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New Version - June 2nd (6-2)

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by Gazebo, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    For simplicity, the 'on growth' function assumes that the current city yields will not change. So it's a worst case scenario (i.e. if you go from 12-13 pop, it assumes that the new pop does nothing until you assign it). This allows the player to see which yield median will be hit hardest by growth, but it is not necessarily indicative of the real difference.

    G
     
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  2. tothePAIN

    tothePAIN Chieftain

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    I've taken Venice's capital - the capital shifts to a puppet city and becomes no longer a puppet. Even for Venice.
     
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  3. pineappledan

    pineappledan Warlord

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  4. Rekk

    Rekk Chieftain

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    That's apparent.

    I'm trying to figure out how unhappiness is calculated from the deficit (which I understand from this screenshot to be total yields missing). Bursa isn't missing 2 :c5food:/:c5production: per :c5citizen:, so unhappiness no longer seems to be directly proportional to missing yields per :c5citizen:.

    Edit: Distress isn't the best need to look at from this. I forgot that the Food line item is the net food after consumption.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
  5. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    Real life: I'm in the process of moving a very long distance (end of this month) - that plus work plus general life has thrown off my plans a bit. I'd say post-move things open up, but not until July at the very earliest (more likely August).

    G
     
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  6. Txurce

    Txurce Warlord

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    Where are you moving?
     
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  7. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    It is still directly proportional, but the proportion is now 25 (was 100). This is to compensate for the major reduction in modifiers, and to make smaller shifts in yields more noticeable within the happiness function.

    G
     
  8. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    Arkansas! Quite the change in scenery.

    g
     
  9. Rekk

    Rekk Chieftain

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    Where did this discussion take place?
     
  10. chicorbeef

    chicorbeef Warlord

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    I think the specialist cap due to unhappiness is kind of clunky, I think it discourages :c5food: too much, which is already not that great a yield, it adds extra unnecessary micromanagement and population management and I don't quite understand the point of it if we are going to be buffing Specialists to make up for it anyway. We've already had our fair share of specialist nerfs and nerfs to population growth over the last year or so and I don't understand why we need to nerf this further.

    Also, RIP Babylon walls. And double RIP Lugh the Skilled One (this pantheon got wrecked....)
     
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  11. pineappledan

    pineappledan Warlord

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    Cool cool. I more wanted to know if that idea had been abandoned, since it was floated 7 months ago.
    https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...bility-discussion.635371/page-3#post-15283080
     
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  12. Txurce

    Txurce Warlord

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    My wife is from there. If you don't mind the heat and humidity, it's beautiful. And it has quite a few good schools in the Little Rock area. Is that where you're going?
     
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  13. Rekk

    Rekk Chieftain

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    I'll try boredom instead of distress since the numbers are more readily available.

    Bursa produces 7 culture and has a deficit of 8 for a total need of 15 :c5culture:, or 1.5 :c5culture:/:c5citizen:. We only produce 0.7 :c5culture:/:c5citizen:, or (1.5 - 0.7) / 0.25 = 3.2 increments away...? Is it being rounded to the nearest whole number now? Maybe the actual need is between 1.41-1.45:c5culture:/:c5citizen: and the deficit is 7.1-7.5, rounded up to 8?

    If I'm doing this correctly, then my next observation is that (X per Unhappy :c5citizen:) seems to be meaningless once unhappiness reduction comes into play. Boredom reduction means that I can float a deficit of 0.25 :c5culture:/:c5citizen: or 2:c5culture: total without having any Boredom. That means I only need to gain 3:c5culture: per unhappy :c5citizen: to reduce :c5unhappy: from Boredom by 1.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
  14. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    X per unhappy is still helpful, in that it shows you what you need to make to reduce your deficit by 1 at the minimum. The accuracy does decrease as your reduction grows, but it’s still a reliable minimum value.

    G
     
  15. Rekk

    Rekk Chieftain

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    Meaningless was the wrong word, sorry.

    a 20:c5citizen: city with 3 distress reducers, reduces the total deficit by 15. If I have 6 unhappiness from distress, reduced from 9, then I have a deficit of 45 ( 7.5 per unhappy :c5citizen:), but only need 5 to decrease unhappiness from distress by 1. Why not choose to use the actual unhappiness as a basis instead of the modified? Because this information is on the deficit line?
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
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  16. Takagi Hiro

    Takagi Hiro Chieftain

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    Urbanization itself is fine to me. My gripes with it have mainly been for tradition and especially its early game. Your specialists are fundamental to your start, yet you're often unable to assign them. That's not to mention it makes some religious pantheons much less ideal. Korea, notably, wants to be working their specialists nearly constantly alongside some great tile improvements, but struggles to do this in anything that isn't their capital in the early game especially. It's quite worrying to see them take such a hit, and it even made me wonder if having one free specialist in every tradition city would make for a viable solution.

    Yes, you're right. I do have to apologize; I had a very awful day yesterday and while I wasn't aiming to seek confrontation, I can definitely see where there was some unnecessary snark. I stand by my points, however, and apologize to everyone this may have sat poorly with.
     
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  17. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch

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    Correct - I could do that, but I think it would muddy the info.

    G
     
  18. pineappledan

    pineappledan Warlord

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    Wasn't there a plan to add 1 specialist does not generate :c5unhappy:urbanization unhappiness to the palace? Maybe G could reduce the Throne Room Tradition finisher from 2 down to 1 :c5unhappy:free specialist to compensate?
     
  19. JamesNinelives

    JamesNinelives Chieftain

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    That was discussed, yes.
    I imagine that is something that is in the works at the moment.
     
  20. John.B.C

    John.B.C Chieftain

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    I might even be able to understand this new interface! Let's see if I got things right. For instance, it says 2 unhappiness from boredom; 3 actual, deficit 8 - reduced by 1. So this means that the city doesn't have 3 unhappy people due to boredom, because it has built a building like the arena which reduces a bored citizen by -1?
     

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