depression

GIve me a warning for PDMA, because it was totally legitimate advice . Too many people are coddled today and doped up when they frequently just need a kick in the ass and to be told to get the hell on with their life.
That only means you were never depressed yourself (for which you should be glad :)) and never met anyone who was.

You can't cure someone's depression by telling them to stfu and stop being depressed.

Also, like azza said, emos have nothing to do with depression. They're the "LOOK AT ME I'M SAD" attentionwh- people; whereas people in depressions are ashamed of it and want it to stop and tell very few people if any. (usually, of course)
 
GIve me a warning for PDMA, because it was totally legitimate advice . Too many people are coddled today and doped up when they frequently just need a kick in the ass and to be told to get the hell on with their life.

To add to what everyone else is saying using personal experience, I've been "manning up" now for years and years. The mental illnesses haven't gone, they've just got steadily worse. Plus I get mentally exhausted and physically ill. Really, I wish I knew how to do something other than trying to get on with my life, because I'm damn well near breaking point.
 
People looking for a "valid" reason for depression forgot suffering is a subjective thing. If someone is drepressive he is, it's a fact, doesn't matter is other people find the reason invalid.
It's common for people to not see the difference from depression and one being sad. Saying emos are equivalent to depressed persons is not true (altough the reverse could be).
One having suicidal thoughs rarely would cut his/hers wrists (unless certain it would cause death). The practice got popularized lately and it's is much more an attention seeking thing.
 
Haven suffered from clinical depression and attempted suicide myself, I can say from experience that the two words that you shouldn't say to a depressed person is "man up." It makes them feel alienated and hopeless.

Your friend needs medical attention. Find a psychiatrist. If it's especially serious, convince himself to check into a psychiatric ward. There is no other answer.
 
There's no such thing as a "valid" reason for depression. Its not really a choice.

Telling people to "man up about it" makes you look like an insensitive ass. "Man up" is for suffering the consequences of your actions, or fighting back tears after you scrape your knees. You must learn to use this indictment correctly, if it is to mean anything at all.

There is always a reason for something. But if you seriously turn clinically depressed over something simple (if that is all they're willing to share for why they're depressed), then sorry I can't be sympathetic.

Now, lets say their life has been ravaged by people dying around them, not being good in anything, and just generally getting the short straw, then yes, I will be sympathetic and try to help them.

I'm not saying for the guy to simply "forget" he's depressed. Whenever I "manned up" I was fully aware I was depressed, it's just a matter of fighting through it and regaining your composure and strength. When you're depressed, it's not a "OH CRAP LIFE IS OVER" situation, only if you let it be.
 
In that case, the medical professionals that I went to, which were multiple, are idiots, since a man going for a Bachelors on CFC OT is clearly superior to their official diagnosis. :goodjob:

Yes. downplay the fact that I am learning and being taught by professionals every day, and am already working with profesionals in trial sessions. Your the typical masochist who thinks that depression is just some "thing" that the little punk emo needs to get over. There is a huge difference between a kid wearing eyeliner becuase people jsut dont understand and somebody who is actually severely depressed. Its sad really, the people who act depressed and dress funny to get attention are taking attention away from the people with genuine problems and devaluing them.
 
Yes. downplay the fact that I am learning and being taught by professionals every day, and am already working with profesionals in trial sessions. Your the typical masochist who thinks that depression is just some "thing" that the little punk emo needs to get over. There is a huge difference between a kid wearing eyeliner becuase people jsut dont understand and somebody who is actually severely depressed. Its sad really, the people who act depressed and dress funny to get attention are taking attention away from the people with genuine problems and devaluing them.

Really? And who are you to decide what kind of person I am? I refer you to the post I made above.
 
I'm not saying for the guy to simply "forget" he's depressed. Whenever I "manned up" I was fully aware I was depressed, it's just a matter of fighting through it and regaining your composure and strength. When you're depressed, it's not a "OH CRAP LIFE IS OVER" situation, only if you let it be.

being fully aware of your condition is the first step, no doubt. it is also, probably the hardest one. whatever route you take from then on out is different for everybody, I guess. and yes, there are cyclical depressions. but the choice of words strikes me as funny and I don't quite buy your schtick. "Whenever" you were depressed? how many times are we talking about? 5? 10? 15? 50? methinks you are talking about being depressed, not suffering from depression.
 
being fully aware of your condition is the first step, no doubt. it is also, probably the hardest one. whatever route you take from then on out is different for everybody, I guess. and yes, there are cyclical depressions. but the choice of words strikes me as funny and I don't quite buy your schtick. "Whenever" you were depressed? how many times are we talking about? 5? 10? 15? 50? methinks you are talking about being depressed, not suffering from depression.

I said 'whenever' because it's past tense and not a current condition of mine.
And I do believe the correct number is one.
 
I said 'whenever' because it's past tense and not a current condition of mine.
And I do believe the correct number is one.

aha but that is a big difference in your statement, innit? it is "once, when I felt depressed/sad/suffered from depression I 'manned up'" rather than "whenever I felt depressed/sad/suffered from depression I 'manned up'". the first is a once-occuring event that happened to you and tells the story of how you pulled through it (whatever it was that you suffered from) while the latter sounds very much like general advice.

correct me if I am wrong. non-native speaker and all that.
 
aha but that is a big difference in your statement, innit? it is "once, when I felt depressed/sad/suffered from depression I 'manned up'" rather than "whenever I felt depressed/sad/suffered from depression I 'manned up'". the first is a once-occuring event that happened to you and tells the story of how you pulled through it (whatever it was that you suffered from) while the latter sounds very much like general advice.

correct me if I am wrong. non-native speaker and all that.

I fail to see why a single word is such a big deal when there's something you could actually respond to.
 
I fail to see why a single word is such a big deal when there's something you could actually respond to.

what was I supposed to respond to, then? that "the correct number" is one? elaborate, please.

furthermore, aggree or disaggree that there is a huge difference based on the choice of words, it might have been accidental on your part but we can certainly aggree that words do matter. they are a big deal. "yes" means something different than "no".
 
what was I supposed to respond to, then? that "the correct number" is one? elaborate, please.

furthermore, aggree or disaggree that there is a huge difference based on the choice of words, it might have been accidental on your part but we can certainly aggree that words do matter. they are a big deal. "yes" means something different than "no".

Sure, maybe the word was wrong. I'm human and we all make mistakes.
 
so there was nothing I forgot I "could actually respond to", then, which you complained about? splendid. good night then and I leave with a weird sensation of wtf.
 
There is always a reason for something.

Okay, not a logical reason for pursuing that course.

But if you seriously turn clinically depressed over something simple (if that is all they're willing to share for why they're depressed), then sorry I can't be sympathetic.

Its not a slider, with emo attention seeking being a lesser degree of clinical depression. Depression constitutes a chemical change in the mind, this is why so many depression drugs claim to right the chemical imbalances in the brain.

Now, lets say their life has been ravaged by people dying around them, not being good in anything, and just generally getting the short straw, then yes, I will be sympathetic and try to help them.

Normative bias. Just because you think something is or is not "worthy" of being depressed about doesn't mean that the person being affected by the depression or not thinks that way.

I'm not saying for the guy to simply "forget" he's depressed. Whenever I "manned up" I was fully aware I was depressed, it's just a matter of fighting through it and regaining your composure and strength. When you're depressed, it's not a "OH CRAP LIFE IS OVER" situation, only if you let it be.

Then you were not depressed, as he is, and the situations are not comparable.

You don't seem to grasp the constant helplessness and futility that a depressed person feels by no fault of their own. Its easy for you, on the outside, to stand there and tell him to "man up and quit whining," when you have never experienced this before and cannot possibly understand what he is going through.

To choose a similarly sensitive subject I know will get the point across, it would be like me, who has never lost an immediate family member but having lost friends and more distant relatives, being unable to grasp what you, D. Highland, are going through right now with your father's death, and telling you to "man up" about it. I would be so obviously in the wrong and speaking from ignorance, you would rightfully castigate me for speaking of things I do not know. Such is the case here.
 
Its not a slider, with emo attention seeking being a lesser degree of clinical depression. Depression constitutes a chemical change in the mind, this is why so many depression drugs claim to right the chemical imbalances in the brain.

I was unaware that I claimed for it to be a slider.

Normative bias. Just because you think something is or is not "worthy" of being depressed about doesn't mean that the person being affected by the depression or not thinks that way.

Not really bias. But if somebody falls into a depression (professionally diagnosed) and the best reason they can give is something like "I failed a class", I'm not deeming it as important as someone who actually has an understandable reason(s) for it, such as multiple deaths and constant failures in life.

Then you were not depressed, as he is, and the situations are not comparable.

It's not for you to decide what I was or wasn't. I got depressed to the point of full-out bodily breakdowns and ending up in critical in the hospital a couple times. I felt no urge for anything. I wanted to die but had no urge for suicide. It lasted over six months of constant self-torment like that, of facing the whole "you are in a depression" clinical label.

You don't seem to grasp the constant helplessness and futility that a depressed person feels by no fault of their own. Its easy for you, on the outside, to stand there and tell him to "man up and quit whining," when you have never experienced this before and cannot possibly understand what he is going through.

I grasp it just fine. For the majority of the time I was depressed I felt helpless, and any assistance that was offered came to deaf ears. It was my own will and strength that dragged me out of it and not the bothering of a psychiatrist or something similar.

Really the only difference is that I never thought about suicide, since I always knew I never wanted to actually die.

To choose a similarly sensitive subject I know will get the point across, it would be like me, who has never lost an immediate family member but having lost friends and more distant relatives, being unable to grasp what you, D. Highland, are going through right now with your father's death, and telling you to "man up" about it. I would be so obviously in the wrong and speaking from ignorance, you would rightfully castigate me for speaking of things I do not know. Such is the case here.

It's funny because that is exactly what I did.

Instead of grieving uncontrollably for days and achieving nothing, I took the lead and command of the family and pointed everyone in the right direction. I manned up.

So no, the point did not get across.
 
That only means you were never depressed yourself (for which you should be glad :)) and never met anyone who was.

You can't cure someone's depression by telling them to stfu and stop being depressed.

Also, like azza said, emos have nothing to do with depression. They're the "LOOK AT ME I'M SAD" attentionwh- people; whereas people in depressions are ashamed of it and want it to stop and tell very few people if any. (usually, of course)

Personally, I have struggled with depression, and such advice isn't all that bad. You shouldn't seem insensitive, but I find that when people have a firm "Life goes on." attitude, it helps. When people would try to sympathize with me in the manner others have suggested, in seemed to legitimize my self-pity, putting me deeper into depression. Of course, everybody deals with depression differently, so your best bet would be to encourage him to seek professional help and be willing to be there if necessary.
 
I was unaware that I claimed for it to be a slider.

You didn't physically say it, no, but you seem to think that one is simply a more amplified version of the other, and I'm trying to explain to you that this is not so.
Not really bias. But if somebody falls into a depression (professionally diagnosed) and the best reason they can give is something like "I failed a class", I'm not deeming it as important as someone who actually has an understandable reason(s) for it, such as multiple deaths and constant failures in life.

He didn't blame it purely on failing a class. He said that failing the class had given him a great deal of perspective on the world and his place therein, since failing a class in college is infinitely more serious than failing a class in high school, and that this newly-gained perspective was what drove him into melancholy.

It's not for you to decide what I was or wasn't.

Oh and its for you to decide whether his is or isn't?

I got depressed to the point of full-out bodily breakdowns and ending up in critical in the hospital a couple times. I felt no urge for anything. I wanted to die but had no urge for suicide. It lasted over six months of constant self-torment like that, of facing the whole "you are in a depression" clinical label.

I suspect you have a great lack of introverse perspective, then, to have gone through this yet prove unable to understand when someone else does.

I grasp it just fine. For the majority of the time I was depressed I felt helpless, and any assistance that was offered came to deaf ears. It was my own will and strength that dragged me out of it and not the bothering of a psychiatrist or something similar.

Then you were not depressed but simply in a melancholy. I know, because I have been in both. Will power brought me out of the doldrums, but sheer fate saved me from depression. And there are others who have it far worse than I ever did. I cannot say I envy them one bit.

If you wish to discuss this with someone whose life is practically governed by this, look no further than noncon. I'm sure he'd be happy to talk about his experiences with you.

Really the only difference is that I never thought about suicide, since I always knew I never wanted to actually die.

Well not all depressions lead to suicidal thoughts. I know I never thought about committing suicide, but I did think about how I could do it if I wanted to, and what the result of that would be on the people in my life.

It's funny because that is exactly what I did.

Instead of grieving uncontrollably for days and achieving nothing, I took the lead and command of the family and pointed everyone in the right direction. I manned up.

So no, the point did not get across.

I can see that it did not. I promise you, sacrificing a bit of your humanity now to pretend to be indifferent to your loss with come back to get you later. Its really no different from someone in Vietnam, for example, manning up when their squadmate died, even making jokes about it, because they had to to save their sanity, but they broke down later when they came back to the states, if they were lucky enough to make it that far. Some just shot themselves there. Others never did break down, and remained shells of their former selves, unable to cope with their experiences.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that Vulcan-like suppression of emotion to your very core makes you more the man, or that its psychologically healthy. As they say, Big Boys don't cry, but Men aren't afraid to.
 
You didn't physically say it, no, but you seem to think that one is simply a more amplified version of the other, and I'm trying to explain to you that this is not so.

There are most definitely more amplified versions of depressions than others.

He didn't blame it purely on failing a class. He said that failing the class had given him a great deal of perspective on the world and his place therein, since failing a class in college is infinitely more serious than failing a class in high school, and that this newly-gained perspective was what drove him into melancholy.

Lots of people fail a class in college. It's a "lick your wounds" situation. Perhaps he could have done something better in the class rather than party every weekend, study harder for the final exam, etc etc. But if it's his own fault he failed, why whine and get depressed?

if it was entirely out of his control and it almost seemed "ripped" out of him, the course, then yes, maybe there is a good reason for depression, especially if it was an essential course for your work field.

Oh and its for you to decide whether his is or isn't?

I never said he was or wasn't depressed. People can get depressed with a slight change in their chemical balance rather than something occurring in their life.

I suspect you have a great lack of introverse perspective, then, to have gone through this yet prove unable to understand when someone else does.

I understand just fine. But being stubborn and saying that you can't pull yourself out of a depression is ignorant. I'm sure there are several people who have gotten out of a severe depression to the extent of bodily issues through their own mental capabilities. It's not all "OH DEARY ME, I MUST TAKE PILLS AND GO TO A PSYCHIATRIST".

Then you were not depressed but simply in a melancholy. I know, because I have been in both. Will power brought me out of the doldrums, but sheer fate saved me from depression. And there are others who have it far worse than I ever did. I cannot say I envy them one bit.

I doubt you have better credentials than qualified psychiatrists and pediatricians who specialize in psychology.

Do note that everybody's mind is different. Some may be capable of mental will, some may not. Which is why all advice should be given.

Well not all depressions lead to suicidal thoughts. I know I never thought about committing suicide, but I did think about how I could do it if I wanted to, and what the result of that would be on the people in my life.

Same here. At the time though, I always thought "nobody would care". Now I kinda realize that some people would indeed care and probably be quite traumatized.

I can see that it did not. I promise you, sacrificing a bit of your humanity now to pretend to be indifferent to your loss with come back to get you later. Its really no different from someone in Vietnam, for example, manning up when their squadmate died, even making jokes about it, because they had to to save their sanity, but they broke down later when they came back to the states, if they were lucky enough to make it that far. Some just shot themselves there. Others never did break down, and remained shells of their former selves, unable to cope with their experiences.

I am not indifferent to my loss. I realize my loss, I accepted my loss, and I followed through with what my dad would have wanted me to do after he was gone. Is that sacrificing my humanity? Perhaps, but I'm guessing that's a worthy sacrifice to make my father proud.

I am coping just fine with my father's death. I spend every day doing the things I used to do with him, such as cleaning the car, playing some hockey on the PS3, watching movies, eating breakfast. Sometimes it is a nice memory, sometimes it tears a hole. But you have to move on in life and keep pushing instead of falling right where you're standing and making it extra difficult to stand back up.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that Vulcan-like suppression of emotion to your very core makes you more the man, or that its psychologically healthy. As they say, Big Boys don't cry, but Men aren't afraid to.

I used plenty emotions upon the death of my dad. Anger, sadness, despair, all bunched into one nice big pile. It's a matter of sorting through it and finding strength off of it.

Just as a note, the Vulcans were some of the most emotional people in Star Trek, since we're heading into that direction anyways.
 
Lots of people fail a class in college. It's a "lick your wounds" situation. Perhaps he could have done something better in the class rather than party every weekend, study harder for the final exam, etc etc. But if it's his own fault he failed, why whine and get depressed?

It's not a choice to be depressed.

I understand just fine. But being stubborn and saying that you can't pull yourself out of a depression is ignorant. I'm sure there are several people who have gotten out of a severe depression to the extent of bodily issues through their own mental capabilities. It's not all "OH DEARY ME, I MUST TAKE PILLS AND GO TO A PSYCHIATRIST".

I doubt you have better credentials than qualified psychiatrists and pediatricians who specialize in psychology.

Do note that everybody's mind is different. Some may be capable of mental will, some may not. Which is why all advice should be given.

It is exponentially harder to "pull yourself out of depression" to the point where it's almost impossible for most without help.
 
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