Single Player bugs and crashes - After the 24th of February 2014

[strategyonly]

Another thing: I noticed when I updated my SVN and did a recalc that the fog-of-war came back. But the next turn it's gone again - almost everything I explored last turn I can still see, even if I'm no longer anywhere near it.

This has been the case for some time.

ETA: And now I notice that all the kelp has disappeared from my map. How the hell can this happen? This makes 7234 unplayable for me.

Do a clear cache and see if it still persists. I dont see this happening to my stuff, sorry.
And pls no need for yelling at modders, thx. Thats what DH is for!!

 

[Yudishtira]

Okay here is a save. The catamaran Quezon Cherub is WNW (aka 2W1N) of Taranaki, which is about 4th city from the top of my west coast. It has Transport I. Try to put any unit from Taranaki on it - or take my word for it that you can't.

I would understand (grudgingly) if you said this was intentional. However, I think an explanation of how Transport I works with the new promos would then be in order. I have a unit with Transport People, and that gives it a cargo space for non-units, ie. without it needing Transport I as well.

Do a clear cache and see if it still persists. I dont see this happening to my stuff, sorry.
And pls no need for yelling at modders, thx. Thats what DH is for!!

I wasn't yelling (as it happens I thought about caps and decided against). I apologize if someone made a mistake and feels yelled at. If someone did this on purpose otoh (the kelp this is), someone should yell at them impo...

 

[JosEPh_II]

Size Matters off. I started this save in v29. SVN 7234. This problem was not in 7106, even though the new transport promos were already there then.

Also on 7234, possibly somehow related, my galleons now have 12 cargo spaces, and cogs have 8, so all doubled up. This is also new since 7106.

I'll try to upload a save in the next 24 hours, if you still need one.

I too have noticed the extra cargo spaces. But I'm not sure when it occurred.

And I'm not yelling either.

JosEPh

 

[Faustmouse]

They are not forts so putting units on them doesn't change ownership in the same way as moving onto a pasture does not change ownership.

edit Latest SVN the forest graphic is wrong. Before it was varied and that included a variation by climate. Now they are all the same.

is there a reason WHY they are not forts? Graphics can stay and I think with superfort culture, range, zoc etc can all be manipulated.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Size Matters off. I started this save in v29. SVN 7234. This problem was not in 7106, even though the new transport promos were already there then.

Also on 7234, possibly somehow related, my galleons now have 12 cargo spaces, and cogs have 8, so all doubled up. This is also new since 7106.

I'll try to upload a save in the next 24 hours, if you still need one.

Another thing: I noticed when I updated my SVN and did a recalc that the fog-of-war came back. But the next turn it's gone again - almost everything I explored last turn I can still see, even if I'm no longer anywhere near it.

This has been the case for some time.

ETA: And now I notice that all the kelp has disappeared from my map. How the hell can this happen? This makes 7234 unplayable for me.

The doubling of cargo space was an unfortunate problem introduced for units in play before a recent adjustment of the way cargo space was accounted for. There was good cause for the change and new units should not continue to have double cargo space. It's one of those unfortunate glitches that can sometimes be unavoidable due to the fact that there is not currently any unit recalculation process - something I do intend to remedy at some point soon.

Okay here is a save. The catamaran Quezon Cherub is WNW (aka 2W1N) of Taranaki, which is about 4th city from the top of my west coast. It has Transport I. Try to put any unit from Taranaki on it - or take my word for it that you can't.

I would understand (grudgingly) if you said this was intentional. However, I think an explanation of how Transport I works with the new promos would then be in order. I have a unit with Transport People, and that gives it a cargo space for non-units, ie. without it needing Transport I as well.


I wasn't yelling (as it happens I thought about caps and decided against). I apologize if someone made a mistake and feels yelled at. If someone did this on purpose otoh (the kelp this is), someone should yell at them impo...

The loss of kelp MIGHT have been an odd consequence of the 'clean' disabling of the multi-feature mod. Compilers were undecided as to whether it should be disabled, not disabled, using the code designed for when it is disabled or not... it was creating some serious bugs and shouldn't have been based on the coding itself so I could not see it being anything but a compiler bug. Since it was apparently being currently disabled (and nobody has answered my question as to why) I just made sure it was done in a way that the compiler has no confusion on the matter.

If I'm not mistaken, I've also seen kelp disappear from plots ever since it was introduced... I THINK there's something of a process to that but I'm not sure if it's intended or not.


Your save should be useful in determining what the problem is. I have a suspicion... Is the unit that has the promotion on it one that has a definition a to what sort of units it can normally transport or is it one that cannot normally transport at all? If it's not one that can normally transport units at all, perhaps it shouldn't be able to have the promo yet and it's got a hollow cargo space that isn't properly designated thus it doesn't work... aka if the promo was assigned when it shouldn't have legally been able to be then perhaps it was supposed to remove the promo but won't because the prerequisite asks to make sure the unit has what the promotion gives it... I dunno - just theorizing here. It'll be a little bit of a puzzle to figure out I'm sure.

You're not having trouble with ships that are newly built that have defined base cargo space not being able to take on any units do you? I dunno I'll look into the whole thing in your save of course.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

The loss of kelp MIGHT have been an odd consequence of the 'clean' disabling of the multi-feature mod. Compilers were undecided as to whether it should be disabled, not disabled, using the code designed for when it is disabled or not... it was creating some serious bugs and shouldn't have been based on the coding itself so I could not see it being anything but a compiler bug. Since it was apparently being currently disabled (and nobody has answered my question as to why) I just made sure it was done in a way that the compiler has no confusion on the matter.

If the multi-feature function has been disabled this may cause problems with some of the Python that uses its functions to add and remove specific features from a plot while leaving others there. I would need to look at the python to be sure.

If I'm not mistaken, I've also seen kelp disappear from plots ever since it was introduced... I THINK there's something of a process to that but I'm not sure if it's intended or not.

We fixed this when 0100010 reviewed and changed the improvements etc. Kelp and Sea Grass should not be disappearing any more.

Btw I still have all my kelp on my map but I may not have done a recalc on my last play.

 

[Thunderbrd]

If the multi-feature function has been disabled this may cause problems with some of the Python that uses its functions to add and remove specific features from a plot while leaving others there. I would need to look at the python to be sure.



We fixed this when 0100010 reviewed and changed the improvements etc. Kelp and Sea Grass should not be disappearing any more.

Btw I still have all my kelp on my map but I may not have done a recalc on my last play.

Yeah I don't know why we were disabling the multi-feature code - I was hoping you'd know. But it wasn't disabling fully and was kinda on at times and not at other times and that was obviously a bigger problem. On or off I don't care so much as it is firmly one or the other. And if it causes problems now being off then those spots may need to be identified so that it can be made possible to function correctly whether it's on or not. I suppose in Python that's much more difficult since this isn't setup as a gameoption but as an #ifdef and I don't know if you have any capacity to utilize that sort of thing in py and it wouldn't be subservient to whether defined in the code or not. Come to think of it python may be one of the reasons the definition becomes vague in the dll. I dunno... just a theory.

Maybe we should ask AIAndy why it was disabled. If it should be ENabled then I don't mind reversing the commenting out process on it all. Just need to know where it's supposed to stand.



@Yudishtira: I did a little digging in the code alone and it looks like if your unit doesn't have any sort of definition at all as to what TYPES of units it can transport, it is no longer ABLE to transport - and yes that makes for a backdoor disabling of the promotion on the unit until you get a promotion on it that defines the 'type' of unit it can transport. Units should currently not be able to get a generic Transport I promo unless they actually currently have any transport capability and all units that have this to begin with should also have definition as to what types of units they can transport. So this shouldn't continue to be a problem.

I COULD create a 'fix' (more of a patch for games displaying this version fracture) that removes the promo if the unit has somehow managed to get it when it shouldn't have but the question becomes is it important enough to do so? What do you think?

Now all this is said by simply reviewing the coding and reminding myself of some of the intended dynamics. However, I'll still gladly take a look at the game itself, particularly if you are able to ensure that the promo was somehow added to the unit AFTER the revision that created this 'bug' scenario. If it could qualify at that point it shouldn't have been able to.

 

[Yudishtira]

Catamarans cannot normally carry any units. The units got the promo back in v29. In SVN7106 (ie. early post-v34) it was still working.

Weirdly enough, it is still working on my sloops, which also do not normally have cargo space. Problem is only on Cats, Frigates and possibly Carracks, although no other types have been tested. I have no sloops of war or brigantines with the promo, and I haven't needed to use the capacity on any caravels or other ships lately.

The mouseover in all cases shows that they have cargo space(s), but no units can make use of them.

Sorry for the inconvenience, but I personally do think they (ie. my units) deserve a patch, if you don't think their promo will ever work again. This save is a year old, played almost constantly for that time, and it is clearly my best and maybe only chance of seeing the industrial and later eras.

ETA Just confirming that promo on carrack doesn't work.

 

[Thunderbrd]

I just took a look at the Sloop:

			<DomainCargo>DOMAIN_LAND</DomainCargo>
			<iCargo>0</iCargo>

While not having any base cargo it DOES have a base cargo type definition (land units not further defined).

Whereas, Carracks, for example, have no cargo nor cargo type definition:

			<SpecialCargo>NONE</SpecialCargo>
			<DomainCargo>NONE</DomainCargo>
			<iCargo>0</iCargo>

So this is at least confirming to the theory. (BTW, why did we decide that Carracks wouldn't be able to carry any units when the whole point of their vanilla counterparts was to fill the role of a Caravel that COULD transport land units like settlers to the new worlds before any other old world civilizations?)

As for a patch... they'd be able to select a promo that adds a cargo space AND a type definition if they had to retrain from losing the Transport I promo right?

It's easy enough to build a check into canKeep but it won't necessarily BE checked against canKeep until the unit promotes again. At that point it'll right itself by causing you to lose the Transport I promo and giving you then the option to train another promo - such as one that opens up the unit's ability to transport a particular unit type again.

Anything deeper than that will have to wait until unit recalculation which is a very very very major project and one to take the utmost of care with.

 

[strategyonly]

@ Sparth


Here are some more PINK btns missing

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I mentioned earlier that the forest terrain feature is not working correctly. It still isnt. Also the wrong icons are showing up for units for example the Tribe icon is being displayed instead of the Settler icon in the city bar and the dll popup list of what to do next.

edit Loading a game with the new SVN I get the following error.

I think it may be possible to get more than the national limit of a unit when you buy them from other nations.

 

[C2CPlayer]

So for some reason the city/building button major lag is persisting to the latest update 7250, i reverted back to 7207 and it is back to normal, anyone got any ideas to share on this? It's pretty much making my game unplayable. also fyi i have the custom civs and custom leader heads reverted to 7207 when i was playing the 7250 version of my game. Is that causing it? I need the civs and leader heads though or else all the art and civs in my game would be gone and make it unplayable.

 

[C2CPlayer]

So i narrowed it down to either Python, res, XML, C2C1.fpk, or the coredll. I'll update as i narrow it down.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

is there a reason WHY they are not forts? Graphics can stay and I think with superfort culture, range, zoc etc can all be manipulated.

I can't remember at the moment. I've moved them into core so you could play with them if you like.

edit If the Sparticus unit wins against a wild animal sometimes a gladiator is trained. Is this supposed to happen?

edit 2 Egyptian Warlord Chief unit has a red blob in it.

 

[Yudishtira]

I think it may be possible to get more than the national limit of a unit when you buy them from other nations.

You can certainly get more by capturing them. What's the limit on Asatru Missionaries? I think I have 31...

Does that cause a problem? I agree you should not be able to buy them beyond your limit, but capturing them seems okay imo...

 

[Sparth]

@ Sparth


Here are some more PINK btns missing

Which civilization you playin?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Which civilization you playin?

Sorry Egyptian, it is after my bed time.

 

[Sparth]

Sorry Egyptian, it is after my bed time.

I know you playing Egyptians
im asking SO

 

[Thunderbrd]

I mentioned earlier that the forest terrain feature is not working correctly. It still isnt. Also the wrong icons are showing up for units for example the Tribe icon is being displayed instead of the Settler icon in the city bar and the dll popup list of what to do next.

edit Loading a game with the new SVN I get the following error.

I think it may be possible to get more than the national limit of a unit when you buy them from other nations.

That's always been the case.

Are you playing with the debug dll on purpose or is it sitting in as the core dll on the SVN right now??

 

[strategyonly]

I know you playing Egyptians
im asking SO

Zapotec

@ TB

I have ON automated worker leaves old improvements, but he is still building forts??? I believe thats all he is building on the resources now, I dont like the forts in the industrial era. It drive me crazy when ALL these forts are taken over by the enemy, and like 6 every turn with these sound takeovers.