MOAR Units Mod 1.2

[Johnen]

I'm curious, is this mod going to have some more graphically accurate updates? Like the Equites Rome for example, they don't look quite right.

They mainly used a chainmail known as a Lorica Hamata.

http://www.kultofathena.com/images/SNC330_2_l.jpg

As the armor evolved and got longer it would be made with chainmail sleeves, which protected the biceps area.

The Lorica Hamata quickly replaced the Roman plate armor (Lorica Segmentata) because it was simply better. It provided a similar level of protection while being more comfortable, easier to produce and repair. There was also the Lorica Squamata but it was never "leathery" as far as historical accuracy is concerned. Lorica Squamata was made out of bronze or steel/iron and yes, the Romans had steel weapons and armor.

Besides a Lorica Hamata, Squamata and occasionally Musculata (although I'm not 100% sure about that one) the Roman Equites didn't use other main body armors.

I haven't played the Romans with MOAR Units yet (been too busy making some changes which aren't too compatible with this mod) but based on the provided picture they look like the default horsemen but the helmets are different and they have simple round shields instead of the Equite ones. I'm guessing this kind of work would take some some time due to modeling and whatnot, so I was just curious if this mod will have visually and historically more accurate units.

 

[Deliverator]

I'm reusing the Longbowman in one of my Civ's. It all seems to work fine apart from the Icon in the Technology Tree.
Basically I took just the Longbowman Icon from your 256 dds file and then saved each one changing the sizes each time. Both the loading screen and the Civilopedia icon's work fine. I'm wondering how you created these? I'm using GIMP2 if that's any help.

@janboruta explains his method for making icons here.

 

[Thadius McGhee]

I haven't seen this listed as an issue, but this mod pack makes my game un-save/loadable. When resuming or loading a save (including auto saves), it would just say "Start Game" and return to the main screen. I don't know if it is a conflict with another mod that I am running, but I created new games and turned off one mod at a time until the game saved and loaded. This was the one that finally allowed the save to load. After starting another new game and turning all the rest of the mods back on, leaving this one off, the game was still able to save and load.

Other mods I have running...
YnAMP
Agenda Tweaks
Civ 6 Improvements pack 12-4
Quo's Combined Tweaks
TCS Improved Forts
Unit Rebalance
Unit Report Screen

Also using the following DLC...
Aztec
Poland
Vikings

I loved the mod for the 250+ turns that I used it before thinking that the game had saved, so this is not a criticism of any kind. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

 

[Lynnes]

I haven't seen this listed as an issue, but this mod pack makes my game un-save/loadable. When resuming or loading a save (including auto saves), it would just say "Start Game" and return to the main screen. I don't know if it is a conflict with another mod that I am running, but I created new games and turned off one mod at a time until the game saved and loaded. This was the one that finally allowed the save to load. After starting another new game and turning all the rest of the mods back on, leaving this one off, the game was still able to save and load.

Other mods I have running...
YnAMP
Agenda Tweaks
Civ 6 Improvements pack 12-4
Quo's Combined Tweaks
TCS Improved Forts
Unit Rebalance
Unit Report Screen

Also using the following DLC...
Aztec
Poland
Vikings

I loved the mod for the 250+ turns that I used it before thinking that the game had saved, so this is not a criticism of any kind. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

I think another mod is causing this.
Can you try to load that savegame, switch to your desktop and post the contents of the Database.log file which you can find here:
My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization VI\Logs
?
I'm sure we can solve this, so you can resume your game!

 

[anansethespider]

I haven't seen this listed as an issue, but this mod pack makes my game un-save/loadable. When resuming or loading a save (including auto saves), it would just say "Start Game" and return to the main screen. I don't know if it is a conflict with another mod that I am running, but I created new games and turned off one mod at a time until the game saved and loaded. This was the one that finally allowed the save to load. After starting another new game and turning all the rest of the mods back on, leaving this one off, the game was still able to save and load.

Other mods I have running...
YnAMP
Agenda Tweaks
Civ 6 Improvements pack 12-4
Quo's Combined Tweaks
TCS Improved Forts
Unit Rebalance
Unit Report Screen

Also using the following DLC...
Aztec
Poland
Vikings

I loved the mod for the 250+ turns that I used it before thinking that the game had saved, so this is not a criticism of any kind. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

I would GUESS based on your description that this is a problem of mod load order. For (completely stupid) reasons, the mod load order is different on new games than it is on saves. You can address this simply by putting some <loadorder> commands in the .modinfo, or possibly even just changing the modid to start with 999.

EDIT, that was too technical for a layperson, so here's what I want you to do:

1. Open up the .modinfo file inside moar units in your DLC folder.
2. Somewhere in between the lines <Properties> and </Properties> up top, insert the following line:

<LoadOrder> 1 </LoadOrder>

and see if that fixes your problem.

 

[Deliverator]

I'm curious, is this mod going to have some more graphically accurate updates? Like the Equites Rome for example, they don't look quite right.
...
I haven't played the Romans with MOAR Units yet (been too busy making some changes which aren't too compatible with this mod) but based on the provided picture they look like the default horsemen but the helmets are different and they have simple round shields instead of the Equite ones. I'm guessing this kind of work would take some some time due to modeling and whatnot, so I was just curious if this mod will have visually and historically more accurate units.

It isn't a question of time - it just isn't possible yet. We don't yet have the tools from Firaxis to import custom models. All that is possible is to take a vanilla model and swap the hat, weapons and shields for something else - and then maybe change the coloring in the handful of cases where the vanilla texture is recolourable. Each armor is fixed to an animation set so it isn't possible for example to have the Cavalry body use a lance or put the Redcoat on horseback unfortunately. So what can be done currently is severely limited.

 

[Johnen]

It isn't a question of time - it just isn't possible yet. We don't yet have the tools from Firaxis to import custom models. All that is possible is to take a vanilla model and swap the hat, weapons and shields for something else - and then maybe change the coloring in the handful of cases where the vanilla texture is recolourable. Each armor is fixed to an animation set so it isn't possible for example to have the Cavalry body use a lance or put the Redcoat on horseback unfortunately. So what can be done currently is severely limited.

Hmmm, so, would it be technically possible to for example - take the knight unit's model, separate the knight from the horse and create 2 types of knights? As in knight lancers and knight swordsmen? They have been really missing from the game.

 

[Deliverator]

Hmmm, so, would it be technically possible to for example - take the knight unit's model, separate the knight from the horse and create 2 types of knights? As in knight lancers and knight swordsmen? They have been really missing from the game.

Animations are effectively baked into the armor - I could put a sword into the Knights hand instead of a lance but the animation would still use it as a lance so it would look quite weird. That's why in Moar Units at the moment the Longbowman still use the Crossbowman animation even though they are using bows. Putting the Knight on a different Horse armor would work fine though.

 

[Johnen]

Animations are effectively baked into the armor - I could put a sword into the Knights hand instead of a lance but the animation would still use it as a lance so it would look quite weird. That's why in Moar Units at the moment the Longbowman still use the Crossbowman animation even though they are using bows. Putting the Knight on a different Horse armor would work fine though.

Hmmm how about this - keep the swordsman model for the most part but change the shield to the knight shield and change the helmet to the knight helmet? Just in general - keep as many Knight model parts as possible, would that be an option?

 

[Deliverator]

Hmmm how about this - keep the swordsman model for the most part but change the shield to the knight shield and change the helmet to the knight helmet? Just in general - keep as many Knight model parts as possible, would that be an option?

Yes that's more or less what I've done to make the Knights Templar. Only issue is that when you use the Knights shield on the Swordsman base the hand clips through the shield which looks too wrong to get away with. Sadly the attachment system doesn't work quite as well as it sounded from the preview interview.

 

[Johnen]

Yes that's more or less what I've done to make the Knights Templar. Only issue is that when you use the Knights shield on the Swordsman base the hand clips through the shield which looks too wrong to get away with. Sadly the attachment system doesn't work quite as well as it sounded from the preview interview.

So let me get this straight: you can take the forearm, helmet and I'm also guessing shin area of a certain model and give it to another one? But the armor covering the shin clips through the swordsman's shield? What about the cataphract parts? Would they work?

 

[Deliverator]

So let me get this straight: you can take the forearm, helmet and I'm also guessing shin area of a certain model and give it to another one?

The parts are generally divided into:
Armor (which is fixed to a particular animation set i.e. the Armor you pick determines the animation that will be used)
Body/Arms/Heads (which are the skin area only - used to vary the skin tone)
Hats/Hair
Weapons (Spears, Swords, etc)
Shields

Then there are few other bits and bobs like Capes for the Swordsman and Cowls for the Crossbowmen etc. For more info see the rough guide I did for the Units.artdef.

But the armor covering the shin clips through the swordsman's shield?

No the fleshy part of the hand appears through the shield rather than behind it. This is the kind of issue that you really need proper art tools to fix so that you can re-position meshes relative to bones.

What about the cataphract parts? Would they work?

The only Caballarii parts you have available are Armor/Caballarii (which can't be used on the Swordsman as the Cavalry animation is baked in), Spears/Caballarii (which wouldn't be useful for a Swordsman), Shields/Caballarii (which I would expect to have the same hand-through shield clipping problems that the Knight shield has) and Hats/Caballarii (which could be used OK I think). A Swordsman with the Caballarii hat and no shield would work fine I suppose but I'm not planning to add more units at the moment.

 

[Johnen]

Would you be able to create some historically accurate legions for me? If so I'd like to start with the early Roman Bronze armors that were pretty much copes of what the Greeks used:

Lorica Musculata

And the early roman shields:

Which were very similar in shape and size to what Kongo uses (but in far better quality).

Of course the Romans always used spears/javelins as their main weapons and would resort to using the gladius (or similar swords) once their main weapon was thrown, broken or stuck.

Technically you'd just have to take the two Roman helmets and retexture them so that they would have the exact same bronze color as the rest of the armor, then retexture the Kongo shield to resemble the Roman one. The hoplites also seem to use iron or steel spears, so they'd have to be made bronze for both Romans and Greeks to look accurate.

Once Iron is researched (the Romans actually made early steel since bronze was better than iron but refined iron [AKA steel] was better than bronze) the legion would have to be ugraded.

At later periods the Romans had several armor types, the Musculata was there because bronze does not rust or decay so it was used for a very, very long time long after steel was already more common but the Romans also had their chainmails and even scale armors:

Some were bronze and others made out of steel and iron, so perhaps the later period legion could have the spearmen with musculatas in the first row, behind them on the left and right would be two legionaries with chainmail and gladiuses (Roman helmets, no capes and of course they'd have to use the large Roman shield), and in the very middle of the back formation - two legionaries wearing lorica segmentatas:

So kinda like the Tercio but with more variety, at least that would be somewhat more appropriate since I understand the limitations due to fact animations are lock to the armors.

Would such a varied unit be even possible to make?

 

[Deliverator]

Technically you'd just have to take the two Roman helmets and retexture them so that they would have the exact same bronze color as the rest of the armor, then retexture the Kongo shield to resemble the Roman one. The hoplites also seem to use iron or steel spears, so they'd have to be made bronze for both Romans and Greeks to look accurate.

The problem is that we can't reskin/retexture anything because we don't have the mod tools to do it yet.

 

[Deliverator]

In other news: it is possible to run Asset Preview via the Beyond Earth SDK FireTuner.

 

[Kennet]

Hi, just a little thing i´ve noticed, the amazon scout for Scythia doesnt start at lvl 2 after recruitment, although i dont know if this is intended. I have checked the files and i think the cause is in Moar_Units_Data.sql, 20th line:

UPDATE Units SET InitialLevel = 2 WHERE UnitType = 'UNIT_SCOUT' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_EXPLORER' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_RANGER' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_SNIPER'; (missing UnitType = "UNIT_AMAZON_SCOUT")

 

[Deliverator]

Hi, just a little thing i´ve noticed, the amazon scout for Scythia doesnt start at lvl 2 after recruitment, although i dont know if this is intended. I have checked the files and i think the cause is in Moar_Units_Data.sql, 20th line:

UPDATE Units SET InitialLevel = 2 WHERE UnitType = 'UNIT_SCOUT' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_EXPLORER' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_RANGER' OR UnitType = 'UNIT_SNIPER'; (missing UnitType = "UNIT_AMAZON_SCOUT")

Yeah, that's intentional. It was brought in when I merged the Expanded Recon Class mod. I think that it's not a bad change seeing as the first Recon promotion is not very strong. It allows you to specialise your Scouts for hills or forest movement from the off.

 

[Agent327]

Which is nice. I've noticed (over several versions) MOAR units tend to use random icons, sometimes even building icons as displayed in the City Build. This is a bit confusing. I can understand that with so many new units added there may be a shortage of icons to use, but still...

 

[The Capo]

In other news: it is possible to run Asset Preview via the Beyond Earth SDK FireTuner.

That looks interesting. Although I don't know what that is. I haven't started yet but I plan on creating a pretty ambitious graphics mod and this looks like it will be helpful since I will be spending a lot of time at first checking out my options first. Right now I am still playing through games with all the different unit styles to get a grasp on what is available to me. This looks like the type of ability I would need to make that process easier. Do you mind showing/telling me how to do this?

 

[Deliverator]

Which is nice. I've noticed (over several versions) MOAR units tend to use random icons, sometimes even building icons as displayed in the City Build. This is a bit confusing. I can understand that with so many new units added there may be a shortage of icons to use, but still...

Are you able to post a screenshot showing which icon you mean? The portrait icons were mostly fixed in version 0.63 so if they are still issues it would help to see examples.

That looks interesting. Although I don't know what that is. Do you mind showing/telling me how to do this?

You can activate the World Builder and Asset Viewer for Civ 6 using the Civ Beyond Earth SDK which is very handy. I included a link on how to do it in the post that you quoted.