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[mod] Warlords: Total Realism 2.3a

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by Houman, Aug 21, 2007.

  1. Freakwave

    Freakwave Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    263
    Location:
    Deventer, The Netherlands
    This is a really nice mod. Really like the buildings in the industrial game onwards as a req for other buildings. Too bad it asks so much of your computer, but then mine is pretty old.

    Civ, France, Leader Charles IV, noble difficulty, agressive ai, no tech trading.

    Zoroastranism spreads really fast. After it was founded the civs next to the founder had in a few turns converted. I couldnt see if it were missionaries but the spead rate was as such that i believe it couldnt be done with missionaries that fast.

    When i was beelining a tech i noticed that turns for reaching a tech vary if you select a researchable tech only or if you also select one tech after it.
    Havent tried selecting techs with the shift key, now i think of it.

    Trajan of the Romans was one of the rival civs. He or the romans for that matter seem to be not working properly. When watching the history movie at the end of the game, there wasnt anything wrong at game start. Spread rate was normal compared to other civs. Apparently they just stopped growing at some point. Only building velites in their cities. Rome grew culturally because of the capital bonus and that was about it. Some tiles were worked. Dont know if it happend after a reload.

    When i switched my capital, asassins i was building in my former capital were still being built and in queu.

    Rebel slaves and Rebel peasants are a nice feature, but they are an annoyance after a while. You learn to always guard your workers and kill any remaining rebels. You also get combat experience which is resolved in BtS ( i think) but too easy to get a doctrine or tradition since those uprisings are regular.
    Maybe an idea to make those uprising rarer and stronger? So you have to guard all your cities with more units, which would mean more of a spread of units and not only close to other civs.
    Right now if you have two units in a city those rebels will most likely never succeed in capturing or even holding! a city. Usually two rebels spawn.

    A nice feature would be to have uprisings with high war weariness. The more war wearines the more rebels. So you would also have them with democracy style governments. I am thinking ww1. France and Germany were close to revolution. Russia collapsed. Something like that would be cool. Civil war!
    something like the revolution mod but not so extreme as it is now.

    Rocket plant requires iron OR aluminium?

    Hemp can also be used to make clothes, could be nice as an addition to cotton?

    Prime timber seems rare on the planet i was on.

    It would be a nice feature to set repeat build from city popup screen.

    Mines can travel on them selves, could it be possible to load/unload them on destroyers/transports/submarines.

    Lots of units are still buildable after they are obsolete this clogs up build screens.

    Some spy missions are too cheap imo, like kill great ppl and sabotage research.

    Typo Stell Hull tech.

    On those buildings like steel mill and chemical plant etc. If you have two or more of each resouce required you are pretty much set. My first thought however was that, for instance, each newly built steel mill would take another coal and iron from your stack.
    This way you can pratically build each building in each city of your civ, a no brainer since all the extra bonussus are too good to be passed, for pretty much all of your cities.

    Upgrades:

    Pistolier to R35 111gold
    Cuirassier to Char B1 225gold
    War elephant to Char B1 411gold

    All seem pretty cheap upgrades. The pistolier is a weaker unit, by two points, than a cuirassier, they upgrade to a R35light tank and medium tank but a r35 light tank has a bonus against normal tanks. Their upgrade cost should be closer imo.

    Caudron IV to bomber cost nothing!

    What about a, "you used nukes" as a negative modifier from other civs towards you if you use em. Same for chemical or biological weapons use. As well as the use on a civ or the use by a civ.

    It would be great if the "Perfect map" script would be compatible with this mod.
     
  2. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2003
    Messages:
    3,294
    Location:
    London, UK
    AI generally uses missionaries - but in case of Zoro, a civ is limited to one at a time. Very fast religion spread early in game can happen if many cities are connected via a large river system.

    The responsible for this one is tech spread component, I think - most likely, it sees the tech you selected as the one the spread bonus applies to, even if it isn't the one you're researching. The solution is simple - only select techs you are going to research next.

    Nothing is really bugged in Roman AI compared to other civs - probably just some particular set of circumstances caused Rome to stall in this particular game. I've seen Rome perform quite well.

    Enjoy. :)

    Seriously, though, this shouldn't be the case, but it also isn't that major an exploit. We can as well leave it as it is.

    The number of rebels depends on city population. As we move to BtS, we might rethink the whole idea, but this isn't going to happen in a while.

    Seems like a nice idea.

    Yep. You can make rockets out of both.

    I don't think it was ever used to make clothes on an industrial scale, unlike cotton or wool.

    This is a WAD - only a select few nations should get access to this resource; it's a nice bonus, but definitely not critical for survival (it is not even a "hard" prerequisite for any unit, methinks).

    Taken into consideration.

    Would be a real pain to teach the AI to make proper use of them. Consider these as minelayer flotillas.

    This shouldn't be the case. Examples? Remember that the unit becomes obsolete only after you can build ALL the units it can upgrade into.

    Will check.

    Will fix.

    This is what we're aspiring to achieve. Turned out to be pretty hard to code in, so we're stuck with this system for some time, I guess. Still, eventually, we'll have something close to what you describe.

    Upgrades are a function of ONLY build cost difference between units.

    Actually, it's not very true IRL. Japan nowadays kinda likes the US, and France is quite fond of Germany (nuclear and chemical weapons, respectively). Looks like the memory of such actions is actually quite short-lived.

    None of us have any experience of adapting any map scripts to work with TR. I'm not sure about this one.
     
  3. Freakwave

    Freakwave Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    263
    Location:
    Deventer, The Netherlands
    The map script is actually called "perfect world" sorry about that.

    Well USA won the war, occupied Japan and basically made it a vassal state. Germany and France relations have only improved much after the fall of the Berlin wall. I am seeing Kohl and Mitterand holding hands at a ww2 memorial service. Primarily because of the EU of course. Anyway maybe the decay should be faster. I always wondered why a nation would hold a grudge for the entire game. I even think you declared war on us should be subject to decay.

    I know i dont hold any grudges against an ai that attacked me in the past. I just dont loose :) This pretty much hinders an alliance in the future. Look at the EU now we pretty much have an alliance in the case of war. That includes Germany who were the aggressor in ww2. It capitulated maybe that can be the trigger to completely whash out previous relation modifiers, kind of like installing a new government.

    About obsolete units i remember crossbowmen being available for a long time.
    You know you never are going to build it again after you have something better. although i have to say TR has units that only have bonussus against a their own era type of unit. This makes some newer units less effective. Why have newer units if you cant "own" the oldies.

    Timber is also used to make a furniture factory so that makes it very exclusive furniture. Btw can you trade those manufactured resources that would be great. Trading firearms and artillery :D

    and thanks for the rest of the info
     
  4. buglepong

    buglepong Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    4
    I find the shifting holy city mechanic unrealistic. It's not like Mecca will stop being Mecca or Jerusalem stop being Jerusalem etc. The game should take into account the combinations of civic and religion . At least, there should be a way to keep more than one holy city, eg no state :religion:
     
  5. buglepong

    buglepong Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    4
    oh yeah, how can I change it so that I don't get the shifting holy city effect?
     
  6. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Look in TR-config.ini, you'll find all stuff regarding HC shifting there (and commented in a user-friendly manner too).
     
  7. chewbs

    chewbs Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2005
    Messages:
    31
    Location:
    Sudbury, Canada
    Hey guys, love the mod... as usual its totaly crazy.

    I am having a problem, its saying I have a bad memory allocation error and shuts down, if anybody has this problem as well please let me know.

    I am not sure if the vid card has anything to do with it, but I am getting a new one in a week, should be in the 8600-8800 series.

    Thanx in advance...

    P.S. Can't wait for th BTS mod!!! ohh and if you want help with the voice over, I would love to help out!! please let me know!!
     
  8. xbeanerx

    xbeanerx Warlord

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2006
    Messages:
    278
    Location:
    los Angeles, Cali ,U.S.A
    when can we get the Mod for Bts come on guys hurry please!!!!
    this mod rules and kicks ass!!!
     
  9. Mexico

    Mexico TR senior programmer

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2005
    Messages:
    578
    Location:
    Slovakia, Kosice
    sorry guys, BtS conversion was slowed because most of us was very busy at work in last few weeks (ie I was unable to do anything in last 6 weeks !! - combination of busy at work and personal (family) problems)
     
  10. Hian the Frog

    Hian the Frog TR Designer and XML

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Messages:
    1,133
    Location:
    Near Nancy, FRANCE
    Hi All,

    As Mexico said we were/are busy at that time. Personnaly, i have to finish the preparation of the first part of my exam. Nevertheless, we are improving Warlords TR. A few more units, some codes changes,.... were made in the last week. Our wish is to both commit a first BtS version and above all a final Warlords one.

    As you, i'm unhappy by this situation. But i'm sure that all of you can understand that preparing an exam (Houman, Mexico, and me) is taking many time.

    Enjoy the mod.

    Hian the Frog.
     
  11. GH5652

    GH5652 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2007
    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Cleveland, OH USA
    I know this is off topic but I wanted to wish everyone a very Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday season!:)
     
  12. Soul oWar

    Soul oWar Warlord

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    139
    Hi all ... Happy holiday to everyone.

    I love this mod ... what is currently keeping me playing civ IV :)... I was wondering one thing though ... would I be able to remove the feature of Leaders favorite Religion ... I know it's all about realism ... but for me I don't like it since it hinder civilization that come with "late" religion and I would just like to know if I could disable it from my end. (I was teh first to found a religion zoroastrianism ... or soemthing liek that... most of the known world (half civilization) was converted and that at around 0ad 4 of those start changing religion for their favorite that just spread to one of it's new colony off world... and the ai didn't play well to spread the new heresy into it's land .. and it gave me a reverse advantage... So I would prefer to remove it)

    Thank you all for your help.. I'm currently browsing some of teh file but with my lack of knowledge... I don't really know where to look.

    EDIT::
    ok I searched a bit and in CIV4LeaderHeadInfos.xml there is a favorite religion line for each leader... I guess putting it to NONE would do my deal? Is taht all that is needed? Thanks
     
  13. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    3,294
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    Yep. It is that easy. I adore the players who have the oomph to modify mod files to get what they want. Hey, that's how I got into team! :D

    BTW, Merry Christmas to all Western Christians out there!
     
  14. Soul oWar

    Soul oWar Warlord

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    139
    Nice thanks ... worked fine ... now would tehre be a way to halve teh value of xp toward great general for killing barbarian? in my current game I just builded the great wall and well ... barbarian farming? there is barren land beneath me (ice) a lot... and lot of barbarian comes from tehre ... and I don't want to just turn off xp from them (saw the place where I could just put false ...)

    Thanks

    edit:
    Also what does Power do? there is no description taht I can find and under the civpedia ... only National : Power no more than 3 turn of anrachy...

    Thanks again
     
  15. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Nope, no real way to halve it. And since your tactics doesn't give you free XP, you still have to fight for it, it's even hardly an exploit. Not in good old days when people used to have 6 GGs settle in one city and build units with about 16 XP there...

    Power NV gives new melee (methinks) units 1 XP and speeds up their construction. You might recheck the Warrior Code building in pedia for effects.
     
  16. timberwoolf

    timberwoolf Warlord

    Joined:
    May 4, 2003
    Messages:
    204
    To the Total Realism mod team.

    Roads, Iron and gunpowder.

    I personally belive, that in order to make the mod a little bit more realistic you shouldn't forget these 3 important topics.

    Roads- well, as a matter of fact- the Romans was really the first who used roads strategically, and it gave them a huge advantage....No roads during the middle ages, no roads used by the ancient empiers....I do belive the problem included, but you can offcourse change tre road traits, and the Romans should have indeed these huge advantage....Let's say- 4 road movement....I even think, that maybe you should use completely new improvment, which will act like a road( coonect resources) but will have movement cost 1. And the real roads should appear much later.


    Iron- before the invention of the iron plough, and the use of it in the agriculture, a lot of lands couldn't be cultivated, or at least were only partly cultivated. The iron gave a hule leap to the human race. It should be a really revolutionary technology. I have a few thoughts about it, but largely, iron should have connection with field production.

    gunpowder- Well, actually, I always remembered the story about how the Russians captured Kaliningrad( Kenigsberg), and the biggest difficulty was the fortresses in the city....Why do I mention it? Becouse- gunpowder or not- strong walls will always help you! The Magino line was built from concrete, so was the fortresses in Belgium....As a matter of fact, the army do use walls even now, offcourse that's not the encien brcik or mad walls, but a good fortification will always help you. I belive that I don't have to say know that the walls shouldn't loose they defensive bonus to gunpowder units.

    I'l gladly hear what you'v got to say about these.
     
  17. Anaztazioch

    Anaztazioch Hit in the head too much

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Kraków, Poland (southern Poland)


    Persian Royal Roads ?

    If rivers act as roads for connecting resources, and we will move roads to later times, some civs will have great advantage.
     
  18. timberwoolf

    timberwoolf Warlord

    Joined:
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    204
    the "Persian Royal Roads" is much more a myth than a reality. (It's actually one long road, connected to the major cities....)

    You can't really compare it to the Roman roads.

    I'm not talking about rivers, I'm talking about new improvment- let's call it- "caravan road", trade network...That doesn't really matter.

    By the way, the movement( it is stiil, even now) of troops was one of the central problems, and the roads in civ, make these process really unrealistic.
     
  19. EnlightenmentHK

    EnlightenmentHK Emperor

    Joined:
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    Civilizations had been carving out 'pseudo-roads' since some of the earliest foundings of trade. Most amounted to little more than well-trod paths with trees and stones removed and probably wouldn't be sufficient for the movement of large armies, but I think they're fairly enough represented in TR. And the road movement bonus's available from later techs would (I think) represent the improvements in width and paving you're suggesting.

    From a gameplay perspective, I think it'd be quite annoying to have to wait for the mid to late classical period to have access to roads. And giving the Romans such an increase in mobility would certainly imbalance the early game in their favor. While Total Realism is the namesake of the mod, some respect should be paid to balance and gameplay. (and there generally is of course)

    I've said before that this mod is the greatest thing to happen to Civ since Civ. Unfortunately I'm running into constant MAF problems during the late game of your latest Warlords release. And the .exe/windows modifying fix I've noted at various forums seemed a bit too complicated for my amatuerish hands to tackle.

    I did get BtS for Christmas and am amazed at how smoothly it runs. I like the random events and several new features it has incorporated. But as always, I don't feel that they've done enough with them. And after playing TR constantly for a while, I don't really feel that I've gained an expansion pack, but a crippled infant of a game with alot of potential. You guys have a knack for unlocking that potential. And I eagerly await the BtS release.

    That said, I should have probably bought Crysis or Bioshock instead and waited til the TR guys had their BtS version ready. Cause I've played this game for a few days and I'm already thinking of moving back to TR Warlords.
     
  20. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Well, actually we were planning on expanding road tiers when we move to BtS. I must say that I myself had the same feeling upon getting BtS, and this is probably one of reasons we're not rushing a conversion to it - making the new features work as they are supposed to would require a tremendous effort. That's also why we are trying to finish all that we can before converting to BtS; a well-polished game that doesn't feel incomplete is our goal, and you'll be getting yet one more - final (both in the sense of "last" and "complete") version for Warlords (while conversion to BtS is also finally getting underway). The realistic date for its arrival is mid-January. After that, one can expect BtS version.
     

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