Homeschooling German family granted US asylum

[Karalysia]

Education is a right. That's why we require compulsory education in the first place. If education wasn't recognized as a right then we would make it entirely voluntary. Which it isn't.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

Sorry. I just thought it was a funny joke.

(Wait. On the other hand, how do we know the Constitution-writing people didn't mean Americans have the legal right to take the paws off bears and keep them?)

 

[kulade]

*bear arms. You have a right to bear arms!

 

[Karalysia]

*bear arms. You have a right to bear arms!

http://www.kossan.se/roliga-filmer/family_guy_the_right_to_bear_arms.htm

 

[Ulyaoth]

Education is a right. That's why we require compulsory education in the first place. If education wasn't recognized as a right then we would make it entirely voluntary. Which it isn't.

Right =/= compulsory. Then we'd require everyone to own guns. Which wouldn't be a bad idea really, Switzerland gets along fine with everyone knowing how to use guns.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

Switzerland ≠ U.S.

 

[Ulyaoth]

Yes, I'm aware, I'm saying we should make it! Imagine, a giant Switzerland? It'd be remarkable. A true utopia on Earth.

 

[Quackers]

Yes, I'm aware, I'm saying we should make it! Imagine, a giant Switzerland? It'd be remarkable. A true utopia on Earth.

Not a minaret in sight

 

[scherbchen]

You have a right to bare arms

no (chars and all)

 

[warpus]

I don't want to get into an argument about the education the homeschooling provides. I just object to the state taking away the very reasonable right for parents to teach there own children how they see fit.

And c'mon your arguments are over the top. When i studied chemistry at 15 it wsa dumbed down and a lot of it was untrue. When I got to study it at A-level it got far more indepth and I slowly realised the previous things I taught were only half truths and were partly made up for the conveniance of teaching it. I don't think the transition from homeschooling and learning about creationism to learning about evolution at college is difficult.

The transition would be easy if you assumed that your parents were full of crap from the get go.

Listen, education is a right, in most of the first world at least (Texas excluded, I guess). I don't think parents should be able to take that away from a child by teaching them garbage instead.

 

[warpus]

*bear arms. You have a right to bear arms!

Germans view this as a privilege, not a right. They also view education as a right, not a privilege.

 

[willemvanoranje]

Maybe he was talking about arms as in heraldry / coats of arms (not uncommonly refered to as arms)

Right =/= compulsory. Then we'd require everyone to own guns.

You take the wrong perspective. It is compulsory to ensure that parents do not step on the right to education.

 

[Ulyaoth]

Education is education, they are being educated, thus their right upheld. Stop with this crap that they're being deprived. The quality does not factor into them cashing in on their right.

 

[warpus]

Education is education, they are being educated, thus their right upheld. Stop with this crap that they're being deprived. The quality does not factor into them cashing in on their right.

A pointed stick is a weapon too. Maybe a bit harder to defend against, but a weapon nevertheless.

 

[willemvanoranje]

Ulyaoth, have you been homeschooled too or something?

 

[Ulyaoth]

If you'll read my first post in the topic, which was the first reply, you'll see that I believe homeschooling is stupid. It deprives kids of the necessary struggles and social interactions needed to get kids ready for the world.

 

[Quackers]

The transition would be easy if you assumed that your parents were full of crap from the get go.

huh? So you don't think it will disqualify the homeschooled from biology and geopraphy?

Listen, education is a right, in most of the first world at least (Texas excluded, I guess). I don't think parents should be able to take that away from a child by teaching them garbage instead.

I don't think that homeschoolers will teach there children garbage. First of all why would you teach your child deliberate lies to ruin there chances at a good job in the future? Only the most evil parents would ever do that. I don't think creationism falls under this tag.

If your homeschooling a kid and he wants to go to college you'll have to work towards a specific exam to get into a college - so you'll stick to well defined cirriculum you won't be just teaching them Bible stories all the time.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I think that the denial of parents to choose an appropreate education for there children is undemocratic. Maybe homeschooling isn't as good as state education or maybe the kids wil indoctrinated with creationism rubbish but this is irrelevent it is about choice and Germany thinks its parents are too stupid to make the right choice.

Maybe Germany is afraid the parents might raise the spectre of neo-Nazism in the wrong way? (just speculating)

Or maybe Germany chooses not to make resources available to parents who homeschool their kids. It's too bad that there has to be such a black/white divide over this issue, but it's certainly not any reason to expect political asylum from another country!

I think the only things not covered are things, as it says in the article, not consistent with the Church. So what is that? No Sex-ed and no evolution and no Earth is over millions of years old. Not exactly inadquete - incomplete maybe but plenty of kids in the West go to awful schools with poor records of achievement especially in the inner city and these would all be worse options than homeschooling.

You don't need homeschooling to eliminate sex education and evolution from your curriculum - just move to Alberta and make sure your parents are ignorant bigots who are ALLOWED to pull their kids out of any classes that teach these things - because they conflict with the PARENTS' ideas of what is Good, Right, and Proper for their kids to know.

We didn't defeat authoritarianism, we just defeated rival tyrants. And in America plenty of liberals also want to ban any non government schools. I see it being branded about all the time that private schools and homeschooling breed 'intolerance' and such things and must be banned to move 'forward'

...

Homeschooling is stupid.

Okay... I'm going to say that homeschooling is not stupid. My dad was largely homeschooled, because when he was growing up he lived out in the bush, too far from anywhere to go to regular school. It wasn't any religious reason - in fact, my grandfather was atheist. It was simply a matter of necessity, back in the '40s. And my dad turned out pretty smart for a guy with a Grade 8 education, who was taught to read, write, and do math by his mother, and how to earn a living by his father and grandfather.

By the time I started school, I could already read. My mother and grandmother taught me. I could also print and do some arithmetic. I was never formally homeschooled, but it would have been less stressful in a lot of ways.

I don't have kids, but if I had, I'd probably have chosen to homeschool them. Since I'm weak in math, they would have a tutor - same for any other subject I didn't feel confident enough to teach them. And yes, I have had some teacher's training. But even so, there are so many frivolous aspects to the education system, that I really despair when I think of the coming generations and what they haven't been taught. And by the way - yes, you could consider me a "liberal" - at least as Canadians understand the term - and any kid I homeschooled would definitely learn about evolution, sex education, AND a comparative study of various world religions.

You have a right to bare arms

You mean Americans have the right to wear short sleeves?!

That's what I thought it meant, too!

 

[Cutlass]

 

[warpus]

huh? So you don't think it will disqualify the homeschooled from biology and geopraphy?

If they really believe the things their parents teach them, and if that includes that the world is 6,000 years old, then they'll have a hard time understanding the concepts behind modern biology and the other disciplines that I described.

And if they don't even accept the crap their parents teach them, why insist on homeschooling anyway?

I don't think that homeschoolers will teach there children garbage. First of all why would you teach your child deliberate lies to ruin there chances at a good job in the future? Only the most evil parents would ever do that. I don't think creationism falls under this tag.

But creationism is garbage.

And no, I don't think parents would (usually) teach their children something that they think is garbage.. most people aren't evil like that. The thing is that most parents aren't professional teachers, don't know a lot of the material (how can you specialize in a dozen different disciplines?), and as such are more likely to unwillingly teach their children garbage.. such as in this case.

If your homeschooling a kid and he wants to go to college you'll have to work towards a specific exam to get into a college - so you'll stick to well defined cirriculum you won't be just teaching them Bible stories all the time.

Yeah, but say that this college exam is biology. The kid wants to be a research biologists, working with bacteria, looking for cures. A proper understanding of the theory of evolution would be vital in that case.