New Civs [Suggestion/Request]

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

could be in as a UHV rather than the megalopolis of Corboda goal, which is completely unsupported by archeological evidence by the way.

I hope you realize that the burden of proof rests upon those making the assertions.
Do you have anything to back up that statement?

 

[Leoreth]

Not to mention that absence of evidence != evidence of absence. We have no reason not to trust the many sources which have placed Cordoba as one of the largest cities in the world around 1000 AD.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Another problem why Pacific is often left empty is because their islands are covered with jungles, which is unsettle-able before Biology that came pretty late in the game.

Also, the AI never settles such jungles even after Biology. It doesn't understand why it should clear jungle outside its own territory.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Facing the Greeks, Romans, Persians, Seljuks, Arabs, and Turks already is a nightmare. We don't need more in the Mediterranean. The Jurchen/Manchu civ does seem like a pretty good idea. I'm still in support of a Barbary Pirates civ, they would get Tripoli and Tunis and would churn out Privateers until someone goes after them.

Perhaps I need to make this clear. These "Special Barbs" are meant to replace existing regular Barbs, not to add to them.

Also, it appears you're talking about playing Babylon till past 1200 CE. If that is not a nightmare, the game is not designed right.

 

[mrrandomplayer]

Perhaps I need to make this clear. These "Special Barbs" are meant to replace existing regular Barbs, not to add to them.

Also, it appears you're talking about playing Babylon till past 1200 CE. If that is not a nightmare, the game is not designed right.

True enough.

That being said, what do you people think about Barbary Pirates minor civ or respawn of the Moors?

 

[Lone Wolf]

Also, it appears you're talking about playing Babylon till past 1200 CE. If that is not a nightmare, the game is not designed right.

Tachywaxon FTW?

 

[mrrandomplayer]

That and my Babylon OCC AAR. Ult has been revived!

 

[InsanelyApple]

Really, Europe is crowded enough and some small civs should be removed from it (ex. Poland, Netherlands), but I know, at least, Poland was discussed and shot down.

I do think Africa and North America could do with a few more civilizations. Africa could have three more, a generic Swahili civ, Zimbabwe, and South Africa.

Swahili
Spawn - 900
Capital - Kilwa
Leader(s) - Ali ibn al-Hassan
UP: +2 gold from each trade route in your city.
UB: Port - Replaces harbor. extra gold from trade routes.
UU: Dhow - Replaces trireme. Extra strength and can travel through capes.
UHV: Connect 3 fish and 3 whales by 1050, Have 1000 gold by 1100, Make 1000 gold from trade with other civs by 1500.

Zimbabwe
Spawn - 1000
Capital - Great Zimbabwe, Cape Town (1900 after possible respawn)
Leader(s) - ???, Shaka (1790), Nelson Mandela (1990)
UP: Defensive buildings provide +2 food.
UB: ----
UU: Impi
UHV: Have the largest city in the world by 1500 (GZ was the largest city in sub Saharan Africa), Ensure no colonies in Southern Africa by 1950 (Represent the Zulu), Something to represent South Africa.
Respawn: South Africa after ~1900

Reason for inclusion of Zimbabwe and Swahili. Archaeological evidence suggests that Great Zimbabwe became a centre for trading, with artefacts suggesting that the city formed part of a trade network linked to Kilwa and extending as far as China.

And even though I know Leoreth always shoot down these next suggestions, I'm suggesting them anyway.

Mississippians
Spawn - 800
Capital - Cahokia
Leader(s) - Tuskaloosa, John Ross (1800)
UA: Rivers act as roads (extra speed for units).
UB: Mound: Replaces monument. Does not go obsolete and extra culture.
UU: Blowdart Man: Replaces archer. Extra combat strength agaisnt barbarians.
UHV: Have the largest city in the world by 1300 (it was comparable to London and Paris in size, though smaller than Cordoba, Baghdad, etc, but have one of the largest cities wouldn't be as hard!), Enter the Medieval era before meeting an old world civ, Ensure no European colonies in North America east of the Mississippi by 1750.
Respawn: Cherokee ~1600 (the Five Civilized Tribes are descended from the Mississippians)

Pueblo
Spawn - 200
Capital - Mesa Verde
Leader(s) - Po'pay
UA: Desert and mountains provide +1 food.
UB: Kiva. Replaces Pagan Temple. Extra culture and happiness.
UU: ???. Replaces Spearman. Weaker attacking, but extra defense. (Referring to the Pueblo Revolt)
UHV: Own the Rockie Mountains by 1400, Have no city convert to an old world religion by 1700 (once again, referring to the Pueblo Revolt), Ensure no European colonies in the Rockies, California, and Mesoamerica by 1750.

Reason for including the Mississippians and Puebloans. First, it would make the Aztec and Mayan games a bit more interesting to play before the Europeans show up. Secondly, there is some small evidence of trade between Mesoamerica and the Anasazi. Finally, some scholars that believe migrations and trade between the Mississippian natives and the Mesoamerican civilizations spawned the Mississippian civilization.

 

[KeeperOT7Keys]

yeah, timurids could easily be a seljuk 'respawn' with a simple name-change, both were turkic nomadic invaders 'who wiped the slate clean' and quickly disappeared to leave a massive power vacuum.

they will bring a balance to iran-ottoman problem imo iran always being vassal of ottomans ''eyalet of sharazor'' they can take iran-ankara-bagdat, then disappear and there is lot of independent cities for both iran and ottomans

 

[Leoreth]

Must ... resist ... all suggestions dealing with East Africa ...

 

[ales_]

BTW, Swahili is already included in History Rewritten, so it's not very hard to include it in the mod.

 

[Leoreth]

I know! That's just making it worse.

 

[ales_]

But why you don't want to include it?

 

[Leoreth]

Because I have more important stuff to do.

 

[Lennon789]

You don't have to not do it, you could just place it at the bottom of your priority list! I'm fairly neutral towards the idea myself, but it would provide for another civilization that sells slaves, which apparently there aren't enough of, according to the forum.

 

[Leoreth]

Yeah, ideas are already beginning to grow in my head for a Sultanate of Kilwa / Swahili civ so I guess there is no stopping it. It may even be interesting to respawn Arabia as Oman for this era. Of course this would require readjusting Ethiopia's UHV, which could involve more actively opposing the Europeans assuming my Congress changes are successful in spurring colonialism in Africa.

You see, this sounds more like something for 1.13.

 

[ales_]

Yes, I didn't want it for 1.12, but that's a good idea for 1.13.

 

[archcapitalist]

i would say the swahili are probably the only additional civ that i would welcome at this point.

although i do like the timurids as the seljuk respawn. it could even help fix the mughal issue.

kinda makes sense as they would do the same thing the seljuks do. clear the middle east and make way for the ottomans to spawn in turkey. if we recognize continuity between timurids/ghorids, the timurids could get troops outside of delhi, that expire when the mughals spawn.

thus human india would have the option of stopping the ghorid invasion and preventing mughal spawn.

 

[mrrandomplayer]

That does seem like a pretty good idea.

Then again, Venice should also be added. 100% unbiased right there!

 

[Leoreth]

Venice has already been added.