[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Thenewwwguy]

Not if you add in Northern Ireland. Which yes...is part of the UK; but culturally is still very Irish.

also i’m fairly certain more of the irish diaspora still identifies more irish

and that there’s probably a larger irish diaspora

 

[PhoenicianGold]

also i’m fairly certain more of the irish diaspora still identifies more irish

and that there’s probably a larger irish diaspora

Quick google says in America 34 million claim Irish heritage but only 25 million claim Scottish heritage.

One would think that the former Scottish colonies in Canada might balanace this out, but there are 4.5 million Irish-Canadians, and only 4.7 million Scottish-Canadians.

So I would say you are in fact correct that there was a larger Irish diaspora. Yet another reason why Scotland may not have been the better pick under any standard. Just because I'm trying to explain Scotland (and I think I've generally hit on what the devs were thinking at the time) doesn't mean I think they were necessarily right in their thinking. It's easily the most problematic civ on the roster for me.

 

[God of Kings]

To complicate things further, there are some who are both Irish and Scottish by blood but born and living in North America a few generations since their first Irish and Scottish ancestors settled.

 

[nzcamel]

As Irish as I am, I'd rather they didn't appear myself. There are other better contenders that are yet to appear.

 

[CivLuvah]

To complicate things further, there are some who are both Irish and Scottish by blood but born and living in North America a few generations since their first Irish and Scottish ancestors settled.

Most likely descendants of Ulster-Scots, Scots people who settled in Ireland to establish plantations, who mingled with Irish people, either in Ireland or outside of Ireland. A lot of Ulster-Scots people emigrated from Ireland to North America.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

As Irish as I am, I'd rather they didn't appear myself. There are other better contenders that are yet to appear.

fair, I'd personally like to see Ireland a lot, as they'd be the type of civ I'd like to play (faith focused with culture and science side bonuses) and Brian Boru is one of my favorite leaders and I'd love to see him in game.


They'd be more fun to me than the Byzantines, who to me, feel geographically superfluous and would be yet another Hellenic civ in the already overpopulated Balkans, or Portugal, who would be fun, but feel like historically, they play into the same niche as Spain, even if they could theoretically play differently in Civ.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

They'd be more fun to me than the Byzantines, who to me, feel geographically superfluous and would be yet another Hellenic civ in the already overpopulated Balkans, or Portugal, who would be fun, but feel like historically, they play into the same niche as Spain, even if they could theoretically play differently in Civ.

But talk about overpopulated, what about Western Europe?

 

[PhoenicianGold]

To complicate things further, there are some who are both Irish and Scottish by blood but born and living in North America a few generations since their first Irish and Scottish ancestors settled.

If I happen to be that which you speak of, does the fact that I would have preferred Ireland carry any more weight with the market research team?

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Quick google says in America 34 million claim Irish heritage but only 25 million claim Scottish heritage.

One would think that the former Scottish colonies in Canada might balanace this out, but there are 4.5 million Irish-Canadians, and only 4.7 million Scottish-Canadians.

So I would say you are in fact correct that there was a larger Irish diaspora. Yet another reason why Scotland may not have been the better pick under any standard. Just because I'm trying to explain Scotland (and I think I've generally hit on what the devs were thinking at the time) doesn't mean I think they were necessarily right in their thinking. It's easily the most problematic civ on the roster for me.

I'm both.
Not to mention English, French, and German heritage. By that logic I'm assuming I have some Norse/Scandinavia in me as well.

I think your overthinking Scotland's inclusion. They looked at the different Celtic nations, presumably through the same lens as the different Polynesians, and decided which would be the most marketable not from necessarily population or most widespread but the overall appeal of the Civ.

In that instance how many people would have said no to a leader like Robert the Bruce, thanks to the film Braveheart, with a highlander unit and bagpipes in the theme? Compare that to even Brian Boru for Ireland, which many people outside of a deep history or Ireland, probably don't know about. From that point of view I think Scotland was the clear winner in my opinion.
I think that same idea was why the Maori was chosen too. Having a well known "Maori Warrior" UU was definitely enticing and from there they probably thought NZ was more marketable, even if there were better options for a leader in Kamehameha for Hawaii, or a fore a more widespread Samoa or Tonga.

They'd be more fun to me than the Byzantines, who to me, feel geographically superfluous and would be yet another Hellenic civ in the already overpopulated Balkans, or Portugal, who would be fun, but feel like historically, they play into the same niche as Spain, even if they could theoretically play differently in Civ.

I definitely wouldn't expect a Portugese inquisition, in game at least.

 

[The Kingmaker]

I wouldn’t say no to Ireland, but neither do I expect them any time soon. Maybe in Final Frontier, if we’re lucky enough to have one.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

But talk about overpopulated, what about Western Europe?

i would say we don’t need nearly as many european civs as we do, but most people would disagree lmao

 

[Ziad]

Ireland would be a funny way to complete the British Isles trifecta (RIP Wales). They could differentiate them a bit by giving them a faith, culture, and military focus compared to Scotland's science and England's production/naval emphasis. Of course this will require some imagination as they can very easily be quite redundant with Scotland thematically. (I probably insulted many people right now).

Civilizations that I find notably absent are:

• Portugal. It had way too big an influence on the global sphere to not be present. They should go with a more... uh ... sane leader this time around though like Joao.
• Berbers (Desert Nomads). North Africa is poorly represented at the moment with only Egypt and Nubia huddled together in the far top-right. Morocco with its significant modern influence is the easy choice. Alternatively, Firaxis can go wild and go with Numidia represented by the Masaesyli
• Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine) led by an alternate leader to Trajan. Rome can have the expansionist focus with the roads/Legion/Monuments. The Eastern Roman Empire could instead focus on wealth and/or faith. Maybe even introduce a fun double leader mechanic with Theodora and Justinian.
• Haudenosaunee (Iroquois). They have a rich history and it's odd that they haven't been included yet. Longhouse improvement/unique building is an easy choice. They could have a production focus to make them stand out among the North American civs.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Berbers (Desert Nomads). North Africa is poorly represented at the moment with only Egypt and Nubia huddled together in the far top-right. Morocco with its significant modern influence is the easy choice. Alternatively, Firaxis can go wild and go with Numidia represented by the Masaesyli

Not that i don’t think we need berbers (imo, we do), but tbf, we also have Phoenicia in North Africa

Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine) led by an alternate leader to Trajan. Rome can have the expansionist focus with the roads/Legion/Monuments. The Eastern Roman Empire could instead focus on wealth and/or faith

I think it’s well established why, if we get byzantium, it should be a separate civ (namely for its helenization, orthodox religion and notably unique culture)

 

[Ziad]

Not that i don’t think we need berbers (imo, we do), but tbf, we also have Phoenicia in North Africa

Well sure and I'd be the first one to make that connection in certain contexts but this is like saying we have Rome already represented in North Africa ... Phoenicia's home turf is the Levant just like Rome's home turf is Italy.

I've actually brought up making Hannibal an alternate leader for Phoenicia with a focus on the Carthaginian empire (maybe give them an agricultural twist with maybe an additional unique unit) but that's unlikely to happen.

I think it’s well established why, if we get byzantium, it should be a separate civ (namely for its helenization, orthodox religion and notably unique culture)

Oh I'd love it either way.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Well sure and I'd be the first one to make that connection in certain contexts but this is like saying we have Rome already represented in North Africa ... Phoenicia's home turf is the Levant just like Rome's home turf is Italy.

I've actually brought up making Hannibal an alternate leader for Phoenicia with a focus on the Carthaginian empire (maybe give them an agricultural twist with maybe an additional unique unit) but that's unlikely to happen.



Oh I'd love it either way.

tbf phoenicia might be more historically centralized in the levant, but it’s dido and an ability designed around moving to carthage

 

[PhoenicianGold]

Small observation:

The fact that the NFP leaders have been recycling other leader animations (LSS/Amanitore, Bolivar/Pedro, Menelik/Cyrus) suggests that:

(1) leader animations seem to be made year-by-year and this year development resources were slimmer; there might be recordings sitting around in limbo but the actual animations seem to be put off until the civ is given a full go. This also is a knock against the likelihood that a fourth year of DLC, be it a third expack or a season pass, had its roster list laid out ahead of time.

(2) Leader animations from now on can be significantly cheaper to produce, since they need much less mo-cap and animation refining. Just a couple custom animations and different mouth movements.

So, here's my hope. If we have to make a concession that leader animations are reused, I don't want a game where only eight of them are recycled. It seems like such a waste of the concept. So I am hoping that this means we could very well get a second season with at least eight more leader animations recycled. Could even make a game of guessing who's next.

 

[Haig]

Current predictions:

DLC3: Babylon and Palmyra, middle eastern map

DLC4: Byzantium

DLC5: trade-oriented pack with new district and game mode that reflects that, plus Portugal and Dutch alt

DLC6: Native american civ and map of North America

I think it starts to look like the DLC have loose themes so I really think that a commerce-DLC with Portugal is more likely than a DLC#5 with Vietnam, like what would the district of that pack be.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Current predictions:

DLC3: Babylon and Palmyra, middle eastern map

DLC4: Byzantium

DLC5: trade-oriented pack with new district and game mode that reflects that, plus Portugal and Dutch alt

DLC6: Native american civ and map of North America

I think it starts to look like the DLC have loose themes so I really think that a commerce-DLC with Portugal is more likely than a DLC#5 with Vietnam, like what would the district of that pack be.

You could be right but I don't think they would not include anything from East Asia after leaving them out in GS.

I agree with your other prediction's though. I still think that Byzantium or some North African civ like the Berbers could go in DLC 3 and it could still be more of a Mediterranean/Middle east map with Portugal for DLC 4.

I also don't think the new district will correlate with a trade/corporation game mode anyway because it would have to be compatible with the base game too like the Diplo Quarter not needing Secret Societies at all. What it could be at this point I'm not sure. Besides I think the Harbor and Commercial Hub already cover the trading aspects well.

 

[Kupe Navigator]

I kinda want a vietnam civ... I don't believe Civ ever had vietnam as a civ before.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I kinda want a vietnam civ... I don't believe Civ ever had vietnam as a civ before.

They've been the most fan requested newcomer from what I've seen.