's not a job
I am surprised (and a bit worried to be honest ) to see that the only value you give to actions someone do is basically its "dollar" value. Money, health benefit and fancy cars are not the alpha and omega in one's life.
Do you consider French Doctors to be "losing" their lifes?

 

[NovaKart]

Of course they wouldn't call them terrorists but they would likely be familiar with their reputation for violence.