Libertarians

[Cutlass]

I agree with this, Ziggers.

In addition, I would say that, like freedom, libertarianism is not something that can be imposed from above.

It's a movement that demands absolute responsibility from all (adult) members of society.

It's a paradigm shift in consciousness; not a political movement.

(Or something along those lines, anyway.)

That's really the issue. As long as not all people are perfect socialists, libertarian society cannot succeed. If even 1% of people put their own immediate interest above the community interest, the situation will come apart at the seems. You need the Amish. You need a community with very little in the way of individualism and very tight community conformity. And even then you need to be able to exile those that do not do exactly what is expected of them at all times.

And for the population at large, you're just never going to get that.

 

[Traitorfish]

This all seems to hinge on a highly idealistic and individualistic ontology which I don't think we can simply assume. Perhaps it works in contesting libertarian claims, because they begin with pretty much the same ontology, but it's not a safe basis to make general declarations about society.

At the very least, I would tend to think that declaring your entitlement to kill people who do things you don't like requires some sort of philosophical rigour.

 

[strijder20]

It may surprise you but I agree with this. The courts is one of the legitimate duties of government.

What do you mean with 'legitimate'?

 

[Hygro]

What do you mean with 'legitimate'?

Some courts, they just government easily.

 

[illram]

Some courts, they just government easily.

If it's an illegitimate government, the courts have a way to try to shut that whole thing down.

 

[Borachio]

That's really the issue. As long as not all people are perfect socialists, libertarian society cannot succeed. If even 1% of people put their own immediate interest above the community interest, the situation will come apart at the seems. You need the Amish. You need a community with very little in the way of individualism and very tight community conformity. And even then you need to be able to exile those that do not do exactly what is expected of them at all times.

And for the population at large, you're just never going to get that.

I am optimistic. It just doesn't look like it's going to happen soon.

What you need is a sufficiently good way of socializing people that they do act in the community interest, because that is in their own best interest.

I am optimistic because the vast majority of people are in fact altruistic by inclination.

 

[WindFish]

Btw

If Libertarians love the free market so much, why wont they accept the fact that there isn't a market for their wacky ideology?

 

[Borachio]

Well there is a market. It's a niche market, that's all.

Like Rolls Royces, caviar, and... other things. More or less savoury.

 

[Tahuti]

Btw

If Libertarians love the free market so much, why wont they accept the fact that there isn't a market for their wacky ideology?

Well there is a market. It's a niche market, that's all.

Like Rolls Royces, caviar, and... other things. More or less savoury.

Great comments!

I know it is an old thread, but it seems worth reviving, so there we go!

 

[Symphony D.]

I've actually wondered this for awhile: do libertarians look at books like Snow Crash and Accelerando and go "hells yes, this is awesome," or what?