DoC Alternate History modmod Brainstorming Thread

I think that Christianity would not develop at all without Rome. In Matthew, it was Caesar Augustus who called the census, causing Mary and Joseph to go to Bethlehem. Without that, Christianity would not exist OR at least be very different.

I vote for Druidism, Roman mythos, Greek Mythos, Egyptian mythos and Phoniciean Mythos.
 
For now, in order to ensure the growth of Europe, I will have Greece, Carthage, Ethiopia, and Seleucid Persia be Orthodox. However, if it is possible, and if I can learn to mod it in, I will probably make the Apostolic Palace dynamic depending on religion and add dynamic Orthodoxy and Protestantism.
 
Suggestions


500 A.D.

Carthage-
  • Fairly stable and well established, but still shaky
  • Controls Italy up to Rome, has Africa from Tripoli to Morocco but not having indie Marrakesh, Iberia includes Cordoba and Valencia, Phonecia has Tyre and maybe Jerusalem and/or Cyprus
  • Facing small, but organized resistance from Romans in Northern Italy, who might have a presence in Croatia or Marseille
  • Carthage (City) has Cothon, A.P. (but Orthodox w/out Holy City moving), and possibly Colossus. Rome has: Colosseum, [insert other wonder here]
  • Civ has advanced techs that compare to almost what most Euros start with, but has fairly large upkeep costs and medium research speed
  • Moors conditionally spawn at Marrakesh with large SoD
  • Smaller army, based mainly in Roma and Carthage
  • UHV 1: Control all of Italy, Spain, and Morocco in 1200 A.D.
  • UHV 2: Control the most cultured city in the world in 950 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Be the most advanced civ in 950 A.D.

Greece-
  • Large civ, backwards and unstable
  • Controls Greece, Albania, Asia Minor, the Caucasus, Mesopotamia, Jerusalem if Carthage doesn't, Constantinople, vassal Byzantines in Romania, possibly Crete
  • Has to battle multiple, but unorganized barbarians for now before Arab spawn
  • Athens has: Oracle, Temple of Art. Parthenon. Appolonia has: SoZ. Babylon has: Ishtar, H. Gardens
  • Most basic early medieval techs, but HUGE maintenance costs and sluggish research.
  • Very Large army, but a tad stretched thin, largely in Babylon, Jerusalem, and Constantinople
  • Friendly with Carthage
  • Should be taken over by Turks
  • UHV 1: Control Egypt and Cyrene by 850 A.D
  • UHV 2: No cities lost to Arabs or barbs by 1000 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Honestly not sure

Byzantines-
  • Small, centered in Constanta
  • Vassal to Greece, has Romania, Bosnia
  • Constanta is the Holy Orthodox city, has Hagia Sophia
  • Good research modifier, sort of a tech cow for Greece
  • Wants Roman Croatia
  • UHV 1: Be the first to discover Liberalism, Education and Printing Press
  • UHV 2: Control Kiev, The Black Sea (Three cities), and the entire Balkan peninsula (except Greece) by 1200 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Make sure Orthodoxy is the largest religion in 1600 A.D.

My Ideas so far
 
Few questions for random:

500 A.D.
Do you plan for Greece and Seleucid Persia to be allies?
Where should the Catholic holy area be? I was personally thinking Ethiopia would be a good place to be.
Are the Celts going to ally with Carthage?
Will Greece and Carthage be allies?
 
East asian colonial empires: China is divided in North Dynasty (Jing empire) and south dynasty (Song empire). Mongols, Jings, Songs, Koreans, Japanese, Indonesians and Thais build colonial empires:
*Mongols build an empire which extend from Siberia to Russia (replace the Russians).
*Japan replaces England (they get conquerors against 3 French cities)
*Song replaces France (they get conquerors against 1 Spanish city)
*Jing replaces Spain (they get a settler in England, England doesn't spawn).
*Koreans replace Portugal: They get conquerors against Sanaa, Congo, Corunia/Santiago, Nitharos, Jerusalem, Brest and Rome (or Cathrage if the first scenario is implemented).
*Thais replace Netherlands: Control five wine resources by 1775 AD.
*Indonesians replace holy rome: Do nothing :lol:.
*Incas and Brazilians switch roles. (Peruvians spawn on 1850 AD and Brazilians are the poor indians that are discovered by the caravels).
*Prussia spawns in Indonesia in 1700AD. On spawn Prussian become the "indonesians" and Indonesians the "Austrians" :lol: (HRE is the German in this scenario).
*Spain doesn't spawn. France controls both France and Spain instead. (And replaces China in scenario terms).

Not a good time period to jump off from.
Two better starting points would be:
1. If the Song complete their transition into an industrialized society.
2. Overdone, but the Ming treasure fleet period.
This requires some logical chain of events, like a Ming show of force via fleet against surrounding non-tributary nations, like the Aceh Sultunate or Japan.
Those countries, not being in the Ming sphere could be spurred to build up navies as well, in part in response to seeing the profit derived from Ming overseas expeditions.
I would need to go into more detail but that's the basic summary of this.

And Thailand or Mongolia won't have a chance to do this. I'm sorry.
Japan & Indonesia have the geographical positioning to do so and Corea has an opportunity to play a smaller colonizing role, as an analogue to Portugal or any of the lower-tier colonizers.

If we assume that East Asians are colonizing Europe from the west,
then why would France serve as a Chinese analogue?
That would be more apt of a role for a Holy Roman Empire or united Italy or even a still-kicking Byzantine Empire.
 
Another good scenario would be if China, instead of going all isolationist, focused on trade after the voyages of Zhang He. Lots of wealth and technology, and possibly no PRC due to no foreign domination because of good trading relations with Euros.
 
Not a good time period to jump off from.
Two better starting points would be:
1. If the Song complete their transition into an industrialized society.
2. Overdone, but the Ming treasure fleet period.
This requires some logical chain of events, like a Ming show of force via fleet against surrounding non-tributary nations, like the Aceh Sultunate or Japan.
Those countries, not being in the Ming sphere could be spurred to build up navies as well, in part in response to seeing the profit derived from Ming overseas expeditions.
I would need to go into more detail but that's the basic summary of this.

And Thailand or Mongolia won't have a chance to do this. I'm sorry.
Japan & Indonesia have the geographical positioning to do so and Corea has an opportunity to play a smaller colonizing role, as an analogue to Portugal or any of the lower-tier colonizers.

If we assume that East Asians are colonizing Europe from the west,
then why would France serve as a Chinese analogue?
That would be more apt of a role for a Holy Roman Empire or united Italy or even a still-kicking Byzantine Empire.

The starting point would be that Zheng Ho discovers America and the Ming a Emperor (as well as the Japanese and Korean emperors) send colonists over. They would wipe out the natives, and by 1600, the Pacific Coast would be dotted with colonies with the Atlantic Seaboard still empty (even the Caribbean).

Also, Asia would not colonize Europe or anything crazy like that.

Few questions for random:

500 A.D.
Do you plan for Greece and Seleucid Persia to be allies?
Where should the Catholic holy area be? I was personally thinking Ethiopia would be a good place to be.
Are the Celts going to ally with Carthage?
Will Greece and Carthage be allies?

1. Yes, Greece will be alive, and (not Seleucid) Persia will be a vassal of Greece if neither Greece nor Persia is controlled by the player.
2. Both the Catholic and Orthodox holy cities will be in Carthage.
3. The Celts will still be a minor civ.
4. No. They will be neutral.

Suggestions


500 A.D.

Carthage-
  • Fairly stable and well established, but still shaky
  • Controls Italy up to Rome, has Africa from Tripoli to Morocco but not having indie Marrakesh, Iberia includes Cordoba and Valencia, Phonecia has Tyre and maybe Jerusalem and/or Cyprus
  • Facing small, but organized resistance from Romans in Northern Italy, who might have a presence in Croatia or Marseille
  • Carthage (City) has Cothon, A.P. (but Orthodox w/out Holy City moving), and possibly Colossus. Rome has: Colosseum, [insert other wonder here]
  • Civ has advanced techs that compare to almost what most Euros start with, but has fairly large upkeep costs and medium research speed
  • Moors conditionally spawn at Marrakesh with large SoD
  • Smaller army, based mainly in Roma and Carthage
  • UHV 1: Control all of Italy, Spain, and Morocco in 1200 A.D.
  • UHV 2: Control the most cultured city in the world in 950 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Be the most advanced civ in 950 A.D.

Greece-
  • Large civ, backwards and unstable
  • Controls Greece, Albania, Asia Minor, the Caucasus, Mesopotamia, Jerusalem if Carthage doesn't, Constantinople, vassal Byzantines in Romania, possibly Crete
  • Has to battle multiple, but unorganized barbarians for now before Arab spawn
  • Athens has: Oracle, Temple of Art. Parthenon. Appolonia has: SoZ. Babylon has: Ishtar, H. Gardens
  • Most basic early medieval techs, but HUGE maintenance costs and sluggish research.
  • Very Large army, but a tad stretched thin, largely in Babylon, Jerusalem, and Constantinople
  • Friendly with Carthage
  • Should be taken over by Turks
  • UHV 1: Control Egypt and Cyrene by 850 A.D
  • UHV 2: No cities lost to Arabs or barbs by 1000 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Honestly not sure

Byzantines-
  • Small, centered in Constanta
  • Vassal to Greece, has Romania, Bosnia
  • Constanta is the Holy Orthodox city, has Hagia Sophia
  • Good research modifier, sort of a tech cow for Greece
  • Wants Roman Croatia
  • UHV 1: Be the first to discover Liberalism, Education and Printing Press
  • UHV 2: Control Kiev, The Black Sea (Three cities), and the entire Balkan peninsula (except Greece) by 1200 A.D.
  • UHV 3: Make sure Orthodoxy is the largest religion in 1600 A.D.

My Ideas so far

1. No new UHV goals.
2. Carthaginian cities (I think at this point) will be:
Carthage (big, has most buildings, has Cothon, Colosseum, and Apostolic Palace),
Some Algerian city (medium),
Marrakesh (small, same as 600 AD),
Syracuse or a city in Southern Italy,
Nova Carthago (medium),
Some Libyan city (small),
Lastly, Sur.
In terms of technology, Carthage will not have Feudalism, but otherwise be on Euro tier.

3. Greek cities (probably) will be:
Babylon (capital, with Hanging Gardens, Ishtar Gate, and most buildings),
Athens (has Oracle, the Colossus, and the Pantheon b/c Rome will be burnt down),
Epirus (or whatever that city SE of the copper is, medium sized and has obsolete Statue of Zeus),
Miletos (2S 1E of Byzantion, has Temple of Artemis, medium sized),
Trapezon (small),
Jerusalem (medium with Temple of Solomon),
Lastly, possibly Shush (small)

In terms of tech, Greece will have roughly the same amount if techs as Carthage and will be just as unstable.

4. No Byzantines.

Additionally, the following civs will be included:
China
Persia (vassal of Greece, has Parsa, Shush if Greece doesn't, and some border city)
India (tech leader)
Tamils
Ethiopia
Korea
Mayans
 
It's not too absurd of an idea, it just depends on how its handled.

I think that if all goes well, the Asian civs will meet the Euros as part of colonization.
 
I'm done with all of the coding except for the physical WB stuff. When I run the map, there are no errors, but the game crashes as soon as I start the scenario...

Does anybody know what the problem might be?
 
Cassini maps for this modmodmod???
 
Simply change all stability map setting as follows:

1. Change all historical area to foreign area,
2. Undo all scripted colony-founding for all civs. Civs found colony at their will.
3. Any cities with 10+ culture and above 95% nationality become historical area for that civ.
4. Any cities with developed culture and above 80% nationality become historical area for that civ.
5. Cities with more than 2 nationalities of 20% become contested area.
6. Cities with refined culture and summer palace(or some wonders) become core area.
7. Cities with legendary culture become core area.
8. Let's see how it goes.
 
Simply change all stability map setting as follows:

1. Change all historical area to foreign area,
2. Undo all scripted colony-founding for all civs. Civs found colony at their will.
3. Any cities with 10+ culture and above 95% nationality become historical area for that civ.
4. Any cities with developed culture and above 80% nationality become historical area for that civ.
5. Cities with more than 2 nationalities of 20% become contested area.
6. Cities with refined culture and summer palace(or some wonders) become core area.
7. Cities with legendary culture become core area.
8. Let's see how it goes.

I like how you think. However, Dynamic Stability Maps will probably have to wait a while until I finish with the scenarios (and finding out where the errors are).
 
If dynamic stability maps are too difficult to make you could convert all foreign tiles into contested area. (Maybe I´m wrong and this is even more difficult)
 
Awaiting download link. :D

I am having some debugging problems. Also, unless you have an emulator, I don't think you will be able to play this on Mac.
 
Dynamic stability would definitely be excellent for an alternative history game. It would encourage me to raze cities though, since that is the easiest way to eliminate culture from a region.
 
If dynamic stability maps are too difficult to make you could convert all foreign tiles into contested area. (Maybe I´m wrong and this is even more difficult)

Not possible- contested means historical but with a foreign core. So unless you want to cover the entire map with cores and essentially make the entire map historical for everyone...
 
The 500 AD Scenario is nearl ready! I just have to work out a few minor kinks relating to interface and communications and after that I will hopefully have this uploaded onto Sourceforge or SVN for all of you ruthlessly treated and under appreciated slaves err... I mean... guinea pigs oh wait... I meant to say loyal and devoted playtesters the entire time!;)

Anyway, 500 AD should be up tomorrow and then I will start working on 1000 AD.

Until then, discuss your 1000 AD ideas!
 
Back
Top Bottom