Should the US be a Dictatorship?

[GoodEnoughForMe]

Consider this part 3 of the “Should the…?” series of enlightened discussion.

Trump has unilaterally declared all grant funding via the federal government - with a couple exceptions - as officially frozen tonight at 5pm. After starting with specifically freezing foreign aid, he has now incorporated all government programs.

This is 3 trillion dollars in funding that puts a stop to everything from foreign aid, housing vouchers, school lunches, medicare, children’s health insurance, maternal health programs, cancer treatment, infrastructure projects, clean water testing, suicide hotlines, people keeping ISIS militants behind bars, and more.

A couple sources: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/donald-trump-grants-loans-freeze_n_67984689e4b00dc186534c4f/amp

https://www.cnn.com/2025/01/27/politics/white-house-pauses-federal-grants-loan-disbursement/index.html

My job falls under a federal grant, and as of 5pm tonight, myself and many others are officially not being paid to do the woke work of stopping children from dying in their first 18 months on the planet.

My question to you; is this all worth it in order to pursue a dictatorship? Is usurping the purse strings entirely from congress a decisive final blow against the forces of Marxism and community support? How many children should die to support conservatism? Please discuss!

 

[Senethro]

I do hope that the Democrat establishment learns the cost of losing and that things actually matter. Nor is it inevitable that you will get your turn again at managing the decline in 5 years time.

 

[Ordnael]

Sometimes your system of governance is just too alien too me.
Parliamentary democracy's might take more time to get a job done but as far as I know a PM can't just freeze funds on stuff supported by a country budget because he felt like it.
He has to bring that "idea" to Parliament, hope he has a majority on his side that can pass such a resolution into law and then the head of state, a President, has to promulgate such law into effect, and even if there's no constitution block in place that may block such a law the whole process will still take a couple of months at best if the President agrees to promulgate such law otherwise it may take a whole year or more.
Doesn't your Justice system has a say on such impactful resolutions? We have a Constitution Tribunal that checks resolutions like that to see if they fit or not our Constitution, if not then such a resolution is promptly dismissed.

 

[Snowygerry]

A national strike is obviously the only reasonable response, try that here and Brussels would burn, don't be so servile and downtrodden, grow a pair

 

[KMRblue1027]

I said this in the main thread but the scope of this is nuts. About 10% if US GDP just got frozen outright.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

Sometimes your system of governance is just too alien too me.
Parliamentary democracy's might take more time to get a job done but as far as I know a PM can't just freeze funds on stuff supported by a country budget because he felt like it.
He has to bring that "idea" to Parliament, hope he has a majority on his side that can pass such a resolution into law and then head of state, a President, has to promulgate such law into effect, and even if there's no constitution block in place that may block such a law the whole process will still take a couple of months at best if the President agrees to promulgate such law otherwise it may take a whole year or more.
Doesn't your Justice system has a say on such impactful resolutions? We have a Constitution Tribunal that checks resolutions like that to see if they fit or not our Constitution, if not then such a resolution is promptly dismissed.

Parliamentary governments actually act faster than our legislature in general, they are certainly more agile and responsive to public interest.

This kind of declaration is blatantly unconstitutional. Trump has no legal pathway to this. It is roughly the equivalent of Starmer skipping your explanation/scenario and saying he gets to decide unilaterally what government spending is allowed and what isn’t starting now, and the rest of parliament can all go home and not work any more. Obviously a laughable declaration on the face of it, but that is the point we are at. We have no constitutional order if this stands.

 

[Archon8]

Parliamentary governments actually act faster than our legislature in general, they are certainly more agile and responsive to public interest.

This kind of declaration is blatantly unconstitutional. Trump has no legal pathway to this. It is roughly the equivalent of Starmer skipping your explanation/scenario and saying he gets to decide unilaterally what government spending is allowed and what isn’t starting now, and the rest of parliament can all go home and not work any more. Obviously a laughable declaration on the face of it, but that is the point we are at. We have no constitutional order if this stands.

Impoundment is most certainly not unconstitutional, but it does violate The Impoundment Control Act of 1974.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

Impoundment is most certainly not unconstitutional, but it does violate The Impoundment Control Act of 1974.

There are statutes and contracts here already awarded. This is not “impoundment” in the traditional sense. This is Kendall v US on steroids. Blatantly unconstitutional.

 

[r16]

it is supposed to come to Barron or whatever his name being the replacement . So , this is , like , not a dictatorship .

but yes , who holds the money controls things . Oppose and get crushed . No use will come from the Democrats for sure .

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Sometimes your system of governance is just too alien too me.

It's downright chaotic. I have no idea how they manage to get anything done, if one person can throw everything out of kilter like this, just on a whim.

He's an absolute lunatic, and they've given him the keys to pretty much everything. Please tell me that doesn't include the nukes.

Parliamentary democracy's might take more time to get a job done but as far as I know a PM can't just freeze funds on stuff supported by a country budget because he felt like it.
He has to bring that "idea" to Parliament, hope he has a majority on his side that can pass such a resolution into law and then the head of state, a President, has to promulgate such law into effect, and even if there's no constitution block in place that may block such a law the whole process will still take a couple of months at best if the President agrees to promulgate such law otherwise it may take a whole year or more.

The way it works here is that legislation is tabled, discussed, voted on, and is sent on to the Senate. The Senate can discuss it, amend it and send it back to the House, or pass it. The Governor-General has the final say. They usually pass it, but could opt not to if there's something egregiously unconstitutional about it. And even then the Supreme Court often gets a say if there's a challenge (ie. if something in the legislation constitutes a violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms).

If the legislation is a money bill and it's defeated, the government falls and an election is called.


I guess the RCMP had better set up on Roxham Road again. Anyone trying to cross had better dress warmly, since we still have at least 2-3 more months of winter. They just fenced off a portion of the border between Washington and BC that had been fairly open.


Actually, how absolutely nuts does he have to get before anyone does something to stop him? How much of this is actually legal?

 

[Archon8]

Actually, how absolutely nuts does he have to get before anyone does something to stop him? How much of this is actually legal?

He's fulfilling campaign promises. Nothing he's doing is a surprise to people who actually watched his campaign speeches. He was popularly elected and will fulfill the mandate given to him by the American people. Something I found rather amusing is when he threatened Canada with tariffs and Justin Trudeau raced to Mar-a-Lago to bend the knee, and Trump insulted him by saying Canada should be the 51st state. Then a couple weeks later, Trudeau resigned as PM. If I was Canadian I'd be embarrassed my leader was so weak.

 

[Lexicus]

Everyone who supports what Trump is doing now needs to be put in a camp when this regime falls

 

[r16]

super powerful leader the foreigners must respect is such a big part of the deal , too . Works even for regional powers and stuff . Next step likely to be Trump collecting the American flag card laid on the ground to place leaders for a group photograph at some summit . The Turkish flag is being collected from the ground in some heroic act that's celebrated for a decade or whatever . True power being they not putting it on the ground after the first time .

do not give them stuff about the fall from power . They do not intend to fall ; will make it to the other side ; theg are going to scare supporters about the gas chambers they will suffer if they stop voting Trump .

 

[banzay13]

Well, you know. It's DOGE time))

Edit. The United States cannot afford to print money without restrictions, have you seen the public debt? If we talk about children ... well, the printed so much money, distributing (smearing) dollars inflation around the world - and if for Americans it is just the inability to buy another additional burgher, then for people from poor countries is the need to refuse meat at all. And somewhere leads to wars. Recall the Arab spring, for example. Here is one example from the Russian Federation. Just two weeks ago, here people discussed Armenia’s monetary assistance for the organization of free hot dinners in Armenia schools. Despite the fact that Armenia openly claims to strengthen cooperation with NATO and the EU. Naturally, people were unhappy with this fact, taking into account that in the Donbass this money is more necessary. I think that there are a lot of similar assistance programs in the United States. Hence the desire to reconsider their effectiveness. DOGE
Edit 2. It's a lot of work to do, not sure doge or whatever can handle with it

 

[Verbose]

.

He's fulfilling campaign promises. Nothing he's doing is a surprise to people who actually watched his campaign speeches. He was popularly elected and will fulfill the mandate given to him by the American people. Something I found rather amusing is when he threatened Canada with tariffs and Justin Trudeau raced to Mar-a-Lago to bend the knee, and Trump insulted him by saying Canada should be the 51st state. Then a couple weeks later, Trudeau resigned as PM. If I was Canadian I'd be embarrassed my leader was so weak.

Well, yes... And the implications was always that he would effectively suspend the US constitution and rule by fiat. And all warnings to that effects from opponents to the Trumpian agenda was poh-pooed and hand-waved away as exaggerrations and smear attempts.

Given that, the Republican agenda now should be to de facto suspend the US constitution and have Trump rule by fiat. Which would constitute a revolution from the top down.

It seems it is going to have to be only de facto, at least for now, since the US fetisch over the constitution still precludes actually disbanding it. Otherwise the logical next step in this situation would be for the Republican majority in all chambers to simply award Trump the task of drafting a new constitution for the US. Things like that have happened before, just not in the US.

 

[Kaitzilla]

Sometimes your system of governance is just too alien too me.
Parliamentary democracy's might take more time to get a job done but as far as I know a PM can't just freeze funds on stuff supported by a country budget because he felt like it.
He has to bring that "idea" to Parliament, hope he has a majority on his side that can pass such a resolution into law and then the head of state, a President, has to promulgate such law into effect, and even if there's no constitution block in place that may block such a law the whole process will still take a couple of months at best if the President agrees to promulgate such law otherwise it may take a whole year or more.
Doesn't your Justice system has a say on such impactful resolutions? We have a Constitution Tribunal that checks resolutions like that to see if they fit or not our Constitution, if not then such a resolution is promptly dismissed.

Congress gradually farmed out most of their godlike power to subcontractors.

Lawyers and assistants write their laws now, the President declares wars, and an unaccountable bureaucracy rules with an iron fist.


However, someone told Trump the President is in charge of the executive branch, and now he is insisting on it.


Hopefully Congress takes 15 minutes to pass a law on this subject, give the President a 24 hour deadline so he doesn't just pocket veto it, and then ram it down his throat with another 2/3rds vote.

Courts love crystal-clear law that isn't unconstitutional because they don't have to do any work.

Next week they can impeach Trump, the week after that impeach Vance, and then the Leader of Congress, the Speaker, can be a President with a clue.

Edit

https://www.cnn.com/2025/01/27/politics/white-house-pauses-federal-grants-loan-disbursement/index.html

Grant and loan freeze: The White House budget office has ordered a pause on all federal grants and loans — to take effect at 5 p.m. today — which could impact trillions of dollars. It marks the latest move by President Donald Trump’s administration to exert control over federal funding, even that which has already been allocated by Congress

What?

The memo calls on agencies to submit to OMB “detailed information on any programs, projects or activities subject to this pause” by February 10.

What?!!!

Don't be vague with the word Trillion!

Don't have a 5pm deadline and a detailed report on what was actually affected 2 weeks later.
Do the detailed report 1st!

 

[EnglishEdward]

Well the democrats did decide to impeach him when he decided to suspend aid to Ukraine
to give their leadership time for them to answer a few of his questions about Hunter-Biden.

And I presume this current expenditure freeze is also part of his revenge.

 

[Ordnael]

More on the matter from Reuters

Trump orders pause to all federal grants and loans​

https://www.reuters.com/world/trump-orders-pause-all-federal-grants-loans-2025-01-28/

WASHINGTON, Jan 28 (Reuters) - Donald Trump's White House ordered a pause in all federal grants and loans starting on Tuesday, a sweeping decision that could disrupt education and health care programs, housing assistance, disaster relief and a host of other initiatives that depend on billions of federal dollars.
In a memo on Monday, the acting head of the Office of Management and Budget, which oversees the federal budget, said the money would be put on hold while the Trump administration reviews grants and loans to ensure they are aligned with the president's priorities, including executive orders he signed last week ending diversity, equity and inclusion (DEI) programs.

Matthew Vaeth, the acting director, said the use of federal resources for policies at odds with the president's agenda "is a waste of taxpayer dollars that does not improve the day-to-day lives of those we serve."
The memo said the freeze included any money intended "for foreign aid" and for "nongovernmental organizations," among other categories.
The White House said the pause would not impact Social Security or Medicare payments or "assistance provided directly to individuals." That would presumably spare food aid for the poor and disability payments, though it was not clear whether health care programs for veterans and low-income people would be affected.

The OMB memo asserted that the federal government spent nearly $10 trillion in fiscal year 2024, with more than $3 trillion devoted to financial assistance such as grants and loans. But the source of those figures was not clear - the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office estimated government spending in 2024 at a much lower $6.75 trillion.
The memo is the latest directive in the Trump administration's campaign to dramatically reshape the federal government, the nation's largest employer.

In a blizzard of executive actions last week, the new president shuttered all diversity programs, imposed a hiring freeze, sent national security officials home, ordered a pause in foreign aid and sought to strip away job protections from thousands of civil servants.
The spending freeze ordered by OMB takes effect at 5 p.m. ET (2200 GMT) on Tuesday. Agencies have until Feb. 10 to submit detailed information on any programs subject to the suspension.

DEMOCRATS CHALLENGE 'UNLAWFUL' MOVE​

The federal government provides money to a broad swath of nonprofits, many of which reacted with dismay.
"This order is a potential five-alarm fire for nonprofit organizations and the people and communities they serve," Diane Yentel, president & CEO of the National Council of Nonprofits, said in a statement. "From pausing research on cures for childhood cancer to halting food assistance, safety from domestic violence, and closing suicide hotlines, the impact of even a short pause in funding could be devastating and cost lives."

Democrats immediately challenged Trump's action as unlawful and dangerous.
In a letter to Vaeth late on Monday, U.S. Senator Patty Murray and U.S. Representative Rose DeLauro, the top Democrats on the congressional appropriation committees, said the order was "breathtaking, unprecedented, and will have devastating consequences across the country."
"We write today to urge you in the strongest possible terms to uphold the law and the Constitution and ensure all federal resources are delivered in accordance with the law,” the Democrats wrote.
Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer said the administration did not have the authority to halt spending that had been approved by Congress and that the order, if implemented, would harm millions of Americans.
"It will mean missed payrolls and rent payments and everything in between: chaos for everything from universities to non-profit charities, state disaster assistance, local law enforcement, aid to the elderly, and food for those in need," Schumer said in a post on X late on Monday.
U.S. Representative Tom Emmer, the No. 3 Republican in the House of Representatives, said Trump was simply following through on his campaign promises.
"You need to understand he was elected to shake up the status quo. That is what he's going to do. It's not going to be business as usual," Emmer told reporters at a Republican policy retreat in Miami.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

Without giving away too much detail, the federal agency that oversees our program has gone completely dark, so we can’t even get any questions/communications/anything answered. Nothing. Flying completely blind.

 

[r16]

you are going to be ruled by decree . At some point in 2018 or so when this Presidential System with Advanced Democracy started here and ı might be wrong about the numbers but not the essence , of some 32 decrees each with the power of laws passed by the Parliament , 17 or so fixed the wrongs discovered with the other 15 , like in a month or whatever . If in a management position , know your laws and act accordingly . The laws might be thrown out , it is best to follow them .