Is Britain about to leave the EU?

[Dachs]

Of course the Americans would say you are evil. j/k

the hell does this even mean

keep us out of your little family squabble

 

[Mega Tsunami]

Poll update:
Quite close, with an apparent swing for Remain since the death of Jo Cox.
The Observer/Guardian has it 44-44; The Sunday Times 44-43 for Remain and the Mail 45-42 for Remain.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...es-country-undecided-ahead-EU-referendum.html

Quite interesting is that the Mail on Sunday has come out today for Remain!

Edit:
Here is a better summary of the various polls out today

 

[really]

Jeremy Corbyn on Andrew Marr - I think this is the first time I have heard him speak about anything.

Talking about solidarity etc.

 

[14thwarrior]

the hell does this even mean

keep us out of your little family squabble

It was a joke. I was actually thinking about the turd sandwich and vaginal douche episode of Southpark where that rapper tries to gun down the non voters at the time.

Sorry if you took it the wrong way but I did put j/k on the end to show I was clearly just messing about.

In future I will keep you out of my "family" squabble, which is more with the Dutch who are of course much more evil, at least according to Austin Power's dad.

 

[FriendlyFire]

I hope the british people vote to leave the EU. Yes, it will be harder for the first country to leave, but Britain doesn't use the euro and it is in a far better position than we were if we left not giving in to the blackmail last year. If Britain leaves now, other countries will leave in the near future. In the analogous referendum here there is no way we would vote to remain in the current state of the european "union"

And to think Britain is leaving is because it is against BAILING OUT GREECE all the time. Along with Greece policy of inviting waves of refugees into the EU that everyone no longer wants.
You dug your own hole even deeper when Greece decided it would confront the EU and default to the IMF. So the EU made an example of Greece, next time dont bite the hand that feeds supports you.

It would be the height of irony for Britain to leave the EU, over immigration and economic bailouts.

 

[Takhisis]

What?

 

[Agent327]

It would be the height of irony for Britain to leave the EU, over immigration and economic bailouts.

Hypocrisy seems a better word here. The UK never signed the Schengen agreement (so there is no free movement between the UK and EU signatories), and I don't recall bail out ever having been a topic in the yay/nay Brexit discussion. (Possibly because the UK hasn't exactly massively contributed to any bail outs.)

 

[really]

Britain, Sweden and Denmark contributed to the Irish bailout voluntarily.

And about a quarter of the bailout money given to British banks went to cover losses in their Irish divisions (Ulsterbank is part of RBS and Bank of Scotland Ireland)

 

[Arwon]

As somebody who thinks Brexit will be bad for England I'm torn about whether it's a good idea or not.

 

[classical_hero]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3649655/How-Brussels-spends-money-grows-trees-devastating-dispatch-reveal-Eurocrats-live-life-staggering-excess-10-000-earn-PM-s-150-000-taking-decisions-affect-lives-secret.html

Just take the wage bill of the 47,000 people who work inside the bubble. Since 2010, it has been British policy to disclose the number of government officials earning more than our Prime Minister, who gets paid just shy of £150,000. In Britain, the latest figure stands at 319.

And the equivalent number for the EU? According to documents leaked ahead of the last European elections two years ago, EU tax perks mean that at least 10,000 EU employees are taking home more than David Cameron.

Many are mere middle managers. Among the extra perks are the £240 monthly allowance for stay-at-home spouses and the £100-a-month allowance per child. On top of that, European taxpayers spend an estimated £80 million each year in school fees for Eurocrats' children.

You need not spend long in the palace of pointlessness that is the European Parliament to sense the institutional arrogance of this entire project.

If the Brits are fine with such value for money then sure it would be good for a them to stay but if I were in the same situation I would be voting to get out.


Link to video.
But I think the worst thing is the fact that you don't have a right to redress grievances, which was a right introduced with the Magna Carta and has now been removed by joining the EU. The fat that some industries ave been destroyed by EU policies that you have to wonder why anyone would willing join up the way they treat ordinary people.

Wasn't it Winner or someone who used to be here call the EU the EUSSR? The way it is set up right now it certainly does have that feel and past history shows that to be so also, since it has ignored the democratic will of the people time and time again.

 

[Takhisis]

As somebody who thinks Brexit will be bad for England I'm torn about whether it's a good idea or not.

What about the rest of the UK?

 

[Arwon]

Presumably they'll all end up back in the EU fairly quickly.

My optimal model also involves the Free City of London as an EU enclave. A man can dream I guess.

 

[FriendlyFire]

What?

Three main Brexit issues

1) Pro Immigration policy of the EU
2) Austerity and Bailout Monetary policy of the EU
3) Political Influence on EU Policy (dominated by France+Germany bloc)

3 is kinda strange because all it would take to derail ANY EU policy would be for one EU country to Fail to pass it through thats own countries parliament.
For example a small country like Finland or even Tiny Estonia could veto Bailout for Greece.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

3 is kinda strange because all it would take to derail ANY EU policy would be for one EU country to Fail to pass it through thats own countries parliament.
For example a small country like Finland or even Tiny Estonia could veto Bailout for Greece.

That's not how the EU works. If you refuse to pass a EU policy you're not vetoing anything, you're just violating a treaty.

 

[Tahuti]

That's not how the EU works. If you refuse to pass a EU policy you're not vetoing anything, you're just violating a treaty.

If the US breaks a treaty, American celebrities threaten to immigrate to Canada.

If Israel breaks a treaty, you'll be accussed of antisemitism.

If the UK breaks a treaty, Jimmy Savile's corpse will rise from the grave and molest your children!

 

[Agent327]

Three main Brexit issues

1) Pro Immigration policy of the EU
2) Austerity and Bailout Monetary policy of the EU
3) Political Influence on EU Policy (dominated by France+Germany bloc)

1 doesn't really apply, as the UK has never signed the Schengen Treaty regarding free movement. 2 has been agreed to by the British government. So, once again, not a Brexit issue. 3 is indeed kind of strange as a Brexit would only enhance that.

What is confusing to me is that Euroskeptics accuse the EU of being undemocratic, and see leaving the EU as a solution to that. It obviously isn't. Similarly, the EU is squandering money and the solution to that should be to leave the EU. So the solution is giving up on a solution? It's hard to follow this kind of emotional logic.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3649655/How-Brussels-spends-money-grows-trees-devastating-dispatch-reveal-Eurocrats-live-life-staggering-excess-10-000-earn-PM-s-150-000-taking-decisions-affect-lives-secret.html

If the Brits are fine with such value for money then sure it would be good for a them to stay but if I were in the same situation I would be voting to get out.

But I think the worst thing is the fact that you don't have a right to redress grievances, which was a right introduced with the Magna Carta and has now been removed by joining the EU. The fat that some industries ave been destroyed by EU policies that you have to wonder why anyone would willing join up the way they treat ordinary people.

Wasn't it Winner or someone who used to be here call the EU the EUSSR? The way it is set up right now it certainly does have that feel and past history shows that to be so also, since it has ignored the democratic will of the people time and time again.

Once again, the EU was never set up as a democratic project to begin with. The present EU resulted from various treaties between governments. So, if the present day EU is perceived as undemocratic you should look at your own governments who agreed to such developments.

I'm not sure what the Magna Carta has to do with anything. It was abrogated by the king as soon as he could. (And then retried, and abrogated again. And so on and so forth.) It also was entirely focused on people of nobility. You know, those people who have reserved seats in the English House of Lords.

Britain, Sweden and Denmark contributed to the Irish bailout voluntarily.

And about a quarter of the bailout money given to British banks went to cover losses in their Irish divisions (Ulsterbank is part of RBS and Bank of Scotland Ireland)

I've no clue why bail outs would not be voluntary.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Ok it seems I was wrong as only some EU policies require unanimity
With EU so slow with its decision making they are now moving to majority vote requiring a majority in both member votes and Majority in population totals of Member states to pass.

In theory Tiny Estonia would have veto power only over EU policies requiring unanimity.
Otherwise majority vote

Voting in the Council of the European Union

This section presents the former qualified majority voting systems employed in the Council of the European Union, and its predecessor institutions. While some policy areas require unanimity among Council members, for selected policy areas qualified majority voting has existed right from the start. All major treaties have shifted some policy areas from unanimity to qualified majority voting.

Article 16 of the "Treaty on European Union",[21] as amended by the Treaty of Lisbon, stipulates that the Council voting arrangements of the Nice Treaty applied until 31 October 2014. Moreover, until 31 March 2017, any member state can request that the Nice rules are used for a particular vote

Germany had demanded that its greater population be reflected in a higher vote weighting in the Council; this was opposed by France, who insisted that the symbolic parity between France and Germany be maintained. The Commission had proposed to replace the old weighted voting system with a double majority system which would require those voting in favour to represent a majority of both member states and population for a proposal to be approved.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voting_in_the_Council_of_the_European_Union

 

[GoodSarmatian]

If the US breaks a treaty, American celebrities threaten to immigrate to Canada.

If Israel breaks a treaty, you'll be accussed of antisemitism.

If the UK breaks a treaty, Jimmy Savile's corpse will rise from the grave and molest your children!

The point is that if the rest goes ahead with the decision you're not vetoing. It might not have any negative consequences for you but you prevented nothing.

 

[Kyriakos]

Any final polls?

 

[HAND]

Any final polls?

On the BBC's poll of polls, it's 45% Remain, 44% Leave, 11% Undecided/Don't know. There will probably be a last flurry of opinion polls taken today and reporting tonight.

There will be no exit polls tomorrow and the first indication of the result will probably emerge 5-6am GMT on Friday.