Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth

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i ask for 1.71 as i need to open a game using that version. 1.72 worked fine for me straight from the start anyway :)
The gamefront upload is still there.

The Roman crash still happens.

What exactly causes it, do you know?
If I knew it, it would've been long fixed now. :)

I have the patch in which you added the Byzantines for the first time. What changes have been made since?
That was 1.7. Changes in 1.71 and 1.72:
Spoiler :
Additional 1.71 changes:

* reduced Constantinople's starting culture
* Arabia now flips Jerusalem, Memphis, Alexandria and Tisfun in 640 AD
* Byzantine 600 AD spawn date now properly displayed
* renamed Alexandretta to Antiochia
* rearranged resources in Anatolia (removed 1 wheat and 1 clam)
* Bulgar, Cuman, Pecheneg barbarian spawns to challenge Byzantium to the west and north
* Arabian UHV now erases non-state religions except holy cities
* preplaced Tisfun/Ctesiphon/Baghdad in the 600 AD scenario
* made Justinian less military inclined
* nerfed several Byzantine coefficients, most prominently research, GP rate, production, city upkeep
* reduced Byzantine likeliness to train settlers or offensive units
* changed Cataphracts to strength 9, +25% against melee
* removed Byzantine spearmen in 600 AD Africa
* reduced Babylonian likeliness to train settlers
* original Byzantine war and settler/stability maps added (replacing the former Greek maps)
* Theodosian Walls don't create GPP anymore, Hagia Sophia now increases the chance of creating an artist
* removed wheat, ivory near Tripolis
* original Byzantine city name map, renaming function up to date
* Changed Italian UP to "free specialist in your three largest cities until the industrial age"


Additional 1.72 changes:

* excluded Sirajis from Arabian flip
* part of the Arabian units and settlers spawn in Baghdad and Cairo
* AI Arabian capital gets moved to Cairo or Baghdad in 650 AD
* extended the Russian historical area to the Ukraine to encourage the conquest of Kiev
* changed the Roman UP so that units can't spawn on islands anymore
* Byzantium now only spawns when Greece is dead or Rome controls at least one city in its core
* Italy now only spawns when at least half of the Italian cities are independent (usually either Rome or Venice not conquered yet)
* Former city garrisons get pushed out before they flip to Italy to avoid that they become a military power
* reduced the probability of 600 AD preplaced cities to get razed
* changed Abu Bakr's personality to focus on science as well
* preplaced Naples in 600 AD
* Tripolis and Benghazi are independent in 600 AD now
* fixed unique GP names
* added Ethiopian and Khmer GP names, expanded Portuguese GP names (credit to JiimBV)
* forced reborn AI civs to found a new city
* moved sheep from Mecca to Baghdad
* moved fish in the North Sea to be accessible to Amsterdam only (also discourage Aarhus)
* rebirth civs now found a new city on their rebirth plot if possible (you'll see Florence more often)
* Rome is now excluded from the Italian rebirth flip
* added a Safavid rebirth for Persia in 1500 AD in Esfahan (no new unique assets)
* new Persian leaders: Abbas I, Khomeini
* new Italian leader: Cavour, replacing Victor Emmanuel
* Netherlands now found larger cities with more buildings
* all civilizations now start with appropriate civics and state religions if applicable


is there a way to enable autosaves during autoplay? This way you could load the save before the crash to help determine what caused it.

also, the turks flipped Rasht at their spawn.

The answer to the too-old Arabia is Turkic/Mongol barbs in Iran, and/or improved Mongol civ (which I know you are working with). Using barbs to confine a later Arabia to Egypt and Arabia(Fatimids, Mamluks) would be both historic and helpful to the game. you don't want the turks to have it too easy with just indies to deal with! A middle East that was split three ways between the Ottomans (Anatolia), Arabs (Egypt and Arabia) and Persia, with Mesopotamia and the Levant the battleground would be ideal. This scenario would also allow for a transition later into modern Middle eastern states.

I have a computer I can run some test games on for the next few days so let me know when you have an updated svn with a potential fix and I'll generate some starts, to give you a larger sample size to eliminate the luck factor.
Autosaves have been disabled by edead in RFCM, I'd have to look first to reenable them (I guess it's C++).

Thanks for the hint, Rasht shouldn't flip to them.

I currently can't foresee when I can apply the next fix to the SVN, sorry :(
 
although the url says 1.71 the download in the link is 1.72 and i have checked, the download is 1.72 as well :sad:
 
Seems that gamefront overwrote my previous file ... I'd rather avoid reuploading a whole RAR file. Could you use SVN instead?
 
sure, i can do that (i think :lol:)
 
Just a random idea for sometime later: What would people think of expanding the Chinese stability zone? Mongolia and Manchuria were controlled for quite a while by China (not to mention bits of Kazakhstan and Tajikstan during the Tang and Qing dynasties), and still partially are (Inner Mongolia and Manchuria). In most games where China survives the Mongols (about 1 in 6 for me), they steamroll up into Mongolia anyway, maybe there should be an incentive to do so rather than an over-active AI. But, just a random observation.
 
I also get some CTD's once in a while with the new civs respawning - it's really a shame, as it seems to break savegames also. It's weird though, I had the exact same thing happen to me as rigo92 - game crashes at Persian rebirth few turn after dutch spawn - and after trying the exact same thing all over again, autoloading from 600 AD, no crash. Something is wrong somewhere with the rebirth thing.

Gj otherwise though Leoreth, nice new features, and of course I am happy for the boost to my beloved Dutch :D Problem is now though that the fish gets taken by English culture instead of Viking, London will outproduce Amsterdam in culture for some time, but I'll stop complaining about that and just relocate the fish myself whenever I play, as I'm seemingly unable to be pleased ;) The suggestion about an indy CPH that can flip is really not that bad, should be exclusive for 600AD scenario only though - 3000 BC cities are random and a bit weird always anyhow, and guess people would feel it too deterministic if it was always the same. But having it spawn in 600 AD and then flip sounds like an easy solution, instead of messing around with ressourses and changing settler values and what not - AI build stupid cities no matter what, I guess.

I by the way deleted my entire DoC folder, and downloaded the whole thing over again (trying to eliminate the rebirth bug), but I'm still having problems with building the AP - it is seemingly unbuildable in the 3000BC scenario, both by me and the AI; am I the only one having trouble with this? :confused:
 
I also get some CTD's once in a while with the new civs respawning - it's really a shame, as it seems to break savegames also. It's weird though, I had the exact same thing happen to me as rigo92 - game crashes at Persian rebirth few turn after dutch spawn - and after trying the exact same thing all over again, autoloading from 600 AD, no crash. Something is wrong somewhere with the rebirth thing.

Gj otherwise though Leoreth, nice new features, and of course I am happy for the boost to my beloved Dutch :D Problem is now though that the fish gets taken by English culture instead of Viking, London will outproduce Amsterdam in culture for some time, but I'll stop complaining about that and just relocate the fish myself whenever I play, as I'm seemingly unable to be pleased ;) The suggestion about an indy CPH that can flip is really not that bad, should be exclusive for 600AD scenario only though - 3000 BC cities are random and a bit weird always anyhow, and guess people would feel it too deterministic if it was always the same. But having it spawn in 600 AD and then flip sounds like an easy solution, instead of messing around with ressourses and changing settler values and what not - AI build stupid cities no matter what, I guess.

I by the way deleted my entire DoC folder, and downloaded the whole thing over again (trying to eliminate the rebirth bug), but I'm still having problems with building the AP - it is seemingly unbuildable in the 3000BC scenario, both by me and the AI; am I the only one having trouble with this? :confused:
The mistake is definitely on my part here.

For Amsterdam, I noticed that as well, it seems that Netherlands' core needs to be extended further into the North Sea so that they flip the fish (and are able to hold it with a solid 100% Dutch culture).
 
Maybe this is meant to be so, but I've noticed that Portugal always seems to lose its home cities to Spanish cultural expansion. I know that Iberia is a bit cramped. but it doesn't quite seems fair...
 
Maybe this is meant to be so, but I've noticed that Portugal always seems to lose its home cities to Spanish cultural expansion. I know that Iberia is a bit cramped. but it doesn't quite seems fair...

Perhaps a culture blocker would be in order...
 
i don't think the Portugal thing is always true. sometimes they are really squashed in when there is a strong Spain but this only seems logical. lots of other times when Spain is weak Portugal takes up all of eastern Spain.
 
Maybe this is meant to be so, but I've noticed that Portugal always seems to lose its home cities to Spanish cultural expansion. I know that Iberia is a bit cramped. but it doesn't quite seems fair...

Are you sure it's by culture, and not just the Spanish conquering them?
 
Are you sure it's by culture, and not just the Spanish conquering them?

It happens almost every time I play as Portugal. I lose the hill and horses E of Lisboa, and end up unable to produce anything in the homeland. I either have to build a huge army and take down Spain or give up on Portugal and move my capital/centre to Brazil.

PS, Leoreth, I'm getting a crashing bug whenever I start a game of DoC, the game crashes to desktop as soon as I load a civ to play. I have the newest version. Any ideas? It was working until today....
 
Please download the maps I've uploaded the previous page (I didn't manage to upload a fixed rar file yet).
 
I'd still rather visit the Far East first because there are many things that I've already thought through for the region and that are easy to implement. That part of the game has been neglected for too long as well.

I see; so here is a list of suggestion i had for Asia:

1) Change the Chinese spawn location to Xian or Luoyang.
Change the Indian spawn location to pataliputra.( in order to do this u will have to add resources to both cities)

2) For the Chinese in 600 ad, the aim should be to unify China instead of settling. So here is what i think should be done.
-Remove Qufu and add Nanjing which is one tile south east.
-Add Chengdu as an independent city.
-Make the Chinese spawn with less settlers.
-Change their spawn location to Xian; so they settle there. (if u do this; make Beijing an idie that flips to them)
-Add more resources to central China (Xian, Nanjing, Luoyang) and take some resources away from Beijing.
-Intorduce a mechanic where the Chinese capital changes:
Xian in 600 ad (on spawn)
To Nanjing in 1300 ad
To Beijing in 1700 ad onwards

3) Add independent cities along the silk road that eventually flip/get conquered by Mongols ( Kashgar comes to mind)

Some of the harder/debatable ideas that i had:
-Add a Mughal Empire
-Add an Indian respawn (not the Mughals but a rebirth)
-Add a conquerers event for South East Asia and India (this way these regions can be conquered even with the addition of a civ).
-Add a Turkic Civilization in Central Asia; that region is by far underrepresented
 
I've always been waiting for Asia changes! Especially for China, who I feel don't get much attention. Here are my two cents:

1)
Move the Chinese capital to Luoyang, 3S of original Beijing, along with moving Beijing's iron 2S. Moving the wheat 1SW is also nice, giving a resource to improve from the beginning.
Historically, Luoyang is a good choice for ancient China because it was the nearly as commonly used as Xian, and closer to the heartland. Also, in-game Xian is kinda terrible, surrounded by mountains and hills.

Of course, have it change to Beijing automatically sometime after 1400.

2)
The silk road is something that I'm always surprised to see ignored. I hope you'll change that. If I may, I suggest something like this:
attachment.php


-Everything spawns around 200BC-200AD. Compared to the 600AD road, I suggest including the southern section, for historicity/immersion.
-Two new cities, Kashgar (independant) and Dunhuang (barbarian, to avoid conflict with Hun horses), the "tradeoff" points between different cultures.
-They should probably spawn with Great Merchants, and the oasis should be set to be improvable. This would help make the cities more viable. (You could also just add more resources, whatever works).

3)
Expand the Mongol flip zone to what they were at Ghengis Khan's death (1227, close to when the year the flip actually happens). This would include Samarkand, all the Silk road cities, and Northern China. It's a tad deterministic, so they could be probabilistic.

Mongol "conquerers" are probably a good idea. I've experimented with spawning armies of ATTACK_CITY_LEMMING Keshiks at the edges for the AI only, and it works pretty well. The Mongols sometimes just lose these units. Sometimes they absolutely rampage, and fast, since they have 3 moves. Feels like a good balance.

Oh, and have the Mongols automatically move their capital to Beijing in 1300 or so. If the Chinese capture it, the Mongols may well collapse, opening up the way for Russian and Chinese expansion. Then they could respawn to represent modern Mongolia!

4)
For Japan (3000BC), could you lower its settling rate or something? Because the AI makes really ugly city placement choices as time goes on. Or you could move its spawn date later so that it has less time to settle, which historically makes more sense anyhow.

5)
It'd be nice if the Khmer collapse more frequently. I'd like to see more European colors in SE Asia, not a big swath of Khmer covering all of the best cities. I think it'd be easier for the them to colonize this way, only having to deal with disunified natives/independents.
 
I've always been waiting for Asia changes! Especially for China, who I feel don't get much attention. Here are my two cents:

1)
Move the Chinese capital to Luoyang, 3S of original Beijing, along with moving Beijing's iron 2S. Moving the wheat 1SW is also nice, giving a resource to improve from the beginning.
Historically, Luoyang is a good choice for ancient China because it was the nearly as commonly used as Xian, and closer to the heartland. Also, in-game Xian is kinda terrible, surrounded by mountains and hills.

Of course, have it change to Beijing automatically sometime after 1400.
I agree, Luoyang is roughly equal in historical importance and is a much better spot overall (it's even part of my favourite Chinese city setup).

Wouldn't moving the the capital to Beijing only on conquest also work? It became capital of unified China only after the Ming came to power (ignoring the Nanjing episode), so it's fitting and leaves the possibility of an alt-history China that was never conquered.

2)
The silk road is something that I'm always surprised to see ignored. I hope you'll change that. If I may, I suggest something like this:
attachment.php


-Everything spawns around 200BC-200AD. Compared to the 600AD road, I suggest including the southern section, for historicity/immersion.
-Two new cities, Kashgar (independant) and Dunhuang (barbarian, to avoid conflict with Hun horses), the "tradeoff" points between different cultures.
-They should probably spawn with Great Merchants, and the oasis should be set to be improvable. This would help make the cities more viable. (You could also just add more resources, whatever works).
Unfortunately I can't see your image, seems to be something wrong with the attachment ID.

I've considering Kashgar as well, Dunhuang also sounds good.

I don't know what you're going for with the Great Merchants - do you intend them to flip to the Mongols?

3)
Expand the Mongol flip zone to what they were at Ghengis Khan's death (1227, close to when the year the flip actually happens). This would include Samarkand, all the Silk road cities, and Northern China. It's a tad deterministic, so they could be probabilistic.

Mongol "conquerers" are probably a good idea. I've experimented with spawning armies of ATTACK_CITY_LEMMING Keshiks at the edges for the AI only, and it works pretty well. The Mongols sometimes just lose these units. Sometimes they absolutely rampage, and fast, since they have 3 moves. Feels like a good balance.
Definitely. I also agree on the flip, though I'd like to exclude China to leave the challenge.

Oh, and have the Mongols automatically move their capital to Beijing in 1300 or so. If the Chinese capture it, the Mongols may well collapse, opening up the way for Russian and Chinese expansion. Then they could respawn to represent modern Mongolia!
Again, it's probably easier to simply switch the capital on conquest.

4)
For Japan (3000BC), could you lower its settling rate or something? Because the AI makes really ugly city placement choices as time goes on. Or you could move its spawn date later so that it has less time to settle, which historically makes more sense anyhow.
Moving the spawn date is something I wanted to do anyway, it's only low priority though. Are you referring more to the amount of cities or their distance within Japan?

5)
It'd be nice if the Khmer collapse more frequently. I'd like to see more European colors in SE Asia, not a big swath of Khmer covering all of the best cities. I think it'd be easier for the them to colonize this way, only having to deal with disunified natives/independents.
I agree, the Khmer have to die, especially to avoid them profiting from China's lands after their collapse to the Mongols. I don't think this helps the Europeans to conquer there, though.

My currently favoured idea is to spawn a combined force of settlers and military units in the area for the first two civs who build a Trading Company.
 
I agree, Luoyang is roughly equal in historical importance and is a much better spot overall (it's even part of my favourite Chinese city setup).

Wouldn't moving the the capital to Beijing only on conquest also work? It became capital of unified China only after the Ming came to power (ignoring the Nanjing episode), so it's fitting and leaves the possibility of an alt-history China that was never conquered.
I dont think neglecting Xian and Nanjing is a good idea. Even if Xian is not going to be the capital some resources need to be added to the city. As far a Luoyang is concerned; it would be unhistorical to make it the capital in 600 ad start so another alternative is needed. In 600 ad u should add the following cities: Luoyang, Nanjing and Chengdu; this way the chines will have to focus on the unification of their country
 
Unfortunately I can't see your image, seems to be something wrong with the attachment ID.

I've considering Kashgar as well, Dunhuang also sounds good.

I don't know what you're going for with the Great Merchants - do you intend them to flip to the Mongols?

Naaah to be like IRL it just should look like here (woohoo I founded some testing scenarios:lol: don't care about shields on water and 2 food on floodplains)
Spoiler :
sbkoap.jpg
 
My only problem with the Trading Company is that it could be built by someone like china which makes it a bit like the Aztec's getting a conqueror event.
EDIT: i have just managed to get the 1.71 version, thanks for your help Leoreth :D
 
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