Filled Emp in on latest KISS chat
fe3333au: while we wait here is what we spoke about
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=3187877#post3187877 ... and also what whomp sent us via PM
Nuts Offer
KC Venters has entered the room.
KC Venters: hi guys
EmperorNapoloen: hey hey
fe3333au: Basically Nuts have contacted Emp
KC Venters: yeah? ... how'd it go
fe3333au: they want to trade with us
KC Venters: what?
fe3333au: so they are really playing the two edged sword game ... they just contacted Emp
KC Venters: smart on their part
KISS discussion about Masonry
fe3333au: But whomp and I spoke eariler ... about possibilities ... We have Masonry
KC Venters: we saw that
fe3333au: BUT ... I feel uncomfortable with Nuts approaching us behine your back
Emp (The White and Gold Throne) and Robi chat ... happening simultaneously
EmperorNapoloen:
Rob says: same old same old, TNT offered us an interesting peace settlement.
The White and Gold Throne says: let me think, surrender all cities and become sattalite nation?
Rob says: pretty much. basically if we give them all our techs, gold and workers every 20 turns they wont try to kill us, lol
KC Venters: oh my =-O
EmperorNapoloen: Classic Provo
Back to Musings
fe3333au: Whomp was saying we could trade with Nuts direct to get HBR
Rob says: ok, no probs we can discuss the details soon, but we would be happy to work around deals with Lit or MM. How are things with KISS, hope there not giving you to much trouble
The White and Gold Throne says: things are ok, how about with your little war over there
Full Implications Starting to Sink In
fe3333au: far out ... how you feel about that Tubby?
KC Venters: that'll be fine. Then it would look more legitamite to give you guys CoL
fe3333au: but were you aware of Nuts approaching us?
KC Venters: What is Robi talking about "work around deals with Lit or MM"? ... no ... is he online now?
fe3333au: Seems they are trying to be puppet masters ... I think he is
KC Venters: trying
The White and Gold Throne says: heh, do you think you will win? ... and rid us of that silly man provo
Rob says: i would say its 50-50, there immorals are powerful but there a big disance between us so our MW's extra MP balances it out
Rob says: should be interesting
Revisit KISS/Nut Deal
fe3333au: My question to Whomp was are you going to honour Republic swap ... cos our concerns were that Nuts are getting more out of the whole swapping scenario ... now even more so ... They end up with tech support vs TNT and rule the continent
KC Venters: REpublic swap with whom? ... you guys yes
fe3333au: KISS and Nuts
KC Venters: D'nut I don't think that we ahve a deal worked out yet ... dunno though ... let me check
fe3333au: And if we get HBR ... how does that help you since I assume we will gift each other stuff as we go
The White and Gold Throne says: tell me, for trade reasons, do you want techs or money
Rob says: we are looking at a tech swap, like for example if you guys did MM we would swap mason+maths for it.
Rob says: both would be handy for you guys when the gallics come knocking ... there are other possiblities as well
KC Venters: If they truely are at war then we could in reality cut off D'nut and make it on our own
EmperorNapoloen: ha
bawhomp has entered the room.
KC Venters: so they are trying to trade you for techs that they are supposed to research?
bawhomp: this is a motley crew
KC Venters: whomp, (hi btw) what is our deal with the nuts?
fe3333au: Can you read what has gone on previously Whomp?
bawhomp: no
KC Venters: no he can't but I'll send it to him
Recap
fe3333au: OK Nuts have approached us to do a deal fro MM and Lit
bawhomp: Our discussion was to have them get hbr ... of course they did
fe3333au: In other words they are trying to manipulate both of us
bawhomp: right
Rob says: like a Lit-CoL plus others, in the end if we work together we both come out on top
EmperorNapoloen: interesting
bawhomp: indeed
KC Venters: you guys effectively have CoL already ... just ask and it's on its way
Rob says: like a Lit-CoL plus others, in the end if we work together we both come out on top
Options to get better Deals
fe3333au: Nuts they are unaware of our relationship ... which is good
... how can we manipulate Nuts?
bawhomp: OK what's the solution? Do you say construction?
KC Venters: I'm tempted to say, let's (MIA-KISS) not trade at all with the other continent ... they'd fall behind quickly
fe3333au: I'm tempted that way as well ... and onlt trade tech for tech
bawhomp: well we'd really like donut to research those techs for us.
KC Venters: but they are trying to trade MIA for techs we wanted them to research
fe3333au: But they are getting the best of both deals ... I would say MIA do not trade with them ... but not my desicion
bawhomp: they asked us to research them as well ... after republic.
Rob says: since we both have neighbours with aggressive anc. uu's, you can expect them to use them, so every little bit help, especially if we can get into med times quickly, then it cancels their advantage
Rob says: anyway i have to get back to work, so you guys have a think about it, you know where to find us
Robi Signed Off ... Let's Debrief and Plan
EmperorNapoloen: OOO ... hehe
fe3333au: I never trusted Nuts
KC Venters: Emp. next time ask him how aggressive a Mounted Warrior is ... What a dork
bawhomp: The best of the best ... with great traits
KC Venters: MW's are people's choice when playing PBEMs
Settle Down Boys
fe3333au: so where does this leave us? ... you still republic swap with them ... but add a clause that they will break due to agreement with us
bawhomp: They asked us to research those techs so...
KC Venters: that's good
fe3333au: could word it to no future agreements with other teams
KC Venters: We can tell them that if we find them helping you then it will nullify any of our agreements ... then they will think that we are coming after you
fe3333au: and then just before you are to give Republic say ... Oh we just been talking to MIA and ... middle finger
KC Venters: tee hee
bawhomp: i hate breaking a deal.
Honour is Binding at least for KISS
KC Venters: me too but it would be funny
bawhomp: we may have to tell them to jump in a lake and trade lit and maps with them
fe3333au: Me too ...
Other Options
fe3333au: what other solution MIA not trade with them ... and then you say you got Masonry but cannot give to them cos they got nothing you want
bawhomp: no republic deal ... they research with you instead of us.
bawhomp: we still give republic to you ultimately .... we couldn't do a deal for masonry so all bets are off
fe3333au: any thoughts Emp?
bawhomp: then they get lit and maps but no republic ... bad deal ... for them
fe3333au: so MIA trade with them and KISS get p(i)ssed off
bawhomp: zactly
KC Venters: then we can get a discount since they have to make nice again
fe3333au: and we get pissed off cos they got deal with you
bawhomp: zactly ... they can't play us ... no soup for them
More Deal Options ... But getting Close to a Plan
fe3333au: so we give Masonry ... for HBR
KC Venters: we don't have HBR yet
bawhomp: to donut
fe3333au: but you get it as part of your deal ... or can you meet with Nuts and concrete a deal
bawhomp: we have no deal ... if they are dealing with you then we have no deal ... and vice versa ... it's one or the other.
fe3333au: cos I prefer you getting techs from them ... and if they double dip ... then that is bad faith to you ... which is a legit deal breaker
bawhomp: we have no deals ... nothing signed so it's either we give them your deal or ours ... Yours is the better deal for us.
fe3333au: I see ... you prefer MIA to make a Masonry for HBR ... MM for Currancy ... Lit for the other one
bawhomp: then they don't get republic
fe3333au: and we do
bawhomp: riiiight
KC Venters: we can say that we traded all of those techs for Repubby
bawhomp: riiiight
KC Venters: + CoL and Philo
fe3333au: thet is very interesting ...
bawhomp: and to think they thought of it not us.
fe3333au: So we get Philo from you anyway and CoL ...
bawhomp: because you wouldn't trade us a fair deal on masonry we couldn't do it.
Finally The Deal
bawhomp: ok here's the deal ... we couldn't get masonry for a fair price in time.
KC Venters: So someone summarize what the plan is
fe3333au: whomp is
bawhomp: so no deal.
fe3333au: yep
bawhomp: you have masonry and they go maths currency while you go map make and lit ... plus hbr
bawhomp: masonry, lit and map make for hbr, maths and currency ... we trade republic for all of your techs and philo and col ... badabing badaboom
fe3333au: and they don't get Republic
bawhomp: riiiight
fe3333au: Which is a biggy
bawhomp: jumungous
fe3333au: yeah yeah yeah
bawhomp: yeah yeah yeah
TNT Musings
fe3333au: and maybe something can happen with TNT
bawhomp: yep ... they're pretty ancient though.
KC Venters: I have a hypothesis that TNT is going to get the Great Library and catch up in techs
bawhomp: you're deal has to be inked fast ... stupid
KC Venters: who me?
bawhomp: tnt
fe3333au: yeah
bawhomp: you're just smart stupid ... idiot civant...i say
fe3333au: I would be going for great Library ... he he he
bawhomp: just in time for our gallic swords to show up
KC Venters: and a couple of galleys over there would FREAK OUT tnt
Lies or Politics?
bawhomp: The BL is we even delay them saying we're working on masonry
fe3333au: nice ... which will show up just as happened with us and Writing !!!
bawhomp: Then we can get mad cuz they won't wait for us to do a deal for masonry
Map Making and Luxes
KC Venters: can MM be the first tech you guys research?
bawhomp: they are
fe3333au: we are ... been 1 turn
KC Venters: cuz trading luxes would be awesome
fe3333au: yes ...
apart from Wine ... what you got?
KC Venters: nothing else connected yet ... what luxes do you guys have?
fe3333au: Luxes ... half a piano ... he he he
Close Deal ASAP
bawhomp: So you need to close a deal with them and we delay our getting masonry .... it's tough on us you know.
fe3333au: Well according to Emp ... Robi will be getting back to him asap
bawhomp: well we'll get back to robi after we get masonry ... which won't happen till your deal is done.
Slow Turn Play Rate
bawhomp: delay for fe
fe3333au: If it is not much trouble for your team ... we are getting bogged under with the speed at which the game is progressing ... less than 24 hours is waaay too much
bawhomp: come on fe ... get it together man
KC Venters: We'll delay the save if we can ... people are anxious to play though
bawhomp: if bede says got it then let him play it.
fe3333au: I appreciate that ...
KC Venters: Gen W plays pretty quick
fe3333au: this weekend half team awol ... including Gen_W
KC Venters: I'm not playing if there's a 'got it' in the Dept. of Turnplay
Emp Summary
fe3333au: I will paste and edit tis conversation ... KISS recon that we get deal with Nuts ... and KISS will tell Nuts to f off ... so everyone gets the techs via trading
bawhomp: After they close a deal with you
fe3333au: but Nuts don't get Republic ... I guess there will be a civilised continent and a land in strife across the pond
bawhomp: see while they were working with you...you were holding off trading masonry to us hence we could not get the deal done
Masonry Source ... keeping Up Appearances
fe3333au: So did you tell Nuts you were approaching us for Masonry?
bawhomp: no we didn't say from who ... they assumed tnt
fe3333au: let them keep assuming that
bawhomp: who i still want to ask for it ... just to tell them to bugger off
fe3333au: exactly ...
bawhomp: I love this game
Eeewwww Horible Image
fe3333au: KISS and TNT sharing a matress :-D
EmperorNapoloen: hewhe
bawhomp: ewewww
fe3333au: Skippy and PWE fighting over blankets
bawhomp: gross
fe3333au: So does that seem like a good plan Emp?
bawhomp: did i say ewwwweeeh right?
fe3333au: I'm not from Califoria so don't know
bawhomp: whoa
fe3333au: I'm a simple mountain man
EmperorNapoloen: sounds good so fdar
fe3333au: If you want Emp I can summarise this chat in your thread?
bawhomp: so your deal must close quickly.
EmperorNapoloen: please do
It has been SIX days from the original contact with Emp ... and still no responce from the PMs that Ken has sent !!!
Every interaction with these guys is the same !!!! 
I find their diplomatic games unacceptible !! ... and almost to the stage of affrontal !!
Can we get some action with this team !?![[pissed]](/images/smilies/pissed.gif "Pissed [pissed]")
I suggest a very terse and unfriendly letter be sent indicating that we are not happy to be constantly left hanging in the air ... and if we do not receive some form of contact from them by next turn, we will consider that action an answer in itself !!!!
