Project SYNTHESIS

[Sikandar]

Is VD already in this or will it be implemented at a later date?

 

[J. pride]

Can we not make this into Kitchen Sink mod; the only civ there that would be useful to put in are the Austrians.

 

[ozqar]

Can we not make this into Kitchen Sink mod; the only civ there that would be useful to put in are the Austrians.

J. Pride, what is for you all that "kitchen sink" content?

 

[Linkman226]

1180 AD and no christianity.

I don't know if it's me but when I play England/Russia/Spain/Portugal I've always problem with religion spread !

Maybe I should add missionaries in this RFC too.

I usually don't see this with Spain (then again, I haven't played in a while. Too busy modding ). But the other ones are what I call the "extremity civilizations." They are on the edges of Europe, and in the case of Portugal, the Vikings, and England, have
access to trade with faraway Muslim places, so frequently they end up with no religion or Islam. Hopefully a Christian missionary and Santiago will fix this.

About Abundance (I know we are getting a bit ahead here) but I would recommend this:

1. Add Holy Rome and move the German spawn to early 1700s. Holy Rome could turn into Habsburg Austria in the late-game.

2. Add Native America as a civ (they could respawn as Canada if they collapse/ get conquered)

3. Add Korea, they deserve more

4. The rest is up to you, I would not recommend adding the Zulus or Sumerian though (although, we could have the Sumerians be Assyria or Hatti, but I really dont see how that would work)

1) Just Austria

2) No. They were never an actual civilization with the level of distribution of labor or the ability to raise large armies.

3)In the SVN, imported from DoC. For the moment, I've blocked people from downloading the latest version, though, because the current version is rather buggy.

4)I agree.

Spain should start with Catholicism, the Archdiocese of Santiago for example was refounded in 739

Yes

Spain seems to lack a preplaced city with Christianity. Santiago would almost offer itself since the AI likes the spot and it's historical.

Yup

Santiago is also a decent city spot

Indeed

Play testing feed back. Played The inca from 3000BC, normal speed and the maya epic speed both to a historic victory.

Spoiler :

Some odd stuff.

Spoiler :

When turkey spawned in my maya game the troops just sat there for about 100 years

They eventually settled but ages after their spawn

Spoiler :

I never researched BW, i was just choosing a tech, moved my mouse over it and it was already basically done.

You can really wonder spam as the new worlders cos there are always loads of wonders left from the European civs not staying on Parthenon long enough.

1) The Turkey thing has to do with the fact that they no longer spawn with settlers... since Byzantium was razed they sort of dawdle around. This could be fixed by 1) Decreasing the rate at which Byzantium is razed; and 2) Giving Turkey settlers on the Byzantium tile if Byzantium is razed.

2) I honestly have no clue why that happened. Leoreth or any one else, any ideas?

3)Adding Hellenism to the Old World and making THAT a prereq for those wonders rather than the civic of paganism would fix that.

About Civs in Abundance, I totally agree that the sumerians shouldn't be there, they're not fun to play. I had once suggested using them as an Israelite civ (perhaps with a one city challenge game?), and I still think that would be a very interesting game.
But please do add the Native Americans, the HRE (turning into Austria), the Koreans, the Zulu and the Celts. They add a lot of content to the game.
Congratulations on the great work so far .

Israel's far too minor of a civ.
Native Americans is a terrible idea. HRE- Yes. On the German spawn they'll become Austria-Hungary. Koreans are in. Zulu- no, same reason as Native Americans. Celts- also the same reason- they were never a civ per se.

When I look to add a civ as playable by humans I consider the following:

1) Were they ever organized under one state with the ability to field armies and actually do stuff? If yes proceed to step 2; else, break;

2) Did they last for at least several hundred years and have a significant impact on society? If yes, proceed to step 3; else, break;

3) Is there a group of peoples not already in the game more deserving of inclusion when the performance decrease caused by adding civs is taken into account? If no, synthesis.addCiv(iCiv); else, break;

Is VD already in this or will it be implemented at a later date?

Will be added

Can we not make this into Kitchen Sink mod; the only civ there that would be useful to put in are the Austrians.

Agreed

J. Pride, what is for you all that "kitchen sink" content?

When we add civs that were highly heterogeneous, like the Native Americans or even the Celts, merely for the sake of adding them.

 

[J. pride]

J. Pride, what is for you all that "kitchen sink" content?

With due respect, I dont think civs like Native Americans, Sumer or Israel belong in this mod.

 

[ozqar]

With due respect, I dont think civs like Native Americans, Sumer or Israel belong in this mod.

Well, I think that who belongs or doesn't in a mod is for the modder to decide. I was simply suggesting Linkman added them, but in any case, he agrees with you, so that's that.

Israel's far too minor of a civ.
Native Americans is a terrible idea. HRE- Yes. On the German spawn they'll become Austria-Hungary. Koreans are in. Zulu- no, same reason as Native Americans. Celts- also the same reason- they were never a civ per se.

When I look to add a civ as playable by humans I consider the following:

1) Were they ever organized under one state with the ability to field armies and actually do stuff? If yes proceed to step 2; else, break;

2) Did they last for at least several hundred years and have a significant impact on society? If yes, proceed to step 3; else, break;

3) Is there a group of peoples not already in the game more deserving of inclusion when the performance decrease caused by adding civs is taken into account? If yes, synthesis.addCiv(iCiv); else, break;
...

When we add civs that were highly heterogeneous, like the Native Americans or even the Celts, merely for the sake of adding them.

Thanks for the reply. I think that playing those civs, as heterogenous and not unified as they were, is fun to do, but this is your mod so this is totally up to you. After Iran, are you considering adding any others?

And by the way, shouldn't that last if, be a no?

 

[Leoreth]

I agree. I could see Israel as an unplayable "Civs in Abundance" style "flavored independent" to control Yerushalayim, though.

 

[SouthernKing]

But, another idea of mine was that we use these etra civs simply as a base for other civs. ie: NA as Canada. I am all for having Canada in Synthesis, so that US can wipe them out every turn.

Other news: played v.25 Babylon to UHV, have not tested other civs so far.

 

[BenZL43]

Why Canada?

2) Did they last for at least several hundred years and have a significant impact on society? If yes, proceed to step 3; else, break;

@Linkman nice work, man on the Persian! A little suggestion that Iran call themselves Aryan peoples rather than Qizilbash peoples? ^^v

@Everybody else
IMHO I'll prefer adding Austria from the HRE Split of Austria & Prussia that Leoreth's going to work in DoC, rather than adding them from CiA, it sounds more interesting ^^v

 

[J. pride]

Linkman, How are the Persian coming along? (Ill porbably try to make a Gpeople list by tomorrow and also work on the Euro Cities)


I was playing as the Ottomans; here are few observations:

-Arabia is still alive most of the times; there should some mechanic which should make the Arabs collapse. Consider adding Seljuk barbs and even make the Arab's Persian and Egyptian territories more likely to revolt.
-Byzantines expansion into Crimea is way overblown; they usually have 2 cities there and one of them is not even in they citymanager map.
-The Ottomans flip Caucasus which is unhistorical especially since Azerbaijan is one of the core provinces of the Safavids.
-Lastly, Can you please consider adding Damascus and have it flip to the Ottomans . This way Ai Turkey will be more willing to expand into the Middle East and thus come into conflicts with Persia.

 

[Linkman226]

They're doing great, you know, aside from the fact that for some bizarre reason they sometimes won't spawn and my damn DLL isn't compiling

EDIT: JUST COMPILED

Now to see if that fixed things

 

[BenZL43]

I always wonder what tiles best to place Damascus into..
It always interesting

Most of the time, the city original tiles is crapped by Yerushalayim, Sur, Babylon (or Baghdad) and the 3x3 Grid rule..

 

[Linkman226]

Comments in red, guys.

Thanks for the reply. I think that playing those civs, as heterogenous and not unified as they were, is fun to do, but this is your mod so this is totally up to you. After Iran, are you considering adding any others?

I can understand that. I disagree, but I can understand if you feel that way. But there's always CiA for that.

And by the way, shouldn't that last if, be a no?

Oh yes To be fixed

I agree. I could see Israel as an unplayable "Civs in Abundance" style "flavored independent" to control Yerushalayim, though.

Yes, I was planning on that eventually

But, another idea of mine was that we use these etra civs simply as a base for other civs. ie: NA as Canada. I am all for having Canada in Synthesis, so that US can wipe them out every turn.

Other news: played v.25 Babylon to UHV, have not tested other civs so far.

We could add Canada just as well without running the risk of creating an ahistorical Native American empire and hedging in the Americans.

Why Canada?

Good point.

@Linkman nice work, man on the Persian! A little suggestion that Iran call themselves Aryan peoples rather than Qizilbash peoples? ^^v

I've changed them to "Safaviyya Peoples" for now.
@Everybody else

IMHO I'll prefer adding Austria from the HRE Split of Austria & Prussia that Leoreth's going to work in DoC, rather than adding them from CiA, it sounds more interesting ^^v

That's a decent point.

Linkman, How are the Persian coming along? (Ill porbably try to make a Gpeople list by tomorrow and also work on the Euro Cities)

Cool. I already gave them a rudimentary GP list, but it's lacking. Too many people from modern times.

On a related note, I found out the creator of eBay is Iranian while doing Great Merchant name research.

I was playing as the Ottomans; here are few observations:

-Arabia is still alive most of the times; there should some mechanic which should make the Arabs collapse. Consider adding Seljuk barbs and even make the Arab's Persian and Egyptian territories more likely to revolt.

Good idea. Also in the latest SVN copy of DoC is the mongol hordes feature, which might help.

-Byzantines expansion into Crimea is way overblown; they usually have 2 cities there and one of them is not even in they citymanager map.

Ok, I'll look into this.

-The Ottomans flip Caucasus which is unhistorical especially since Azerbaijan is one of the core provinces of the Safavids.

I believe the reason this was done was because Turkey expands too slow otherwise. That's why they spawn with a territory many times larger than what they had in real life at the time. But I'll consider it.

-Lastly, Can you please consider adding Damascus and have it flip to the Ottomans . This way Ai Turkey will be more willing to expand into the Middle East and thus come into conflicts with Persia.

From my experience it almost always conquers Persia anyways in regular RFC or pre-Safavid DoC because of the lack of a barrier. There should be an element of conflict already. However there's historical reasons for adding Damascus (rather than Aleppo) too. Anyone have anything else to comment on this?

 

[SouthernKing]

the Ottoman strength usually depends on whether or not the Arabs collapse or if Persia still exists so you really cannot do a whole lot about it. The other problem I can see with adding Damascus/Aleppo is that you are cramming another city into an area where there is not much space to begin with.

 

[BenZL43]

I really agreed to add Damascus, as long as it's fit enough there...
I was thinking it could be at (74,39) or (74,38), if Jerusalem is razed...
But if it isn't, it'll violate the rule of 3x3 Grid..

Adding them to (74,40) also a bad idea if Tyre still alive..

And by the way,
I think Italia should spawn earlier in 774 in the northern Italy.. [Kingdom of Italy]
Rome as Independent (Papal State), could be given 1000% Fortification to make sure it didn't caught early / flip only because of culture..

I was also thinking for some mechanism that could work as alternative if somebody asked for Sumerian..
just like Holy Roman Empire > Austria + New : Germany,
Sumeria > Babylonia + New : Assyria (really historical)

And we should decrease the rate of Vienna (Wien) being razed...

Some great people (If haven't been added yet ):

Great Artist

Reza Abbasi
Mohammad-Taqi Bahar
Dariush Eghbali
Gholam-Hossein Banan
Sima Bina
Delkash
Hossein Khaje Amiri
Mirza Abdollah Farahani
Morteza Hannaneh
Kayhan Kalhor
Kamkarha
Ruhollah Khaleghi
Mohammad Reza Lotfi
Javad Maroofi
Marzieh
Mohammad Mousavi
Mohsen Namjoo
Shahram Nazeri
Parisa
Abolhasan Saba
Mohammad Shams
Homayoun Shajarian
Mohammad-Reza Shajarian
Hossein Tehrani
Alinaghi Vaziri
Parviz Yahaghi
Jalal Zolfonun
Mahmoud Zoulfonoun
Zyriab
Parviz Meshkatian
Axiom of Choice
Farhad Fakhreddini
Morteza Hannaneh
Zohreh Jooya
Ahmad Pejman
Ramin Rahimi

Great General

Abu Muslim Leader of the Persian upraising against Arabs.
Babak Khorram Din Leader of the Persian upraising against Arabs
Bozorgmehr Sage and Grand Vizier of Sasanids.
Amir-Kabir Grand Vizier.
Dr Talequani Heshmat Jangali leader and ally of Mirza Kuchek Khan.
Bagher Khan constitutionalist leader
Hosein Dadgar parliament speaker.
Ghaem Magham Farahani, prime minister
Abdol Hossein Mirza Farmanfarma, prime minister, multiple other roles.
Hassan-e-Sabbah, sectarian political leader.
Kaveh the Blacksmith, Legendary Leader and Liberator against the rule of Zahhak, an Arab king.
Maziar son of Karan,Leader of the Persian upraising against Arabs.
Mirza Kuchek Khan, constitutionalist leader of Guilan.
Mirza Reza Kermani, assassinated Nasereddin Shah.
Mohammad Khiabani, popular leader during Constitutionalist Revolution.
Mostowfi ol-Mamalek, Prime Minister.
Fazlollah Noori, conservative clergy opposing Constitunalists, hanged.
Nosrat Dowleh Firouz Mirza, provincial governor.
Colonel Pesian
Mahmud Khan Puladeen, senior military general.
Safi-ad-din Ardabili, Spiritual founder of Safavid dynasty.
Sattar Khan, constitutionalist leader.
Mirza Mehdi Khan Astarabadi, Nader Shah's Chief Minister.

In BOLD : Actually lived under Safavid reign

*Too lazy to italic or to research more
*Sorry if all of them already on the list

 

[Leoreth]

Great persons should really be between 4-8 or else you would see only the first ones anyway. The hard part of coming up with GP is often not to find the names, but to filter out the most significant ones.

 

[Linkman226]

Thank you, Ben, but I was only looking for 1501 onwards.

 

[J. pride]

I dont think Damascus should be preplaced in 3000 Ad but here is my plan for 600 ad :

-Remove Antioch and add Damaskos in its place as a preplaced Byzantine City.

.

Since Damascus was added several other changes have to be made. Many of the resources are out of Damascus reach so I moved the sheep one tile down and moved the copper from Cyprus to Antiochs spot. (its not like copper is needed there in 600ad anyways). Oh, i also added a clam on the coast of Trabezon to componsate for the sheep.

 

[SouthernKing]

The Canada thing was a joke.

As for Damascus, I think we should keep it out of 3000 BC, due to the Phoenecian spawn, but yeah, perhaps it could work for a preplaced Byzantine city.

 

[Yoshiegg737]

The Canada thing was a joke.

As for Damascus, I think we should keep it out of 3000 BC, due to the Phoenecian spawn, but yeah, perhaps it could work for a preplaced Byzantine city.

Really? I wouldn't mind Canada